dr. greanthumb's banana brandy

[greatlakesltnin]

ok ok dunder....im not much of a mathemattcal genius..i got it..i missed the 30 gal mark and just looked at the recipe.

[Beerswimmer]

Curious about the result of the bananas and molasses. I have been saving up fruit for a while, mostly bananas, and was thinking of adding some molasses to make it more like a rum than a brandy. ?

[Gamblor]

I am having a go at something similar to this right now.

I wanted it to be a more authentic banana brandy, so I decided to do it with bananas only, no sugar. I also substituted a cup of all-bran for yeast nutrients (which i do not have)

In the end I used:
26kg (57lb) of bananas (unpeeled weight)
3 tablespoons bread yeast
1 cup of all bran
all topped up in a 55L food safe plastic bin

I bought these bananas very slightly unripe and left them in my boot in the garage thinking I would let them ripen over the next few days. Imagine my surprise to find that all of them were ripe the next day, with some so ripe they were starting to slightly liquify and split! Such are the hot 30 degree days here. Peeling and pulping all of these bananas was messy and not fun.

I am expecting a lower than normal ABV since I didn't use sugar, the parent site claims bananas give approx 20% sugar by weight, but doesn't list whether this is peeled or unpeeled weight. The ferment took off quickly.

A few issues I ran into, which probably goes even for any ferment with bananas is that the thick banana mush cap that rises to the top takes up ALOT of space! My container actually severely overflowed (pushing the bin lid up) and I lost 5% or so of the banana pulp to this. I've had to push down and mix the cap frequently, 2-3 times a day to keep it down. Also the ferment seems to be happening very, very fast - I was hoping to distill it in two weeks time, but at this rate it might be faster. I am also having issues with the small fruit flies gathering around my ferment container. Bloody pests.

[frozenthunderbolt]

There's fair indication that banana skins contain some of the enzymes needed to convert starch to sugar, in homebrewing they are often left in, in banana wine as while the wine takes a long time to clear, the skins ensure it drops crystal clear.

Unless they are dodgy as hell and covered in spray, i woudl just wizz the whole lot next time arround and try that!

[drgreanthumb]

A paddle bit on a drill makes quick work of stirring the huge cape back in twice per day.

[hwy419]

I am also having issues with the small fruit flies gathering around my ferment container. Bloody pests.

Small whiskey glass + half full of vinegar + dab of dishwashing liquid = ded fruit flies

[natureboy68]

Haha! Just saw this on moonfakers...made it seem like they made banana brandy likety split! Who the heck would buy it for $100/gallon??

[drgreanthumb]

So I did another batch of this banana but changed the recipe a little. I was only able to get my hands on 40 lbs of bananas so I increased the sugar to 30 lbs. I also added 5 teaspoons of yeast energizer instead of 1. I got a specific gravity of 1.079 to start. I added a half of a jar of bakers yeast and let it ride. It took one month to fully ferment. (It was pretty chilly in the fermentation room so that's what slowed the fermentation process. It usually finishes in 2 weeks) I took the low wines from the first half run and added it to the second half then did a VERY SLOW keeper run. I kept a gallon of 130 proof. I was a little more conservative with my cuts and what i kept. After proofing ended up with a nice batch of 90 proof for a rainy day.

[WhiskeyBent190+]

Mod Edit...

[Mr Shine]

Mod Edit...

Please don't ruin all those bananas by using turbo yeast.

As for a banana wash, those 325 pounds have about 66 pounds of sugar in them (according to this chart: http://www.thefruitpages.com/contents.shtml" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow *). That said, you could do a 60 gallon ferment with just those bananas with no added sugar and have a 7.8% potential. If you have a 50 gallon fermentor, it's about 9.3% potential. Or you could add sugar and have two or more larger washes (is it a "must" if it's bananas?).

Just some things to figure out. But whatever you do, ditch the turbo yeast, please.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

* I don't know if that chart takes the peels into account for percentage of sugar, so it could be much less. BTW, let the bananas get very ripe if they aren't already.

[WhiskeyBent190+]

Cool...! All of my fermenting vessels are 35 gallons so I rekon I will break it down and put it into two fermenters. You got a particular "yeast" in mind that would work best? And what's your opinion on the "boiling/cooking" of the pulp/mash rather than just pulping and adding warm water with a sugar mix? I appreciate it! I just want things to be a close to "perfect" as I can get it! I really appreciate the info man!!!

[WhiskeyBent190+]

One more...! What have you found to be the best for "straining" all of the pulp off?

Thanks again my friend!

[Mr Shine]

You got a particular "yeast" in mind that would work best?

The recipe in the OP calls for 1118, which most around here use for fruit washes. I've also heard some talk about different Wyeast strains that help bring out banana esters. I'm no expert on this though. I'd probably use bakers yeast or some 1118 if it were me.

And what's your opinion on the "boiling/cooking" of the pulp/mash rather than just pulping and adding warm water with a sugar mix?

Cooking isn't necessary imo and will change the flavor. I wouldn't cook it if it were me, but half the fun of the hobby is in the experimentation, right?

Hth

[WhiskeyBent190+]

You got that right! Nothing like playing...! My problem is i like to play on a large scale...it hurts when things go "flop"! S*^% happens though!

Thanks man!

[WhiskeyBent190+]

Oh...! The "OP" stated 1/2 a jar... Lol... what does half a jar constitute?

[Mr Shine]

Oh...! The "OP" stated 1/2 a jar... Lol... what does half a jar constitute?

I meant the OP, as it in the first post four pages back. He used 5 packs of EC-1118.

It's been said that the amount of yeast you use doesn't really matter (within reason) when making ferments to be distilled. Under-pitch and it'll just take a little longer to start. Over-pitch and some might get cannibalized... either way, it's not a big deal.

As for "straining" the pulp off, I'm not sure what you mean. Just mash the bananas up real good, ferment "on the grain," let it work, and let the cap fall and let it clear... then siphon it off and distill it.

Or so I'm told.

If you had a different fruit that needed to have the skins and pits strained, I've seen a rat wire sieve used for that.

Hth

[WhiskeyBent190+]

10-4 I use a doubled-up window screen for everything else... I had allways heard NOT to have any of the fruit in the wash to distill.I have a tendency to try and get ALL the liquid out...hate to leave anything to go to waste! Anyway, I will check around for that particular yeast and I will certainly keep ya posted on the final product. I'm excited!!!

[WhiskeyBent190+]

Mod Edit...

[bigbone32]

Two posters in this thread mentioned enzymes while the OP did not. Is the sugar in the banana sugar or is it starch that needs converting? I assume its sugar and if so why would you need enzymes?

[WhiskeyBent190+]

Well, on the third week of fermentation now...headed for fourth and the "head" has still not fallen. I will be glad when it drops and i can get a little sample. It has fermented at a constant 68-70 degree temp... gotta be getting close I would think! Keep ya posted on the outcome.

[Wilson 55]

Two posters in this thread mentioned enzymes while the OP did not. Is the sugar in the banana sugar or is it starch that needs converting? I assume its sugar and if so why would you need enzymes?

It depends on how ripe the nanners are. Greener nanners contain starch that is naturally converted to sugar as they ripen.

[frozenthunderbolt]

Two posters in this thread mentioned enzymes while the OP did not. Is the sugar in the banana sugar or is it starch that needs converting? I assume its sugar and if so why would you need enzymes?

It depends on how ripe the nanners are. Greener nanners contain starch that is naturally converted to sugar as they ripen.

Yep. Enzyme is in the skin.

I've just started a similar batch 2.5kg of very ripe frozen and thawed banans with sugar and warm water added (shooting for a 10% wash) using an ale yeast. 2x 20 L Buckets have been going strong for about a week - caps havent dropped yet either.
Learnt from my last mistake and left the bananas chunky - first time I tried i blended them to smoothy that was next to impossible to filter - ended up throwing it out!

[dragonluvr_05]

Thinking about trying this, but 80lbs of nana's yikes!! so if i figured right to knock it down to a 5gal batch, 16lbs of banana's (from what i'm getting the riper the better) and 4lbs of sugar. if my math is wrong please correct me.

[frozenthunderbolt]

just doing a scaled 1.5run of this now.

Each 20L fermenter had 2.5kg of ripened, frozen, chopped, thawed bananas in it, 2.5 kg sugar some DAP and topped to 20L, heated the bananans skins and all inside their plastic buckets for about 3 H by using them as a coolant in my bath tub i use as a reserviour for the still's coolant.
Figured i might get a bit of conversion from the amalayse in the banana skins.
took about 3-4 weeks to ferment dry in my (cold) study.
Stripped everything out of one barrel yesterday and pitched it in with the other barrel that i'm running today - smells banana-ry as!
At one point though it smelt caramel-ish; like a good rum coming of the still (not in the heads either!) Very curious to taste and smell my way through the cuts on this one . . .

[xombie]

After reading these threads I was encouraged to try it myself. Unfortunately it didn’t come out as I was expecting. These are my 2 attempts.

First Try
about 40 bananas
4 packages of yeast (Lavin EC-1118)
12.5 lbs sugar
1 Campden tablet
2 tsp Pectic enzyme
top with water to a total volume of 7.5 gals

Added all the sugar to 4 gallons of 104 degree F water. I ran the bananas (no skins) in a blender with bits of warm water. Added the bananas to the water-sugar mix. Topped with water to 7.5 gals. Stirred. Added crushed Campden tablet and Pectic enzyme. Waited the required time for the Pectic enzyme (1 hour) and for the water temp to drop to 85-90 degrees F. Added yeast and aerated. Placed lid and air lock. Note: each of the sugar and bananas add a gallon in volume to the mix.
After the first night, the banana top raised up and spilled over (I have an 8-gal fermentor). This is because the CO2 from the fermentation rises that banana layer that forms on top of the water. Stirred mix every night and issue was gone by third night. Heavy fermentation happened for like 7 days. By day 9-10 the banana top had dropped to the bottom, I guess after being broken up by the Pectic enzyme and yeast. Distillation happened on day 15. Distilled the liquid (about 4 gals) without the banana which remained on the bottom of the fermentor. Used a pot with a reflux tower but in pot still mode (without running water through the reflux section and without the rashing). The foreshots had a delicious banana smell, but the rest was not impressive at all. The heads and mids had a rubbery taste and no banana flavor or smell. After a while I got frustrated and stopped the run.

Second Try
about 50 bananas
4 packages of yeast (Lavin EC-1118)
5 lbs sugar
1 Campden tablet
2 tsps Pectic enzyme
top with water to a total volume of 5 gals

I reduced the amount of sugar in this run thinking that during the first try the yeast got their fill from the readily available “sugars” from the sugar. Added all the sugar to 2.5 gallons of 104 degree F water. I ran the bananas (no skins) in a blender with bits of warm water. Added the bananas to the water-sugar mix. Topped with water to 5 gals. Stirred. Added crushed Campden tablet and Pectic enzyme. Waited the required time for the Pectic enzyme (1 hour) and for the water temp to drop to 85-90 degrees F. Added yeast and aerated. Placed lid and air lock.
Stirred mix every night. Heavy fermentation happened for like 7 days. By day 9-10 the banana top had dropped to the bottom. On day 14 added a 2-stage clearing agent which cleared the mash very nicely. Distilled 3 gals the next day. Used a pot with a reflux tower but in pot still mode again. And as before the foreshots had a delicious banana smell, but the rest was just bland, very weak in alcohol, and no banana flavor or smell. After 500 ml of mids the distill became watery and I stopped the run.

Thoughts: What am I doing wrong? The mash does have a nice banana flavor and smell. Are we wrong to expect a banana-rich spirit? Am I supposed to distill this 2 or 3 times? Am I using the wrong tower (I think so)? My next attempt will be with a traditional pot still head.

Note: I have had many runs of sugar-shine and they come out 175 proof, smooth, and slightly sweet.

[mrksbrd]

what type of yield are you getting (final product). I seem to be getting 2-2 1/2 gals out of 40 gal run of banana. Is this normal for a fruit based product?

[mrksbrd]

Two posters in this thread mentioned enzymes while the OP did not. Is the sugar in the banana sugar or is it starch that needs converting? I assume its sugar and if so why would you need enzymes?

Banana's create their own amylase enzyme during the ripening process, this can be sped up to break the starch down into sugar by adding powder based amylase and cooking the banana at 150 degrees then removing the heat. You will see the pulp become more of a thinner liquid form when the enzyme breaks down the starch

[xombie]

I get bit over a litter including heads, mids, and tails. No banana flavor so I mixed it all and made coffee liqueur.

From the web, "Add the Pectic Enzyme to the juice prior to the fermentation process in order to enhance the clarification process. The Pectic Enzyme destroys haze-causing pectin cells that can leave a wine with a permanent milky appearance known as a “pectin haze”. You can also add Pectic Enzyme to crushed fruit to increase the extraction of body and color from the pulp during the primary fermentation and pressing. All fruits have pectin and it’s the milky gel that holds a fruit’s fiber together, trapping the fruit’s character within. This is why we recommend using Pectic Enzyme any time you are dealing with fresh fruits. This Pectic Enzyme will allow the character of the fruit to be extracted into the wine." But all of those trying homemade banana wine recipes I've seen report only a slight banana taste.

[rad14701]

xombie, why not just try the original recipe and quit dicking around with the pectin and campden tablets...??? You're making a wash, not wine... Then run the wash in pure pot still mode... Ever think that maybe you're over-thinking the process...???

[frozenthunderbolt]

Mine turned out O.K.
Decent (if not screaming) banana flavour white, tasty but not bananary when oaked, and pretty fun when macerated with ripe bananas and caramel added to it.