Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by OtisT » Thu Aug 16, 2018 11:43 am

I understand folks are lovin this recipe white. I’m getting ready to try this recipe and will likely keep a small percentage white while putting most of it in a barrel. For those aging this on wood, what type of wood do you personally recommend for this recipe? I have the luxury of making my own barrels now, so I can make one to the specs I want.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by Swedish Pride » Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:04 am

I'd use used oak so not to overpower the flavours.
I've oaked some of the white, it's was too smooth, added in some heads and tails for complexity on my next run
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by OtisT » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:09 pm

Swedish Pride wrote:I'd use used oak so not to overpower the flavours.
I've oaked some of the white, it's was too smooth, added in some heads and tails for complexity on my next run
Thanks SP. I’ll keep your advice and experience in mind when I make cuts. On most runs I typically identify both where I would do a white cut and where I would do a barrel cut, then decide how to use it based on what I taste. I’ll likely set aside a few liters white and barrel the rest.

I have a med toast/charred barrel that has held some HBB sugar head for 9 months that’s the best I can do for a used barrel. (The SH spirit was oaked in jars for 8 months prior to going in that barrel.) The SH tastes fairly good now so I’ll likely bottle that and use that barrel if this Wheat/Oat/Rye whiskey turns out nice.

I have all my grains already and was hoping to start the ferment tomorrow, but I could not find any high temp enzymes at a few local brew stores. Just ordered some of the SEBStar Hxx online and hope to get this batch rolling in a week. I have never done a rye before and hear stories about how gelatinous that stuff is, so I don’t want to try my first batch of rye w/o the extra help of those enzymes. Wish me luck. ;-)

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by The Baker » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:11 pm

Swedish Pride wrote:I'd use used oak so not to overpower the flavours.
I've oaked some of the white, it's was too smooth, added in some heads and tails for complexity on my next run
I am going to have to do something like that with my brandy. Too smooth; well not really smooth but sort of insipid.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by dukethebeagle120 » Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:42 am

I may try this as a gin base.
What Do you all think
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by acfixer69 » Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:02 pm

It's a whisky recipe why turn it into a neutral. Why not use wheat alone.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by bentstick » Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:21 am

acfixer69 wrote:It's a whisky recipe why turn it into a neutral. Why not use wheat alone.
This was designed and trailed to be a white whisky,Neutral/Vodka would benefit much better taste wise(or void of) from just Wheat as AC pointed out,but as the hobby goes its your game do as ya see fit and report back.

Rye holds lots of flavor,and was I used it in this recipe. Cheers
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by Halfbaked » Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:41 pm

This recipe is wonderful as it is. It has character,taste and mouth feel. It is light and perfect for sipping white. If u are not getting what I am saying you are doing something differently than Bent is. Oak it, Well maybe but u will prob over power it and just taste the oaking. Strip it, if u want but there is so much going on here u be wasting your time and money. Strip something that doesn’t have the quality this is. If u are pot stilling let it set a while in the open. It’s not a mixer it’s a sipping whiskey.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by OtisT » Mon Aug 27, 2018 8:46 am

Halfbaked wrote:This recipe is wonderful as it is. It has character,taste and mouth feel. It is light and perfect for sipping white. If u are not getting what I am saying you are doing something differently than Bent is. Oak it, Well maybe but u will prob over power it and just taste the oaking. Strip it, if u want but there is so much going on here u be wasting your time and money. Strip something that doesn’t have the quality this is. If u are pot stilling let it set a while in the open. It’s not a mixer it’s a sipping whiskey.
Halfbaked, Could you help me understand “let it sit a while in the open”? I think you are referring to airing out after the spirit run and before cuts are made but I want to be sure I understand you right.

I have 35 gallons fermenting now and hope to start stilling this coming weekend. I should have enough wash to fill my boiler 2.5 times. I am planning to do two full strips, then a pot-n-thumper run using my low wines and the remaining wash in both the boiler and thumper. I’ve gotten some smooth whiskey recently doing this type of run.

After reading the thread again (and again) I have been convinced not to Oak this for the reasons listed. That said, I recently have been experimenting with seasoned fruit wood and think a few jars of this will end up with some small amounts of raw Plum sticks or possibly raw Apple sticks. I have some cherry wood also but that has a very strong presence, and a bit of astringency, and may overpower what I understand to be a delicate spirit.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by Swedish Pride » Mon Aug 27, 2018 1:00 pm

in my experience raw apple wood isn't pleasant, toast it in the over and it's lovely.
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by thecroweater » Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:18 pm

I wouldn't use fruit wood on oat or at least not for any length of time
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by Halfbaked » Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:58 pm

Otist. Yes air it a bit and listen to the above 2 posts.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by OtisT » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:56 am

Rye is the Devil’s seed, for sure.

Lots of time spent on this project only to have it scorch when stripping. I feel like I just received a well placed kick in the crotch.

One mistake I made was running the strip right after straining the ferment. I should have let that settle a day so after filtering so I could siphon off the clear beer only. One previous poster mentioned this as part of their protocol, and now I know that it was done to minimize the slime.

My second mistake was using my boiler with an internal element for stripping. Next time I do a rye I will use my thumper rig to steam strip.

I found it fascinating that I could see the smoke of the scorch coming out of my condenser when running. I’ve never scorched before, so at first I thought it was a slight vapor leak, but after checking my heat and cooling settings I realized what was really happening. It was an Oh Shit moment, for sure.

I have read enough about scorched product to know it is not salvageable. Not sure whether to just pour it out now, or process it anyway and see what I end up with. Too pissed now to worry about it. I will just clean everything up from this batch and start thinking about what is next. Argggggggggg!

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by StillerBoy » Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:56 am

Some grains such as oats and rye are not for beginners.. as you have learned through the experience, hopefully..

Shit does happen whenever we assume we have read, only to experience we didn't do a good job of it.. you should have heard the element telling you that it was scorching by the sound, the element will create a cracking/pinging sound..

The nice thing is, we can always start again..

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by OtisT » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:25 am

I recovered from my strip scorch with a bit of work. I set the scorched low wines aside. After a good cleaning/scraping of the element and still I successfully stripped (w/o scorching) the second half of the ferment for 4 gallons of low wines. I added 2 gallons of clear beer squeezed from the grains to the good low wines for the spirit run and I ran that through a pot n thumper.

My hats off to BentStick on this one. It does taste delicious white and I can detect all the elements described previously from the sweet up front to the rye at the end. I was diluting/drinking what was coming off of the still and it was wonderful.

I collected 8 liters total and after two days of airing I made two celebrity cuts: A Taylor Swift cut and a Nicky Minaj cut.
Taylor Swift and Nicky Minaj
Taylor Swift and Nicky Minaj
First I made a Taylor Swift cut. A Taylor Swift cut is a skinny white cut, nothing on top (heads) and no bottom (tails) to speak of. That gave me one gallon at 69% ABV that will sit in a jar a month to mellow before diluting/bottling.

Next I made a Nicky Minaj cut with what remained. A Nicky Minaj cut is all heads and tails, with nothing in the middle. To be in proportion with Nicky, I used the first two heads jars on top (just outside of the white cut) and the first three tails jars on the bottom. I added a few small blocks of Medium Toast Oregon Oak to this and will see what comes of it. With time I will see if this turns out like it's name sake: brown and beautiful with equal parts sweet and spice.

Off the still it was not to distinct/noticeable, but after airing the distinct smell and taste of Rye was strong in the late hearts and into the transition to tails. Absolutely Yummy. Maybe nothing worthy of noting for most, but this is my first rye so I'm just happy it came through so nicely.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by bentstick » Sat Sep 22, 2018 6:40 am

Rye is a wonderful addition if used in moderation with other grains that are subtle,by its self is also nice by with a wow factor

Glad you liked the product you made enjoy it
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by John Galt » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:59 pm

Just now poured out some barreled 120 proof original recipe. Deep, rich flavor. I went back to my notes from the run and it bring back memories of breakfast cereals and being a kid...with a punch. The 26 months in a 10L barrel have been kind and the result is a dark amber product that is tasty.

A guy might oughta make this. Thanks bent.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by bentstick » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:50 am

John Galt wrote:Just now poured out some barreled 120 proof original recipe. Deep, rich flavor. I went back to my notes from the run and it bring back memories of breakfast cereals and being a kid...with a punch. The 26 months in a 10L barrel have been kind and the result is a dark amber product that is tasty.

A guy might oughta make this. Thanks bent.
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by otoothlessone » Fri Jan 18, 2019 4:50 am

Im in the process of getting all the stuff needed to try my hand at this recipe. I don t know what high temp enzymes are, Could you please educate me on this subject? thanks

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by StillerBoy » Fri Jan 18, 2019 5:37 am

otoothlessone wrote:I don t know what high temp enzymes are, Could you please educate me on this subject? thanks
Read up on the following..

viewtopic.php?f=39&t=50808&start=60

viewtopic.php?f=39&t=55287

viewtopic.php?f=39&t=55287

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by dukethebeagle120 » Sun Feb 24, 2019 3:05 pm

Just mashed this in
My boy came around and said hey that smells good
Way better then beer
Hmmm,maybe a precurser
Smells so good
And sg is right where bent said it would be to
Gonna ferment and can't waaitto run it
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by Swedish Pride » Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:13 am

did one over the weekend too, sure smells good enough that you want to grab a spoon and dig in
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by dukethebeagle120 » Wed Mar 06, 2019 1:39 pm

I can tell you,this is by far the best tasting alcohol off the still i maybe ever made
Good taste,nice sweetness and smooth as silk
This is definitly staying white
Half way through spirit run and really great
The heads didnt seem to last long
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by Twisted Brick » Wed Mar 06, 2019 3:26 pm

dukethebeagle120 wrote:
The heads didn't seem to last long
Great job, duke! What yeast/ferment temp did you use?
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by dukethebeagle120 » Wed Mar 06, 2019 6:18 pm

30gallon ferment
I would say it finished at about 5-5.5% abv
I used red star bakers
I fermented fast
100 degress constant
Clean taste
Like bent did,i am not worried about yield just quality
Should end up with 3/4 GALLON AT 40% abv
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by Twisted Brick » Wed Mar 06, 2019 6:53 pm

Nice. Thanks. I got 50lbs each of oats and wheat. Just need the ryes. Gonna try these organic raw ones here, but won't be back up to the bay area until first week of May.
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by dukethebeagle120 » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:27 pm

Final thoughts
I ended up with a gallon at 45% abv
Really creamy
Very nice sweetness
I usually triple distill my alcohol.
I like a lighter alcohol
But i double distilled it.
A little grainier then i usually like but very nice
I would have expected a bit more bite from the rye
I did add in more heads to compensate but did not want to go to far
I give this recipe an 8.5
And really the other 1.5 may be do to me
I think i would have swapped in more rye malt maybe all rye malt.
I really found this an easy mash and strain.
Used crimped oats fine ground
Gives the mash courseness makes it easy to strain
And was really not that thick because of the hulls
A go to for sure
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by still_chillin » Tue Mar 19, 2019 9:15 pm

I have a 12 gallon batch of this fermenting right now. I've never done a sugar head(adding sugar to the spent grains for a second ferment).

Has anyone done a sugar head with this recipe? Is it worth it? I worry that it won't pick up much grain flavor from all the second run light flavored oats and wheat.

I had to use flaked wheat and rye because I couldn't find whole grains. It's gonna be mushy with lots of goo.

I'm planning to keep the original white, but think the sugar head should probably be oaked.

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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by bentstick » Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:40 pm

still_chillin wrote:I have a 12 gallon batch of this fermenting right now. I've never done a sugar head(adding sugar to the spent grains for a second ferment).

Has anyone done a sugar head with this recipe? Is it worth it? I worry that it won't pick up much grain flavor from all the second run light flavored oats and wheat.

I had to use flaked wheat and rye because I couldn't find whole grains. It's gonna be mushy with lots of goo.

I'm planning to keep the original white, but think the sugar head should probably be oaked.
yes I do a piggyback with it and run it up a vm for neutral,to make gin
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Re: Oat,Wheat,Rye Whiskey/whisky

Post by Blackbeard » Thu Mar 28, 2019 11:05 am

High temp enyzmes mix off and on for how ever long it takes to get to 158-155 add gluco enzymes and the malt stir in and every now and again stir it up,after a few hrs I just lock it down in the fermenter and let set over night with blow off tube in water bucket, in the am once cooled a bit I add the remaining 10 gals of water to cool to pitch temp,add my yeast ( Prestige Whiskey yeast).
I've not done anything with enzymes before, can anyone elaborate on what I need to use please? Also this specific yeast is not available where I live, I can order online or are there other suggestions? I do have easy access to the complete range of Still Spirits Yeasts, Mangrove Jack, Saf, Lallemand, Lalvin and Vintners.

To compare with Prestige Whisky yeast it must survive 12% ABV?

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