uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

[MichiganCornhusker]

haha, I like it

Nice anejos...

[T-Pee]

Hello all! I've been using this ujssmm exclusively for the last 6 months. The first run I ran 6 generation then froze backset and started again about 4-5 weeks ago. I ran into a problem with my mash coming to completion with this last batch on generation 4. It's going on 3 weeks I still get a bubble or 2 from airlock every 18-20 sec and my SG is at 1.05 I adjusted ph 2x back to 5. Temp is 89 using distillers yeast. It smells wonderful and taste like the generations before. Is it just a slow finisher? And also How long can I leave it going before I should run it?
Thanks in advance!

Have you been removing your spent corn every time and replacing with equal amount of fresh? When you rack off, make sure you remove that top layer of corn until you see bright yellow again. I had this problem once, pH and temp were all fine, turned out it was nutrients. I added some corn and a bit of DAP For extra measure,and it took right off and finished in two more days.

I had the same problem with the same solution. Haven't had an issue since.

tp

[victor]

Thanks guys, No, I read that only replace corn that floats? Didn't have much that floated so never added more corn. Also I only have yeast nutrient (urea) available local shops don't carry dap. Will that work also?

[T-Pee]

Also I only have yeast nutrient (urea) available local shops don't carry dap. Will that work also?

Why put pee in your wash when simply replacing spent corn will taste better?

Scrape off the top pale corn at the bottom of the fermenter and replace with fresh by volume.

tp (and a rhetorical question)

[moosemilk]

Thanks guys, No, I read that only replace corn that floats? Didn't have much that floated so never added more corn. Also I only have yeast nutrient (urea) available local shops don't carry dap. Will that work also?

That was the same mistake I made lol. I thought the same. It doesn't always float. Look at the color after, you will find it real easy to distinguish. The spent stuff is almost white. Never used urea, so can't comment myself. Adding a pound of Corn should help but may take a little more. Search up urea on the forum in the nutrients section you'll probably find your answer there.

*edit posted while t-pee. TP knows about pee lol.

[T-Pee]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urea

"Urea serves an important role in the metabolism of nitrogen-containing compounds by animals and is the main nitrogen-containing substance in the urine of mammals."

Not something I want in my whiskey, thanks. I'll sick with just replacing corn for nutrients.

tp (easy livin' like Urea Heap)

[victor]

It's from LD Carlson....

[moosemilk]

Diammonium phosphate, short form "DAP". But try putting in more corn first. Keeping ferments "natural" is best. I go to dap and other things as last resort. Most do the same as well. Keeps ferments more consistent.

[victor]

Thanks!!

[james123]

I started a 20 liter batch a few days ago using micronised flaked maize, the total volume in my bucket went to 25 liters.
Gradually the corn swelled and as of this morning was up to 12.5 liters so half the total volume!
I was worried I wouldn't get the 20 liters of beer back out again..
A few people on here mentioned squeezing the beer out of the corn when it has finished fermenting but I didn't want to end up with a pile of mush.
I just sterilised a large dinner plate and put it onto the corn bed and within a few minutes the corn had settled right down. There was a lot of co2 bubbles and no disturbance of the sediment.
So now I know when the ferment has finished, half an hour with a plate on the corn will allow me to siphon the majority of my beer
If anyone else has these concerns just do the same. Most of the swelling is just co2

And if anyone in the UK is having problems finding flaked maize/corn just call into your local farm suppliers. I paid £10 for a 25kg (55lb) sack.

[CanadianBacon]

Once you get up there in the generations would you even need to worry about nutrients, There is probably so much yeast produced It would ferment anything. It would be like having a starter going for months.

[Tokoroa_Shiner]

The corn is enough nutrients from gen one. No need to add any others, so no build up to worry about.

[james123]

The corn is enough nutrients from gen one. No need to add any others, so no build up to worry about.

Also with a continuous yeast colony surely they cannibalise the dead yeast as nutrients. I can't see ever having to add any extra apart from the replenishing of the used up corn

[Fastill]

I've had a few UJ ferments that stalled and the only thing that would jump start them was more crushed corn. I am pretty sure that was due to not enough available nutrients in the wash. Usually after 5-6 generations without adding fresh corn.

[HDNB]

so gen 18 is almost done, just waiting to clear. the gen 17 addition of malt barley gave a great run but i was worried it would crash the ferment (since i'm too cheap to buy more yeast.)

i dug out most of the grey goo gen 17 experiment...left from and left less than an inch of sludge in the bottom. tossed in the corn and sugar and it took off again.fruit flies have been a bitch and i've picked out a bunch orf them (just tossing a lid on top) but this feremnt just keeps rockin!

i'm interested to see what happens after this racks off...if it just uses up the top inch or so of corn, or if it's used up all the way to the bottom like after the barley experiment.

[james123]

I've had a few UJ ferments that stalled and the only thing that would jump start them was more crushed corn. I am pretty sure that was due to not enough available nutrients in the wash. Usually after 5-6 generations without adding fresh corn.

Fastill, according to the original method, spent corn was removed after each ferment and fresh added so that would eliminate stalled washes presumably.
I dont see any floating spent corn but for each future ferment I am going to remove a liter jug worth from the top of the corn bed and replace with 1/2 jug of new. Flaked maize/corn is cheap enough.
Im hoping this will work but only time will well.

Colin

[T-Pee]

After the first ferment the amount of floating stuff is minimal. Be more concerned with replacing the white spent corn that is on top of the cake at the bottom of the fermenter.

tp

[CanadianBacon]

I was gunna save my dunder from my 7th gen and harvest my yeast, anyone tried this with whisky trub? I was hoping for a super duper whisky yeast strain that will ferment during the cold Canadian winters.

Cant wait to make some maple syrup whisky with my batch that ageing right now.

[moosemilk]

I was gunna save my dunder from my 7th gen and harvest my yeast, anyone tried this with whisky trub? I was hoping for a super duper whisky yeast strain that will ferment during the cold Canadian winters.

Cant wait to make some maple syrup whisky with my batch that ageing right now.

If you find something that will ferment at -50C, which we saw last year where i am, and keep the ice in the bucket broken up, lemme know lol. Or you can always get some 5 gallon pails and ferment indoors.

EC-1118 by lalvin is a yeast that does well at cooler temps.

[CanadianBacon]

I was gunna save my dunder from my 7th gen and harvest my yeast, anyone tried this with whisky trub? I was hoping for a super duper whisky yeast strain that will ferment during the cold Canadian winters.

Cant wait to make some maple syrup whisky with my batch that ageing right now.

If you find something that will ferment at -50C, which we saw last year where i am, and keep the ice in the bucket broken up, lemme know lol. Or you can always get some 5 gallon pails and ferment indoors.

EC-1118 by lalvin is a yeast that does well at cooler temps.

1118 is what im harvesting, amazing strain of yeast, I use it for wine too and love it. I have packs of it all around the house. I figure about this time the yeast had time to mutate and the old stuff is long gone and dead. It has survived 14 degrees in my basement so I would say its going strong. Only hits - 40 here in BC where i am. But i ferment in my basment that can hit 10 degrees in December-January giving me the chance for a stalled fermentation.

[Tal]

Just run my 4th gen corn/ sugar wash...sg 920 after 2 weeks fermenting away..slowed down to just a bubble now and then..had two 60 litre fermenters and siphoned off leaving maybe 1/2 an inch of wash over the corn sediment. Put 78 litres thru the pot still and started running at 148 proof. Beautiful smooth taste, 5 hrs later it was giving out at 60 proof so hit the kill switch. had 13.5 litres plus 2 litres of tails ...NICE!...you gotta love that smooth corn moonshine!...gonna chuck the backset back in and crank er up again...add a couple of sachets of bakers yeast, more sugar and corn and leave it bubbling away for a couple of weeks...suckin on a sample right now...life is good!

[NZChris]

If you like corn flavor there is still some left after 60 proof.

You don't need to add yeast unless you kill the existing yeast with heat. If you have killed the existing yeast, the contents of the dead cells smells like burnt rubber.

[Tal]

Thanx NZChris...I add the yeast to jump start it really...keep the heat pads under the fermenters while i'm doing my run, let the backset cool, usually overnight, then add warm water/sugar etc to backset and add it to the fermenter. The backset is full of corn flavour as you say. Going to build a decent fermenter cupboard tho with double wall ply and batts in between. Will put a light bulb thru the top and heat pads under the fermenters. Been using an infra red bulb but man!...it sucks the power!...can't be doing that so the change is imminent.

[NZChris]

The yeast in the trub is just hangin out for a feed. If I'm leaving it for a while, I give it a sprinkle of sugar.

I dump the hot backset onto the sugar to convert it.

My old fridge only needs 40w to keep it up to temperature in the middle of winter. In summer I use two 40w lamps wired in series to give 20w and better reliability. Wires and CO2 tubing is pulled through the existing duct to keep it tidy.

Heat rises, so placing a lamp at the top will be nothing but trouble.

[Tal]

Hmmmm....nice...food for thought have an old fridge in the garage which is burning power for bugger all at the mo. Thanx..

[CanadianBacon]

Can i save my back set but restart the entire batch ever time or atlest every 5-10 times with the same results. I am finding its getting nasty at the bottem with lot of spent corn and im not getting much flavor with replacing corn at this point, The bottom is just sludge corn. and its starts to smell vinegary after awhile.

[T-Pee]

Yeah. The backset is the "sour" in "sour mash".

tp

[NZChris]

Hmmmm....nice...food for thought have an old fridge in the garage which is burning power for bugger all at the mo. Thanx..

If they are still working, that's even better. Especially if you want to crash cool, make lager in summer, age cheese, etc.. I put a beer ferment in one yesterday, when it's ready, turn the refrigeration on without having to move the fermenter.

Put an STC-1000 controller in them and you have easy control over heating and cooling. They are available very cheap, with free shipping, on Ebay.

[NZChris]

Can i save my back set but restart the entire batch ever time or atlest every 5-10 times with the same results. I am finding its getting nasty at the bottem with lot of spent corn and im not getting much flavor with replacing corn at this point, The bottom is just sludge corn. and its starts to smell vinegary after awhile.

All I did was replace a third of the corn each time. I couldn't see the difference between spent and ok corn, and couldn't get the spent corn to float, so I gave the trub a really good mixing, then removed a third and replaced it. Doing that also got rid of a third of the sludge and dead yeast each time. Because the fermenter had 3kg of corn at the start, all I had to do was replace 1kg each time and the amount of corn would remain the same in every generation.

You can start over fresh with the backset and new corn. I freeze my last backset and dunder for that purpose. If it is still making nice wash, you could use a scoopful of trub as a starter for the next generation and use all new corn.

[Tal]

After my 4th gen I had to make a decision re keeping on keeping on or stop. The storage/heating the fermenter problem was getting in the way so decided to stop.The sludge at the bottom convinced me it was a good time....4 is enough im thinkin??