uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

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theBEARD
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by theBEARD » Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:19 pm

I am new in this hobby brothers, my hydrometer and refractometer are still traveling towards me, I cannot check the SG. My mash was 3.5 ph and tasted like little bit sour wine, on the smell was like light vinegar, I am distilling it right now, started it on high (striping run). It started 110 proof (55% abv) im still waiting to drop down to 20% abv so I can cut it. I think it started little bit low (55% abv) but not too bad I guess. I have pot still with 1” 1/2 short 35cm column reduced to 3/4 over 1/2, 1 meter long liebig condenser.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by MartinCash » Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:34 pm

If it doesn't taste sweet you can run it. You can tell by tasting if there's sugar left unfermented.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by jonnys_spirit » Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:44 pm

When all else fails improvise.



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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Corsaire » Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:56 pm

55% at the beginning of a strip run doesn't sound too bad.
Let us know how much you end up with after your run is finished.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Tummydoc » Fri Aug 07, 2020 6:56 pm

Nice beard, if pH was 3.5 you didnt crash, it just finished fermenting. The first distillation (stripping run) wont taste great. Run 2 more ferments, then combine all three and redistill (spirit run). Collect in small jars for your cuts, work up and down from the middle jar combining the jars that taste decent.
Last edited by Tummydoc on Fri Aug 07, 2020 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by NZChris » Fri Aug 07, 2020 11:13 pm

theBEARD wrote:
Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:19 pm
I am new in this hobby brothers, my hydrometer and refractometer are still traveling towards me, I cannot check the SG. My mash was 3.5 ph and tasted like little bit sour wine, on the smell was like light vinegar, I am distilling it right now, started it on high (striping run). It started 110 proof (55% abv) im still waiting to drop down to 20% abv so I can cut it. I think it started little bit low (55% abv) but not too bad I guess. I have pot still with 1” 1/2 short 35cm column reduced to 3/4 over 1/2, 1 meter long liebig condenser.
With your still, I would be doing at least three stripping runs worth of ferment before I got excited about doing my first spirit run to make some drinking likker. If I had an empty drinks cabinet, I'd steal some middle take from the stripping runs to tide me over, but I would never expect it to be fine product and let my friends taste it. :oops:

BTW, I never order one hydrometer because I'm a clumsy bastard and have pets and friends. I'm having trouble getting distilling hardware delivered because of Covid, so having spares is nice.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by theBEARD » Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:11 pm

Here is what I got from my first generation of UJSSM: from 10 liters of wash or mash I ended up with 1.5 liter of stripped moonshine with 36% abv. Which leads me to think that my ferment was not finished completely, but for ferment which was left too low on PH without observing it because I was on vacation it’s not so bad. Bed thing is that today I think I have ruined my second generation fermenter. This second one was also low on PH 3.1 because first one was not fixed plus I have used 27% of backset like in recipe. I have managed to raise it to 3.6 with adding chalk powder which I made it from two chalks for teachers to write on board in school (that’s the only chalk that I could find at home that late night after I finished stripping run and making second generation UJSSM), today I went and I bought Calcium Carbonate, but instead of powder I bought a Calcium Carbonate stone (roughly size of two fists), I opened my fermenter and while I was trying with knife to cut small pieces of that stone, accidentally I have dropped it whole thing inside, that thing has started to foam like crazy immediately, I quickly took it out with stainless steel strainer, but it was fallen apart and very very hot. Now PH in my fermenter is 10.7 😂. I won’t even try to lower that, I’m just going to start all over, and learn a lesson from this, how to be more careful next time.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by NZChris » Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:58 pm

theBEARD wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:11 pm
Now PH in my fermenter is 10.7 😂. I won’t even try to lower that, I’m just going to start all over, and learn a lesson from this, how to be more careful next time.
That's why I use whole sea shells as a buffer rather than fiddling with pH using using CC powder or slaked lime, (which is better). I can drop a couple of whole sea shells in at the start of the ferment and it won't wreck the wash unless I leave them in too long after the ferment finishes. I've never had to adjust the pH since I started doing that.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by jonnys_spirit » Mon Aug 10, 2020 3:23 am

Take a sample in a beaker or a jar and try to adjust it before you chuck it.

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water into whiskey into water
just getting started in home distilling - been drinking for decades
16g copper pot still, 10l alembic, and a column or two
————

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by theBEARD » Tue Aug 11, 2020 11:55 am

That's why I use whole sea shells as a buffer rather than fiddling with pH using using CC powder or slaked lime, (which is better). I can drop a couple of whole sea shells in at the start of the ferment and it won't wreck the wash unless I leave them in too long after the ferment finishes. I've never had to adjust the pH since I started doing that.
[/quote]


In Monday I will go on vacation again, this time on sea. I will bring some sea shells from there for next time. How many sea shells should I use for 12 liters UJSSM, 3, 6, 10? Knowing that next time my PH will be 3.3 - 3.7 for sure, it must be because of my corn ( I’m growing my on corn on 5000 square meters land), my corn is dropping PH of my water from 7.8 to 3.3 - 3.7 always.
Last edited by theBEARD on Tue Aug 11, 2020 11:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by theBEARD » Tue Aug 11, 2020 11:56 am

NZChris 👆

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by NZChris » Tue Aug 11, 2020 1:59 pm

theBEARD wrote:
Tue Aug 11, 2020 11:55 am
How many sea shells should I use for 12 liters UJSSM, 3, 6, 10?
That will depend on the size of your shells, (I like thick ones), your local water, etc.. Using whole shells is pretty forgiving unless you use really stupid amounts or don't remove them when you're not going to distill promptly. I weigh my shells wet, so that I can weigh them wet after the ferment and calculate how much was used up during the ferment and have records for future reference.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by theBEARD » Tue Aug 11, 2020 3:10 pm

NZChris wrote:
Tue Aug 11, 2020 1:59 pm
theBEARD wrote:
Tue Aug 11, 2020 11:55 am
How many sea shells should I use for 12 liters UJSSM, 3, 6, 10?
That will depend on the size of your shells, (I like thick ones), your local water, etc.. Using whole shells is pretty forgiving unless you use really stupid amounts or don't remove them when you're not going to distill promptly. I weigh my shells wet, so that I can weigh them wet after the ferment and calculate how much was used up during the ferment and have records for future reference.
Thank you brother, I’ll see what I can find and how much to use, and I will do checking on PH every third day to take notes.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by dec3223 » Wed Aug 12, 2020 8:18 am

I have read a good bit of this thread and ask the following hoping that its not duplicated somewhere. I have a bastard rye whiskey mash fermenting away and am planning on running it this weekend. Contemplating starting a sour mash with the backseat of this wash in the interest of money and additional tasty product. All UJSSM recipes that I have seen are corn recipes. Any thoughts on using this rye, distillers malt and flaked maize as the beginnings of my first UJSSM?

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by theBEARD » Wed Aug 12, 2020 4:24 pm

dec3223 wrote:
Wed Aug 12, 2020 8:18 am
I have read a good bit of this thread and ask the following hoping that its not duplicated somewhere. I have a bastard rye whiskey mash fermenting away and am planning on running it this weekend. Contemplating starting a sour mash with the backseat of this wash in the interest of money and additional tasty product. All UJSSM recipes that I have seen are corn recipes. Any thoughts on using this rye, distillers malt and flaked maize as the beginnings of my first UJSSM?
You can use any grain you want or even mix of grains, any sugar you want or mix of sugars. That’s what I got as a answer from an experienced distiller when I asked same question as yours few weeks ago in other thread.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by MartinCash » Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:29 pm

I have made a corn, wheat & barley variant from another forum, and it works great.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Saltbush Bill » Thu Aug 13, 2020 12:44 am

MartinCash wrote:
Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:29 pm
I have made a corn, wheat & barley variant from another forum, and it works great.
Ive made that Bastardized version for many years .....never a complaint.
dec3223 wrote:
Wed Aug 12, 2020 8:18 am
All UJSSM recipes that I have seen are corn recipes. Any thoughts on using this rye, distillers malt and flaked maize as the beginnings of my first UJSSM?
Many people seem to have variations on this recipe as long as you stick to the basic recipe and quantities there isn't a reason that different grains cant be used......it just becomes something other/ differnt than Uncle Jess's Sour Mash.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by pickednick » Mon Aug 17, 2020 5:45 am

I am on 7. or 8. generation of this sour mash. After I distill wash, I quickly add fresh water + sugar + backset. But my yeasts doesnt work. Not even a single bubble.
In previous batch, wash was too acidic/sour and gave me blue distillate and also yeasts didnt work, I added small amount of yeast and it continued working like normal.
Can you help me about it? thanks.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Saltbush Bill » Mon Aug 17, 2020 5:52 am

Picked , Ive never experienced that nor have I ever heard of it happening before.
Don't get two worried if the ferment doesn't take off in the first 12 hours ......some here would have you believe that all ferments should take off at "warp speed"...aint always so.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Tummydoc » Mon Aug 17, 2020 6:09 am

Whats your current pH?

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by thecroweater » Mon Aug 17, 2020 7:33 am

Blue is often a sign of an alkaline ferment more than overly acetic. I've heard of folks having some issues many gens in but not really at 7, as SBB says wait a while and see as not every ferment takes off like a rocket. Being that this is ya second hassle I would say cut right back on your backset next gen and see if that corrects things
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by pickednick » Mon Aug 17, 2020 9:48 am

Saltbush Bill and thecroweater thanks for your advices, it really started to ferment slowly after 24 hour.
Tummydoc i dont know.
I am done thanks for your helps.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by silverbean » Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:48 am

I am also on generation 8 and never had a problem with slow restarts but after the 1st gen I have made a small modification which seems to be working well. After 4 or 5 days gravity is down to 0.995 and the bubbling has all but stopped so I take 4 litres of saved backset from the previous strips, boil it up to sterilise, add sugar and water then allow to cool to 30 deg c. then I rack off the wash about 21 litres and refill with the prepared backset/sugar/water. This is because I like to let the racked wash settle for 2 days then siphon off for the stripping runs. I then have maybe 300 - 500 ml of sediment which I mix into the boiling backset when I drain the still. I then let that all cool and settle then save the last 4 litres with all the sediment for the following ferment. I figure the advantage is having all the now dead yeast and sediments is great nutrient and is ready to refill the fermenter as soon as its emptied. The down side is I now have nearly 2 inches of sediment in the fermenter under the corn so may have to flush out some and repitch, small price to pay for a wash thats been ticking over with no issues for 8 generations.
Thanks to Uncle Jesse for posting this great recipe.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Virandell » Sat Sep 05, 2020 5:50 am

Hi guys I have question how many L of low wines you have after stripping runs ? I have 30L keg and 12L of liquid is covering my heating element I am trying to calculate how many generations I need before doing proper spirit run

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by NZChris » Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:52 am

Virandell wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 5:50 am
Hi guys I have question how many L of low wines you have after stripping runs ? I have 30L keg and 12L of liquid is covering my heating element I am trying to calculate how many generations I need before doing proper spirit run
I calculate that the way I spirit run UJSSM, I would run that element dry before I finished the run.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Virandell » Sat Sep 05, 2020 12:10 pm

NZChris wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:52 am
Virandell wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 5:50 am
Hi guys I have question how many L of low wines you have after stripping runs ? I have 30L keg and 12L of liquid is covering my heating element I am trying to calculate how many generations I need before doing proper spirit run
I calculate that the way I spirit run UJSSM, I would run that element dry before I finished the run.
As far I understand we are doing stripping to 0%, 1kg of sugar = 1L~of 50% and uncle Jessie is calling for 3.5kg of sugar for 20L mash which will gonna give me about 4l~ total low wines correct ? So I have to do 5 generations and I will gonna have about 20L of low wines 40%~ I need add another 6.7L of water to dillute it to 30% to redistill it that will gonna give me total 26.7L of liquid in my keg I need 12L of liquid to cover the heating element in my keg after all destilation is finished I should have about 15L of 60~% alcohol and at the end of distillation I will have around 11.7L of liquid left in my keg correct ? That's mean I will have to stop distillation abit earlier as at the end my heating element will be uncovered. Can u just confirm I am not talking bull**** here ? : D or something is wrong with my math

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Saltbush Bill » Sat Sep 05, 2020 1:42 pm

:o
Virandell wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 12:10 pm
As far I understand we are doing stripping to 0%,
You dont strip down to 0%.
Stripping down to 20- 25% is more than adequate.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Virandell » Sat Sep 05, 2020 2:14 pm

Saltbush Bill wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 1:42 pm
:o
Virandell wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 12:10 pm
As far I understand we are doing stripping to 0%,
You dont strip down to 0%.
Stripping down to 20- 25% is more than adequate.
Right my mistake :D The other user told me to do stripping to 0% even more than 0% to get the flavour, my only experience is with neutral for 3 years on column but I am Heading now towards flavours (brandy,gin, whiskey) as I get bored ^^ but is the rest calculations correct ? :D

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by NZChris » Sat Sep 05, 2020 8:34 pm

If you have to shut down early, you might already have the hearts and only miss out on collecting some tails.

Not being able to finish might not be the only problem. Heat rises. If the element is horizontal, when the level drops close to the element, you might lose the convection current you need to keep the charge circulating and finish the run only boiling a few centimeters at the surface.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Virandell » Sun Sep 06, 2020 2:59 am

NZChris wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 8:34 pm
If you have to shut down early, you might already have the hearts and only miss out on collecting some tails.

Not being able to finish might not be the only problem. Heat rises. If the element is horizontal, when the level drops close to the element, you might lose the convection current you need to keep the charge circulating and finish the run only boiling a few centimeters at the surface.
Ohh yee actually you are right I didn't thought about that, I think I will just stick to the neutrals for now and make liquors like I used to, as every plan I am trying to make will not gonna work. :mrgreen: I will start thinking about whiskey and brandy's in new house

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