First run took foreeeevverr!

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bu66a
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First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by bu66a »

Hey Guys,

New here and first post. Lots of great info. Although I can't seem to find out why my first run took so damn long. Here is the story. I started with a basic 25L Sugar Wash with Turbo Yeast(I know...I know, but it was free in my kit and my first stab at a wash), let it ferment 5 days. Wash had a SG of .990 Racked it, let it sit 12 hrs then fired up my still at 6pm. Didn't start seeing any temperature change on my digital Thermometer until 9pm, then it shot up to 78* C. Discarded the first 175ml, then proceed to collect every drop. The temp didn't move out of the 79-81* C for a couple of hours. Come 12:30am, I was tired and my brother took over to stand guard. Told him to watch it for maybe another hour and shut it down if nothing happens. It continually climbed, but very very slow. I woke up the next morning around 8:30am, and to my surprise my bro was still there kicking it on his laptop watching it drip out. At this point it had just hit 96* C. So we shut it down and saved it for the next run through. My question is....why the hell was it taking so long?!?! It shouldn't take 14hrs to finish a run...right?!?! We got maybe 2 gallons out of the whole run (Heads, Middle and some Tails). My hot plate was cranked the whole time (1500W). My only guess was, that we were doing it out in the garage where it was probably 48*-52* F. But the outside temp should effect that much..Right? The water that was running through the still, was just out of the side of the house spigot. It is pretty cold, but too cold?

My Set Up:

Mile High Distillery - Premium 8 Gallon Milk Can Still with new 2” dual purpose tower

-Column was packed with Copper and Raschig rings.

-1500W electric plate

Thanks in advance for your help.

-bu66a
Last edited by bu66a on Thu Feb 24, 2011 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dnderhead
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by Dnderhead »

not enough heat is one thing.most are using 4,000w internal witch is more efficient.
with a 2 in /50mm column should be more like 8 hours.most hot plates just dont cut it.
most are not big enough and most cycle.
bu66a
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by bu66a »

That makes complete sense, mine does power cycle when it gets too hot. My only question now would be....why would they Mile Hi recommend that for an 8gallon unit?
Dnderhead
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by Dnderhead »

because they can sell it and people buy it.
then if they had a hot plate for 200+$ that would work, not many wold buy it.would you?
bu66a
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by bu66a »

Well it was a $110 hot plate that was recommended with that kit....Figured it was the correct way to go.
blanikdog
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by blanikdog »

AS I said in another post recently, don't get suckered into believing retailers or directions on packets. All they want is your money. 'tis a sad, selfish, greedy, nasty system called capitalism. Conscience and decency have no part to play in it.
Simple potstiller. Slow, single run.
(50 litre, propane heated pot still. Coil in bucket condenser - No thermometer, No carbon)
The Reading Lounge AND the Rules We Live By should be compulsory reading

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Caprimulgus
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by Caprimulgus »

Around 10C is kinda cold, if you ask me. And I noticed you didn't mention any insulation?
Nobody puts baby in the corner....
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18918
marc83
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by marc83 »

Insulate your boiler next time you run it maybe...
I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day.-Frank Sinatra
bgrizzle
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by bgrizzle »

I would mail the burner back to milehi for a refund. Mail the milk can with it, and see if he will weld you a 1" fitting on the side near the bottom. You can then install an internal hot water heater heating element.

That heating plate just isnt gonna work for 8 gallons. I dont care if you do insulate the container, its still not enough power! Maybe you could go with a 1500W internal element, and use a variable speed router controller to dim it down or turn it up.

1500W internal element is much different than an external 1500W hot plate.

Good Luck
Usge
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by Usge »

Reducing the amount of cooling water (and or how cold it is) going to your reflux tubes..will increase the output flow-rate for any given amount of heat on that type of still...but at the expense of abv. It could be that its simply not enough heat as others suggest (don't know). But, these type stills "do" run fairly slow (drip, drip, drip) to get the most out of them (ie., abv). 2 things control the flow-rate on these....heat...reflux cooling in the top of the head. More heat would make it flow faster...but then so will reducing the cooling in the top of the head/column. I've done 12 hour (and longer) runs on similar design still. I wouldn't even say that was too far off base if you were running under reflux (ie., cooling water to top of column). If you run them in potstill mode (no cooling to top of head, little/no packing), you'll get faster flow-rate..ie., small/thin stream, and therefore faster run times — but at the expense of abv. Your heat up time sounds a bit long to get vapor to temp...but if you were running cooling to the head...most likely your pot would have been boiling for a while before you finally started seeing your vapor temp settle.

I don't think there is anything wrong with your hotplate...so long as it's not cycling too much. I think what you are seeing is more just the way these stills (CM) operate. More heat would obviously allow you to run either more reflux or faster flow-rates in potstill mode (or using less reflux). But, in my experience, if you are running a lot of reflux on these..it inherently means you are running it slow.
ammo man
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by ammo man »

If you don't like the hot plate cycling, it is very easy to rewire it so it will not recycle. I rewired mine and have never had any problems. It you have not electrical background or experience, please get someone to help you.

Bert
bu66a
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by bu66a »

Thanks so much guys, these are all very very helpful replies. I have been looking into drilling a hole in the side and placing a fitting with an internal heating element. But I also have though about rewiring my hotplate so that it doesn't cycle. It does cycle ALOT! Would you think its worth it to rewire it and give it a shot, or just go with the internal heating element route?

-bu66a
Dnderhead
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by Dnderhead »

Internal element is the way to go if you can,it will cost you more to start,but in long run save you.you will also need a controller.
rad14701
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by rad14701 »

An internal element is far more effective form both economical and thermal efficiency standpoints... With all of the heat, at optimal thermal efficiency, working directly on the wash within the boiler you are making far better use of the energy consumed... You cannot beat the internal electric element for efficiency unless you live where they have free steam available and there aren't too many places on earth where natural steam is readily available...
Bagasso
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Re: First run took foreeeevverr!

Post by Bagasso »

My first run also took forever. It was a stripping run using propane of 15 liters that I started at about 9pm figured i'd be done before midnight. It was around 3am when I gave up. I turned everything off and went to bed.

Turns out my digital thermometer is off by about -2 degrees so I spent about 3 hours just distillin water.
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