"Smearing"

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Boda Getta
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"Smearing"

Post by Boda Getta »

Could someone please explain "smearing" to me? I see references to "smearing" but it's not in the glossary and the context of the posts seems that some consider it a good thing while others consider it a bad thing.

Thanks,
BG
Stilly
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by Stilly »

If you run your still too fast its hard to delineate the cuts transition from heads to hearts to tails, they get kind of smeared together. Pot stills by their nature have a bit of smearing but it can be overcome to some degree by slowing down, using less heat. For a reflux column, you will have to wait for wiser minds, I have never run one.

For me on a pot still Low and Slow is the way to go for spirit run. For stripping I run as hard as my condenser will allow.

cheers
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by Kentucky shinner »

A good reflux column will stack the column. It will kind of separate the cuts for you in a sense. It makes the cuts a little sharper, easier to find the difference between heads, hearts and tails. The heads will be more compressed. I hope this helps. I am sure some others will be along that can better explain this.
Stilly is correct with a pot still slower is better for making cuts. To fast and they all run together thus you have smearing.
KS
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by rad14701 »

Think of a pot still stripping run where it is being run as fast as the condenser will allow... You're gonna get smearing all the way through from start to finish which is why you wouldn't bother to try making cuts on such an aggressive run... You'll have more water in the low wines and the foreshots, heads, hearts, and tails will all be smeared into the mix...

The slower you run, the better the separations will be and the easier to distinguish between the transitions... A pot still will be more apt to smear than a reflux column but it is entirely possible even with a reflux column if you haven't mastered total control...
goose eye
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by goose eye »

you got these answers now why you rekon why they sayin smearin aint a bad thag on your type outfit?


so im tole
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by LWTCS »

goose eye wrote:you got these answers now why you rekon why they sayin smearin aint a bad thag on your type outfit?


so im tole
:)

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memetic
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by memetic »

Eventually, Id like to get to that point too -- that is, the smearing and mixing it up. Now, all I do is as pure EtOH as I can, and if it smells and tastes like anything, it is no good. I can't wait to have the skills to make a fine whiskey.
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by blind drunk »

Smearing is like blending in your pot still column while in operation. Doesn't always work, but it's worth fighting for.
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Bull Rider
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by Bull Rider »

To reduce smearing on a pot still during the Spirit Run, I slow down during the transition times.

When the still is shifting from heads to hearts it's nice and easy. When I'm into hearts I pick it up a little, shift to larger collection containers, and when I get into the end of the hearts its back to low and slow. Once into the tails past where I'm going to use for blending, I step up the heat and run it out.

This is the advantage of a bigger boiler and bigger runs.

Bull.
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goose eye
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by goose eye »

boda can you remove 100 percent of methonol from your likker?
is it gona kill you ifn you cant


so im tole
blanikdog
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by blanikdog »

BG, there are ten pages (185 posts) on smearing had you used the search function. Third button from the right at the top of the page.
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Boda Getta
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by Boda Getta »

blanikdog
Thank you for your reply. I actually found the Search button on my first day of lurking on this board. I did a search for "Smearing" and that is what prompted my query. If you re-read my post you will note the main thrust of my post is "Is smearing a good thing or a bad thing". I read many posts on smearing, as mentioned in my post, many hold that smearing is a bad thing, but there are also posts that hold that smearing is a good thing or can be a good thing. Some of my queries on this board is to clarify things I have read members post that confused me, many as a result of searches. One example is "Feints". My first day on this board I read the Glossary and learned that Feints are tails only. I began to read posts where the poster seemed to refer to Feints as a mixture of heads and tails. I did a search for feints and found it very common for very knowledgeable members of this forum seemingly refer to feints as rejects from cuts/blending and consisting of heads and tails. I then posted a question to clarify.

BG
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by Greenrvrshine »

Boda, I'm a new guy as well although idabbled with distilling a bit a few years ago. There is much conflicting info on the board, I think reading other neewbs it really confused me. I've started just reading what the guys who know whiskey say. There are general guidelines it seems for ethanol in general, but when it comes tio neutral for example, I would listen to rad or LW(?). Whiskey: rubber duck, uncle jessie, pinto shine, dnderhead, barney fife, among others have been my biggest helpers. Find the guys who know what you want tio know and it gets alot easier tio discern info. Best of luck from one new guy to the next.
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by goose eye »

or you can always try an learn yourself. you wana learn somethin then do it. make mistakes everybody here done some. at some point you gona have to or you aint never gona be

so im tole
Usge
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by Usge »

boda,
as far as your search to understand "smearing", you have to take it in the context of what kind of thread you are talking about. For people using reflux stills, trying to make clean, odorless, neutral..."any" smearing is a bad thing. Coming from the other side of the equation with a potstill...there is "smearing" (less separation) inherent in it by design for making flavorful drinks. In general, as has been pointed out...running a pot still "slower" will provide more separation than running it faster. And it's also true if you run it as fast as you can...you'll probably smear everything together. Is that bad or good? What kind of taste you like? And what are you running it for?

For instance...on a "strip run"..which is mainly a reduction run...is run hard and fast...(ie., smearing) to get all the flavors in there and reduce the volume. I think most people find that running slower than that to some degree or another...is preferable on a spirit run when using a pot. How slow...is subjective and would be based on a lot of factors. For instance..single running wash/mash as opposed to double running using low-wines. Or running something you intend to oak, vs you intend to drink white. Or are you running a de-tuned reflux still trying to achieve somewhat cleaner spirits but still retain "some" flavor? The variables are many, such that you might find a lot of different answers and combinations of things (ie., run slow at first..speed up there, etc). which probably explains why you picked up that it's referred to as both a good and a bad thing.

I think the best way to approach anything like this that is more subjective...is to just experiment/practice and see for yourself to draw your own conclusions based on your own tastes.

As to "feints"...yep....and I'm one of them who from beginning always referred to them as mixed heads/tails, until Dunder straightened me out that technically feints = tails only. (which I really appreciated btw). Tell the truth...I can't even remember how I got off on that foot? I think it was Ian Smiley's book...which I must have read through 50 times. But, I know that I had also seen it here as well, and it was just the way I always understood it. I guess you'll just have to forgive those of us who are still learning...and trying to help others same time :D
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by Dnderhead »

cation with the information on net , articles and even books,many are written by reporters journalist etc..
they take a tour of distillers much like you mite and have interview with workers. then base there information on that.Im not saying not to read them but you have to sort things out for your self and then play detective sorting the good from bad.
you can fiend "good books" but not for 10-15$ you can pick up some used at colleges/technical schools. but expect
to pay 100$ or more.
Boda Getta
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Re: "Smearing"

Post by Boda Getta »

Greenrvrshine
Thank you for your post; always good to ear from another new guy. Strangely, most of the conflicting info have come from the old timers, but as Usge just pointed out, the context and equipment used makes all the difference. I went back last night and re-read every post on smearing I could find. It seems the Reflux guys consider smearing a bad thing but pot still guys opine that smearing can be good depending on your aims for that run. I found several posts where the poster wanted some smearing if they wanted some tails smeared into the hearts if they were going to age on oak or char. I absolutely agree about the guys you mentioned. Rad has been a lot of help on general questions and Recipes. rubber duck and dnderhead, and pinto shine have been most helpful on various posts and uncle jessie was very helpful when I was deciding on which recipe to start off with. These guys are very willing to assist new people and understand that new people are the future of any interest group and what may seem like a dumb question to some experienced people is not a dumb question to the beginner. Good luck to you as well.
BG


Usge:
Thanks for your excellent post. It took me a while to learn what you pointed out; when I first started reading HD posts I was confused with the seemingly conflicting info until I read up some on the Reflux stills and realized they are a whole other ball game. I run only in pot still mode and prefer some favor; I am working on achieving a really smooth sour mash corn whiskey style. I have learned that its important to know the equipment the poster uses and where he is coming from. On my first stripping run I ran it slow until someone pointed out that there's no point if cuts will not be made. I now do my stripping run as hard as my pot still will knock the steam down. The two spirit runs I've done was done as slow as possible, my still runs best with just the barest of flame. I have learned to collect in pint jars and I am still learning about cuts and blending. I have done my first blend which turned out "OK", I will do my next blend today or tomorrow and expect it to turn out better based on what I learned with the first blending.

As far as the feints thing; I started out with a "feints jar" with only tails, but realized it would take forever to get enough for an all tails run so I started adding heads. I still referred to it as my "Feints Jar" for a while but I have fixed that problem and now refer to it as my "ReRun Jar".
Again, thank you for your assistance.

BG
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