Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

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Pikey
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Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by Pikey »

Morning all, I'm doing a 200 litre ferment using bread yeast. It's a malt xtract sugar head and When I aeriated it, it frothed up. I pitched 75 grammes of Allinsons Bakers yeast and an aquarium heater set to 23 degrees.

The froth is not disappearing and has been there since thursday. It looks like a head on a pint of beer and is around 2" thick. I have tasted it and get a very "Yeasty taste". I am used to seeing the surface of my wash "Heaving" with the turmoil of the fermentation, using wine yeasts. Is this normat for a bread yeast ? Does it sit on the top and ferment ? :?
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by Yummyrum »

Never done a malt extract wash Pikey but all the Rum washes I use bread yeast on form a cruisen for about an hour or two then it becomes a bubbling fizzing pot that looks like fizzy Coke .
I do ferment at much higher temps for Rums though .... like about 35 degC minimum .

So I wonder if you are at only 23 degC that the yeast is still waiting for you to turn up the temp a bit .
Bread yeast likes hot temps . Say 26 degC and up

Also ,75 gms isn't alot in 200 liters . Again for rums its normal to pitch around 90 gm per 25liters ....excessive , but bread yeast is cheap and it gets the fermentation off and running really fast .
I know your not doing a Rum but the yeast thing is common

Its similar for Tomatoe paste washes ... (I think they call them Bird Watches here ). Also use bread yeast . Again fermentation temp needs to be up around 26-28degC.

Is bread yeast a top fermenter ? IHNFI :oops:
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by Teddysad »

Short answer - Yes!
You can lead a horse to drink, but you cant make it water!
You can lead a horticulture but can you teach a prototype?

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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by der wo »

Teddysad wrote:Short answer - Yes!
A bit longer answer is that most wine yeast is also a top fermenter.
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by zed255 »

Pikey,

My first sugar wash had a krausen cap for <24 hours, then was bubbling vigorously off the bottom for the balance of the fermentation. That was with Bob's Red Mill brand dry baker's yeast. My temps were warmer though, it kept itself at about 30C for the first three days.

So, it looked like my particular brand was a bottom fermenter. I will be using Fleichmans (sp?) next.
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by Pikey »

Thanks all, My froth is going away and I see no rising bubbles and hear no hiss, so I'm assuming my temperature is now too low. I have turned it up to 28 and also pitched 15 grammes of "Cold yeast" in case I can't hold a high enough temperature. I have some bubble wrap, so I'll try a few turns of that to help insulate.
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by der wo »

zed255 wrote:So, it looked like my particular brand was a bottom fermenter. I will be using Fleichmans (sp?) next.
No. All bakers yeasts are top fermenters. But of course they settle at the bottom when fermentation slows down. I think 99% of all yeast used by homedistillers is top fermenting. In general any Saccharomyces cerevisiae is top fermenting. Brewers often use bottom fermenting yeast (Saccharomyces carlsbergensis or uvarum).

Pikey, I think your ferment is ending. Or does it still taste sweet? At least just before distilling taste it or take a FG reading.
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by Pikey »

Been messing about with it - pulled the aquarium heater and tried it "on dry land" - Never got in the slightest warm. :roll:

Well that's 300 watts, so went and had a root around - found another - 50 watts ! - Well that's now submerged in there and we'll see if it does any good - currently the temp is 16.8 C - which I think is early 60s F ? so fine for the cold yeast, but clearly not for bread yeast.

I'll get another ordered tomorrow but they're passing out at an enormous rate - that's 5 or 6 I've killed now !

Thanks der wo - but yes it is still sweet - there's 40 kg sugar in there ! I wish I could ferment that lot in 2 days, but that would release 20 kg of CO2 - Blow the doors off the freakin' garage I reckon :lol:
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by der wo »

Pikey wrote: currently the temp is 16.8 C -
That's way too cold. I thought you "turned it up to 28", but you meant the setting on the heater, I understood you wrong.
It's not easy to establish a new yeast when there is already alcohol. Bring it up to temp, then it will start again.
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by OtisT »

Pikey wrote:Morning all, I'm doing a 200 litre ferment using bread yeast. It's a malt xtract sugar head and When I aeriated it, it frothed up. I pitched 75 grammes of Allinsons Bakers yeast and an aquarium heater set to 23 degrees.

The froth is not disappearing and has been there since thursday. It looks like a head on a pint of beer and is around 2" thick. I have tasted it and get a very "Yeasty taste". I am used to seeing the surface of my wash "Heaving" with the turmoil of the fermentation, using wine yeasts. Is this normat for a bread yeast ? Does it sit on the top and ferment ? :?
Hi. I use dry bakers yeast a lot, Bob's red mill. My ferments usually developes a crausen (sp) within 24 hours, and it can last anywhere from 2 to 4 days before it sinks as fermentation continues. The crausen looks like the surface of the moon, with lots of bubble craters off gassing. Sometimes that clausen does not form, and sometimes only on one fermenter and not the other. For me, even when I get one with and one without, both fermenters have similar FGs, PH, and temp so I don't worry when I get or don't get a crust. Disturbing the crausen can cause them to drop. Taking samples, tastes, inserting a floating thermometer, etc can all disturb the crust and cause it to drop.

Agree with the temp comments, that warming this up will help. I pitch Bakers yeast around 85 F. It typically rises to 100 F within the first 24 hours, and I leave it uninsulated until it slows down and the temp comes back down below 90 F. Also, Just an FYI, but I pitch about twice what you used. I tend to over pitch with the bakers yeast, about 9g/per gallon, and it works for me.

Best of luck. Otis
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by NZChris »

Pikey wrote:I'll get another ordered tomorrow but they're passing out at an enormous rate - that's 5 or 6 I've killed now !
I'm thinking there's a lesson in there, but I can't figure out what it is :eugeek:
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by Pikey »

Just nipped out to have a look whilst breakfast is warming up :(
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Do we think I need to turn the heater down a bit ? :D :lol: :lol:
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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by Shine0n »

Looks like she's a rollin to me, Now close that thing up and don't bother it for 5 days.

You could just float the hydrometer in the fermenter so you don't have to put it back and forth, when you only see the tip... pull it and run it!

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Re: Is bread yeast a top fermenter ?

Post by Pikey »

Thanks Shine 0n - about 5 days you reckon ? That's amazing quick - we'll see. :)

Meanwhile I've got another of those olive barrels and another of those 50 Watt heaters, I'm tempted to clear another space and put a molasses wash down. That'll give me enough for about 20 runs :shock:

Know what ? I'm beginning to like this bread yeast stuff ! :roll:
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