El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Simple pot still distillation and construction with or without a thumper.

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Single Malt Yinzer
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El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by Single Malt Yinzer »

I went all electric for the purpose of being able to distill on the grain. I got a 220v 5500w ultra low density wavy element. Did the vinegar run & made an AG brew from leftover grains for the sac run. Started out amazing. Never went over 20-25% power. About 1/3 the way through I started to get puffing. I figured I was overloading the condenser so I turned it down more to about 15%. At that point it couldn't produce and temps dropped. I turned it back up to ~20%. More puffing but this time I could smell it. Stopped the run, drained the boiler, and removed the element to find a mass of burned grain.

Two morals to this story:
- No matter what you may think(It'll never scorch!) don't bet money on it until you test it out.
- I spent a lot of money and I now have to figure out & test if or how I can distill on the grain without scorching...

I did a couple lautered runs and it works great for that even at 60-70% power. It's not all bad, it just didn't go the way I wanted it.
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RedwoodHillBilly

Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by RedwoodHillBilly »

Grain + electric element = scorch. Been there, done that. Steam won't scorch and you can distill on the grain. FWIW, I mash, ferment and strip in the same vessel. After fermenting, I move the clear wort to a boiler and leave the slop in the mash tun/fermenter which is now a thumper. No scorching.

Live and learn I guess. I feel your pain.
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Still Life
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by Still Life »

Nothing worse than recovering from a scorch. Completely avoid distilling on the most minor pieces of grain for that reason.
Never want to bake off that black crust again.
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der wo
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by der wo »

I distilled successfully on electrical hotplates Bourbon up to 10% abv. The key is strirring while heating up and then running really slow. An insulation is most important here.
But later I built an agitator. To build it is probably easier than you think. If you are interested, in my signature is s link to it.
In this way, imperialism brings catastrophe as a mode of existence back from the periphery of capitalist development to its point of departure. - Rosa Luxemburg
RedwoodHillBilly

Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by RedwoodHillBilly »

der wo wrote:I distilled successfully on electrical hotplates Bourbon up to 10% abv. The key is strirring while heating up and then running really slow. An insulation is most important here.
But later I built an agitator. To build it is probably easier than you think. If you are interested, in my signature is s link to it.
Hotplate is different than internal element.
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der wo
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by der wo »

RedwoodHillBilly wrote:
der wo wrote:I distilled successfully on electrical hotplates Bourbon up to 10% abv. The key is strirring while heating up and then running really slow. An insulation is most important here.
But later I built an agitator. To build it is probably easier than you think. If you are interested, in my signature is s link to it.
Hotplate is different than internal element.
Yes of course. But I thought the OP distilled with propane before he went to electric? Propane and hotplate is similar.
Anyway, to move from propane to an internal element to avoid scorching would be a bad decision I think.
In this way, imperialism brings catastrophe as a mode of existence back from the periphery of capitalist development to its point of departure. - Rosa Luxemburg
RedwoodHillBilly

Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by RedwoodHillBilly »

der wo wrote:
RedwoodHillBilly wrote:
der wo wrote:I distilled successfully on electrical hotplates Bourbon up to 10% abv. The key is strirring while heating up and then running really slow. An insulation is most important here.
But later I built an agitator. To build it is probably easier than you think. If you are interested, in my signature is s link to it.
Hotplate is different than internal element.
Yes of course. But I thought the OP distilled with propane before he went to electric? Propane and hotplate is similar.

Anyway, to move from propane to an internal element to avoid scorching would be a bad decision I think.
You think?, I agree :)
In the OP's post he said that he went to a 5.5Kw low watt density electric element, so I assumed that it was in the pot. I run the same kind of elements, and trying to distill on the grain with that system is doomed to failure.
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der wo
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by der wo »

Single Malt Yinzer wrote:I went all electric...
For me "went" means he had something different before, not that it is his first setup. Perhaps it's my bad English? Sorry for the confusion.
In this way, imperialism brings catastrophe as a mode of existence back from the periphery of capitalist development to its point of departure. - Rosa Luxemburg
RedwoodHillBilly

Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by RedwoodHillBilly »

Dein englisch ist ganz gut.

I believe that he meant that he decided to start with electric so that he could distill on the grain. That was a fail, but live and learn. :)
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Single Malt Yinzer
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by Single Malt Yinzer »

I had an alembic pot still before I used with both propane and an electric hotplate. I went to a larger milk can boiler with an internal element. I would love to have an agitator but the internal element makes the design a challenge. The grain gets compacted inside the element like a cage. It would have to be powerful enough to keep the grain moving. It is possible as the grain is loose. I also could add extra water to make it even a looser mix. I run around 1/2 capacity for stripping runs so there is space.
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der wo
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by der wo »

For an agitator you would probably have to go to propane again.
Adding water means diluting the taste. Either accept the milder taste you get with dilution or accept the milder taste you get with off the grain. I would go off the grain.
Or try again with really good insulation and really slow heating up and distilling.
In this way, imperialism brings catastrophe as a mode of existence back from the periphery of capitalist development to its point of departure. - Rosa Luxemburg
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Single Malt Yinzer
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by Single Malt Yinzer »

der wo wrote:Either accept the milder taste you get with dilution or accept the milder taste you get with off the grain. I would go off the grain..
My goal was heavier flavor but I failed that one. I agree that off the grain would be easier and that's what I will do. Maybe the next thing I do is figure out is how to turn it into a steam rig.
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der wo
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by der wo »

Steam distillation means also dilution with water.
Perhaps better build a large thumper. Ferment on the grain and distill with the solids in the thumper.
In this way, imperialism brings catastrophe as a mode of existence back from the periphery of capitalist development to its point of departure. - Rosa Luxemburg
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by yakattack »

Sorry about your scorch. Btdt. Here's your pro tip for the day. If an agitator is out of the question it's time to start learning about steam heating. No more scorch
HDNB wrote: The trick here is to learn what leads to a stalled mash....and quit doing that.
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by ShineRunner »

A thumper is a versatile piece of kit. Use it as a steam powered stripper. Put cleared wash in the boiler and murky grain slop in the thumper.

Lots of ways to do it, but I would strongly recommend a bottom drain, 2", to allow easy draining of the grain. 4" on top to help clean it out. I will hopefully be posting pictures of my rig in its variety of uses soon.

SR
RedwoodHillBilly

Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by RedwoodHillBilly »

der wo wrote:Steam distillation means also dilution with water.
Perhaps better build a large thumper. Ferment on the grain and distill with the solids in the thumper.
Agreed. I use a 55 gal open top SS barrel as my mash tun/fermenter then I turn it into a thumper. I put the clear wort into a smaller boiler and "strip" the slop that's left in the thumper using the clear wort as the steam liquid. Easy peasy, no straining. Besides I'm lazy (efficient).
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Single Malt Yinzer
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Re: El Scorcho - Barley Smoked Barley

Post by Single Malt Yinzer »

I'm digging the thumper idea. I'll look into that. It seems to solve the scorching issue and gets me back into heavier flavored spirits. Thanks everyone!
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