split column

[eb12]

can you split a 20 plate column into 5 4 plate columns with a deflagmator ontop of each column? if you don't have the hight for the 20 plate column

[Danespirit]

Yes you can.

[rad14701]

can you split a 20 plate column into 5 4 plate columns with a deflagmator ontop of each column? if you don't have the hight for the 20 plate column

Are you talking about daisy-chaining those 5 columns together so the output of one is the input to the next...??? If so then, yes... There are several examples of such stills posted here in these forums... And while most are large commercial version, we have had several members make hobby scale rigs with multiple plated columns... Keep researching and you should stumble across several topics on the subject...

[eb12]

they would daisy chain from one to the next. what I am trying to figure out is do you use the deflagmater to load the first column the let it release to the next column and so on till you get to the last column and only use that columns deflagmator

[still_stirrin]

Remember that the condensate from your reflux condenser (dephlag) will need to "flow" back towards the boiler. Some may reboil in the column in which it is placed, but some of the liquid constituents will not. And those need a liquid return path to the boiler.

Placement of the reflux condenser (or condensers) is critical to the level of purification you're seeking. You could use a reflux condenser (with individual coolant control, of course) on more than one of the columns to rarify the vapors sequentially as they advance through the towers. By the time the vapors reach the last and final tower, your product would be ultimately clean and tasteless. Great for neutrals.

But don't forget that you'll be producing liquids in each column and you'll need to manage the liquids at the bottom of the towers.
ss

[Danespirit]

+1 Ss

Two columns beside each other would be relatively easy to manage, 4 or 5 would be somewhat different.
Remember you would have to find a solution for draining the liquid off each column at the bottom.
Simply connecting the columns top to bottom and bottom to top, won't get you there.
Here is a good example of a drain at the bottom made by Googe: http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 17&t=51194

[eb12]

yup thanks guys I new about the drain back to the condenser from googe another post I found the one from deepsouth but his was only 2 columns that he ran in parrralel

[Yummyrum]

A 8 plate column would not IMO function the same as 2x 4 plates side by side unless the distillate at the bottom of the second tower could be pumped back up to the top of the first .Finding such a pump that can operate reliably at these temps and high alcohol environment is a challenge .

This is why the simple method of returning he distillate back to the boiler is used .How ever that means that there must be some reflux needed on the first tower or it would dry up . This also means that only a small proportion of the vapour reaches the second tower which again runs in reflux . Therefore the output from multiple towers with boiler drains will be significantly less than if pumps were used to interconnect towers thereby eliminating the need for reflux condensers on preceding towers

Googes tower used bubble caps . Once loaded they kept running not needing so much reflux to keep them loaded .A bit like a string of thumpers . It would be interesting to see how successful it would have been with perf plates.

[eb12]

so how low into the boiler can that return line be in reference to the plate columns

[shadylane]

I've been plumbing any reflux return lines to the very bottom of the boiler.
In other words, into the same hole as the drain

[eb12]

but what height is the bottom of you column in relation to the level in you boiler

[Yummyrum]

The bottom of the column must be higher than the level in the boiler otherwise the column would back fill via the drain to the level in the boiler.

Any drain back to the boiler must also have a fluid lock of sufficient depth to prevent vapour from the boiler entering the column via the drain.Runing the drain to the bottom of the boiler acheives the same thing.

[googe]

All you need is enough power to keep plates loaded and good return of reflux like any reflux still works. are you building this?.

[eb12]

yes I am building it have parts being machined and copper rolls on order just need to make it fit in the low ceilings where I will be distilling. had to make my boiler smaller in height and bigger in width to accomidate the reflux drains

[googe]

Looking forward to seeing what you do

[eb12]

building it out of paper right now to see if I can make it all fit

[eb12]

what is the minimum you can have between bubble plates

[Danespirit]

It depends a lot on your column diameter.
Also, tray hydraulics will change depending on the design of your tray...with a weir, bubble caps, valved tray etc..
The height of your downcomer (over the tray) is another factor that will vastly influence tray hydraulics, cause it determines how much liquid there will be at any given time.
A large column diameter means more power to run it, which again means more action on the trays.
Too little spacing between the plates will cause entrainment.
The plate above will take splashing from the below plate, rendering it almost useless and your rig will perform badly.
I'm in the progress of building a small 3" three plate column.
After a lot of reading, calculating etc.. I came to the result that 100 mm spacing between the plates would be alright for such a column.
I might get away with less (80 mm), but I don't care for the extra 60 mm height on the still...so I'm playing the safe game on that subject.
That is for a 3" with a 2 kW element for heating, I won't run the full power during a run, though...
The flute thread could be useful reading for you. Some of the guys have years of experience with building and designing plated columns, so they are the experts to ask.
What column diameter are you planning to have? Power input..?

[eb12]

8 inch column with a 700ksteam boiler I have applied for my distillers license. I have found for 8 inch 4 inch separation is fine but I can stretch it to 5 inch without any height issues

[Hound Dog]

eb12, check out this build thread, downsized from what you are doing but it may help inspire some ideas....

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 38&start=0

[emptyglass]

Why pull the skin off the cat through its bum? There is easier ways to achieve what 20 plates can

Hint; packable section

[emptyglass]

hmmm, no takers?

Thats ok. We cant see past what we dont understand.....

[Kegg_jam]

20 plates probably more fun to look at though.

Hey look at all them pipes...

[emptyglass]

Big cost just for eye candy......

[eb12]

not when I was getting quotes for 150k for the still.

[shadylane]

can you split a 20 plate column into 5 4 plate columns with a deflagmator ontop of each column? if you don't have the hight for the 20 plate column

The more I think about this question, the more I wonder
Since the 4 columns would have reflux returns directly to the boiler.
Would the distillate be more refined ?
And/or how much slower would the process be ?

[Kareltje]

The best way to find out: try it!
Build a rigg, run it and post us the pics and reports.

Please!