Gaskets... for triclamps
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Gaskets... for triclamps
I did a search on this but didnt get anything so i am posting this here...
i am not associated with any company, but here is something that looks pretty good to me.
Triclamp gaskets by a company called rubberfab that makes a flexible gasket of PTFE and 316 Stainless steel.
... I called and asked them about suitability for alcohol vapor system as in distillation and he told me straight, thats it only those 2 ingredients which is on our list of approved items.
here is a page for the vendor i use for several items i used in my builds...
https://www.glaciertanks.com/rubberfab- ... skets.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
but the tuf steel looks good for OUR application. I am going to order a full set for my flute...i think I will try these also in my sight glass set up so i can get rid of that leaky teflon tape
i am not associated with any company, but here is something that looks pretty good to me.
Triclamp gaskets by a company called rubberfab that makes a flexible gasket of PTFE and 316 Stainless steel.
... I called and asked them about suitability for alcohol vapor system as in distillation and he told me straight, thats it only those 2 ingredients which is on our list of approved items.
here is a page for the vendor i use for several items i used in my builds...
https://www.glaciertanks.com/rubberfab- ... skets.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
but the tuf steel looks good for OUR application. I am going to order a full set for my flute...i think I will try these also in my sight glass set up so i can get rid of that leaky teflon tape
She was just a moonshiner,
But he loved her Still
But he loved her Still
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Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
Very interesting. Thank you for posting.
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Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
I was walking through the stock room of my gasket supplier the other day and spied some Viton gaskets with PTFE envelope over the top. It was a substantial hard covering over the viton and would be perfectly suitable as a replacement for the PTFE gaskets I use. Only thing is, a 4" PTFE gasket costs me $5.75 and the viton/ptfe one costs $12.65.
The Tuf-Steel sounds good, but I'd be concerned about their use with copper tri clover fittings.
The Tuf-Steel sounds good, but I'd be concerned about their use with copper tri clover fittings.
Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
with the copper are you referring to the manufactured ones i have seen ? or hand made copper flanges...SaltyStaves wrote:I was walking through the stock room of my gasket supplier the other day and spied some Viton gaskets with PTFE envelope over the top. It was a substantial hard covering over the viton and would be perfectly suitable as a replacement for the PTFE gaskets I use. Only thing is, a 4" PTFE gasket costs me $5.75 and the viton/ptfe one costs $12.65.
The Tuf-Steel sounds good, but I'd be concerned about their use with copper tri clover fittings.
i did look at the manufactures website and they make it in sheets and many type of forms... so ... just Point of info...
Best regards
R
She was just a moonshiner,
But he loved her Still
But he loved her Still
- SaltyStaves
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Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
Both. It would not matter either way.Rastus wrote: with the copper are you referring to the manufactured ones i have seen ? or hand made copper flanges...
- Skipper1953
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Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
Would you mind actually explaining what it is you think would be a problem?SaltyStaves wrote:Both. It would not matter either way.Rastus wrote: with the copper are you referring to the manufactured ones i have seen ? or hand made copper flanges...
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Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
You have friction, heat and liquid and two very different metals in contact with each other.Skipper1953 wrote: Would you mind actually explaining what it is you think would be a problem?
Between two SS ferrules its fine, but I wouldn't want to test it with my one-of-a-kind copper still head.
I have deformation issues with the PTFE gaskets that I have to manage, but at least I know that they are completely inert to my still head.
Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
I picked up a few of the envelope gaskets from gvc.net. They have 2" envelope gaskets for $2.98 with either EPDM or Viton inside the PTFE envelope. Or 4.91 if you want the flanged gaskets that stay attached to one of the flanges for easier handling. I got 2 each of the unflanged, and 1 each of the flanged, just to see how they work.
They also have the Tuf-Flex, which has the PTFE bonded to the EPDM core, rather than just a EPDM ring inside of a seperate PTFE "U" cross sectioned envelope. They are supposed to be more flexible and more durable than the envelope gaskets, but those are $18.33 for a 2" gasket, and that was more than I'm willing to pay.
They also have the Tuf-Steel gaskets, at $8.07 for the 2" size.
For comparison, their solid PTFE 2" gaskets are $1.45. So the envelope gaskets are about twice as much.
For the 4" ones that Salty needs, they are:
PTFE: $3.64
Envelope: $6.82 (EPDM or Viton)
Envelope, flanged: $10.51 9EPDM or Viton)
Tuf-Steel: $18.27
Tuf-Steel, flanged: $72.00 (flanges are apparently expensive!)
Tuf-Flex; $34.73
They also have the Tuf-Flex, which has the PTFE bonded to the EPDM core, rather than just a EPDM ring inside of a seperate PTFE "U" cross sectioned envelope. They are supposed to be more flexible and more durable than the envelope gaskets, but those are $18.33 for a 2" gasket, and that was more than I'm willing to pay.
They also have the Tuf-Steel gaskets, at $8.07 for the 2" size.
For comparison, their solid PTFE 2" gaskets are $1.45. So the envelope gaskets are about twice as much.
For the 4" ones that Salty needs, they are:
PTFE: $3.64
Envelope: $6.82 (EPDM or Viton)
Envelope, flanged: $10.51 9EPDM or Viton)
Tuf-Steel: $18.27
Tuf-Steel, flanged: $72.00 (flanges are apparently expensive!)
Tuf-Flex; $34.73
- Skipper1953
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Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
Are you saying you would be concerned about a galvanic reaction? If so, wouldn't that be a problem if/when you clamp a copper section to a ss section using a ss tri-clover clamp regardless of what the gasket material is made of? Would this even be an issue if you disassembled your column between runs?SaltyStaves wrote:You have friction, heat and liquid and two very different metals in contact with each other.Skipper1953 wrote: Would you mind actually explaining what it is you think would be a problem?
Between two SS ferrules its fine, but I wouldn't want to test it with my one-of-a-kind copper still head.
I have deformation issues with the PTFE gaskets that I have to manage, but at least I know that they are completely inert to my still head.
Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
You've already got a Stainless clamp touching your copper flange. The only difference is that this is outside of the still, so you don't have vapor/liquid in contact. But then, for galvanic reactions, that's pretty important.SaltyStaves wrote:You have friction, heat and liquid and two very different metals in contact with each other.Skipper1953 wrote: Would you mind actually explaining what it is you think would be a problem?
Between two SS ferrules its fine, but I wouldn't want to test it with my one-of-a-kind copper still head.
I have deformation issues with the PTFE gaskets that I have to manage, but at least I know that they are completely inert to my still head.
Here's a document about the interaction of stainless with other metals. In general, copper and stainless seem to be pretty safe together. They point out that stainless and copper are often used together for potable water, "as both materials have similar corrosion potential in potable water." They also are pretty compatible in seawater. But then what we have in our stills isn't exactly potable water or seawater. And the electrolyte does make a difference. Unfortunately, I'm not finding much info on the corrosion potentials of copper and/or stainless in combinations of water, ethanol, methanol, acetone, fusel oils, and various esters and other congeners. But given that they have a very low difference in potential in all of the electrolytes I've found, I suspect they're also pretty safe together in a still.
In general, copper and stainless are fairly close to each other on the "nobility" scale (both are fairly high), so they won't react much with each other. Here's a galvanic table. Copper is #33 (of 92), and 304 stainless is #40. So they're pretty close. And closesness is what matters for having minimal reactions.
Also, the relative areas of copper to stainless matters. A small amount of stainless (the cathode) in contact with a large amount of copper (the anode) will result in less corrosion than lots of stainless in contact with little copper. In this case, there would be microscopic stainless particles in contact with macroscopic copper flange, so that would make the potential for corrosion even smaller.
Plus, the steel in the Tuf-Steel gaskets seems to be pretty much encased in the PTFE, so I doubt there is much actual stainless to copper contact.
So it looks to me like this would have very little potentian for galvanic reaction. But no one is forcing anyone to use these things, so make your own decision.
Disclaimer: I'm a software engineer, not a metallurgist. My understanding is based largely on what I've read in the last hour or so.
- SaltyStaves
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Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
Yes, I was only concerned about the inside. My SS clamp and my copper tri clover ferrule have never given me any signs of trouble and of course remain dry at all times.
True that it is likely to be a negligible galvanic reaction, but I only know enough to be cautious.
This is where I'm unsure. The Tuf-Flex certainly sounds like the outer surface is one hundred percent PTFE, but the Tuf-Steel sounds like a composite.Plus, the steel in the Tuf-Steel gaskets seems to be pretty much encased in the PTFE, so I doubt there is much actual stainless to copper contact.
True that it is likely to be a negligible galvanic reaction, but I only know enough to be cautious.
Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
On further thought, it occurs to me that a number of people have used stainless tri-clamp ferrules on copper pipe, and I haven't heard any reports of issues with that. That's big chunks of stainless in very solid contact with big chunks of copper. If the two are going to have a galvanic reaction, we'd certainly be seeing it in that situation.
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Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
Unless something is wrong, that is always going to be dry in operation.BugHunter wrote:On further thought, it occurs to me that a number of people have used stainless tri-clamp ferrules on copper pipe, and I haven't heard any reports of issues with that. That's big chunks of stainless in very solid contact with big chunks of copper. If the two are going to have a galvanic reaction, we'd certainly be seeing it in that situation.
Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
I have a stainless ferrule pounded inside of and soldered to a copper column. It certainly isnt dry at the inside joint in action. I see no issues.
Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
wow great discussion...
so far i have not had issues with my Hard as sled runner
PTFE gaskets, but i tighten them quite firmly each time. with a little more flex in the tuff steel gaskets it would be re-assuring to expect a better seal reducing the chances of a vapor leak i may get some sheet pieces I can cut to fit into my sight glass windows and not worry about the PTFE tape seal in those . That's Priceless.
safety is foremost
and by question and good discussion we learn and its good to know we have possible options.
with these different metals together, the other factor is possibly the solder used which is in my case silver bearing solder for all my stainless flange to copper. but inside my deflag and condenser i used Harris saftey silv 56, but thats not what i was intending to discuss here ...
Best regards, and be safe
so far i have not had issues with my Hard as sled runner
PTFE gaskets, but i tighten them quite firmly each time. with a little more flex in the tuff steel gaskets it would be re-assuring to expect a better seal reducing the chances of a vapor leak i may get some sheet pieces I can cut to fit into my sight glass windows and not worry about the PTFE tape seal in those . That's Priceless.
safety is foremost
and by question and good discussion we learn and its good to know we have possible options.
with these different metals together, the other factor is possibly the solder used which is in my case silver bearing solder for all my stainless flange to copper. but inside my deflag and condenser i used Harris saftey silv 56, but thats not what i was intending to discuss here ...
Best regards, and be safe
She was just a moonshiner,
But he loved her Still
But he loved her Still
Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
Just wondering if you ended up using the PTFE/SS gaskets and if so, are they any good? CheersRastus wrote: ↑Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:00 am wow great discussion...
so far i have not had issues with my Hard as sled runner
PTFE gaskets, but i tighten them quite firmly each time. with a little more flex in the tuff steel gaskets it would be re-assuring to expect a better seal reducing the chances of a vapor leak i may get some sheet pieces I can cut to fit into my sight glass windows and not worry about the PTFE tape seal in those . That's Priceless.
safety is foremost
and by question and good discussion we learn and its good to know we have possible options.
with these different metals together, the other factor is possibly the solder used which is in my case silver bearing solder for all my stainless flange to copper. but inside my deflag and condenser i used Harris saftey silv 56, but thats not what i was intending to discuss here ...
Best regards, and be safe
The more hair I lose, the more head I get... ;-)
Re: Gaskets... for triclamps
I never did.... I kinda ground to a halt, and only recently entertained the idea of dusting off and doing a few runs.... my covid hoarding involved a few sacks of cane sugar haha... we will always need sanitizer, RIGHT???
She was just a moonshiner,
But he loved her Still
But he loved her Still