FNG!
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FNG!
Hey nice forum you guys have going here, I am new to both distilling and the forums.
I read through many of the threads and i am still using turbo, have been for about a year<<<when i started.
I run about 10 gallons of wash and come up with about 2-1/2 gal of 100 proof, give or take a quart.
I live in Oregon, and in the winter it gives my buddies and I a reason to get together.
We make the apple stuff every run and it is a 75/25 split for those that like it and those that don't.
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There is my rig it is my first and I have only made a couple of modifications(bigger condenser, fewer scrubbers, and messed with the coolant source)
Found your forum searching for, something a little better. With the turbo and the dextrose i wind up with a corn whiskey, which is not terrible just corny? as it should be.
So I started messing around with Grain teas....take 3lbs of grain boil it turn it into tea and use it in the wash.
The first was an Honey roasted malted wheat, which i bet after 6 months in a barrel would have been okay but as a clear it was confusing to the drinker.
The second was flaked corn, in hopes to get a sweeter corn flavor that did not work, tasted like really strong turbo.
So next i am going to try a winter wheat and a rye mix and try to dry it up some......if that does not work i will bag the turbo, but for time and(being a noob), it has helped me with my new hobby.
so cool, see yall around the forums, and happy distillate!!!
I read through many of the threads and i am still using turbo, have been for about a year<<<when i started.
I run about 10 gallons of wash and come up with about 2-1/2 gal of 100 proof, give or take a quart.
I live in Oregon, and in the winter it gives my buddies and I a reason to get together.
We make the apple stuff every run and it is a 75/25 split for those that like it and those that don't.
[/img]
There is my rig it is my first and I have only made a couple of modifications(bigger condenser, fewer scrubbers, and messed with the coolant source)
Found your forum searching for, something a little better. With the turbo and the dextrose i wind up with a corn whiskey, which is not terrible just corny? as it should be.
So I started messing around with Grain teas....take 3lbs of grain boil it turn it into tea and use it in the wash.
The first was an Honey roasted malted wheat, which i bet after 6 months in a barrel would have been okay but as a clear it was confusing to the drinker.
The second was flaked corn, in hopes to get a sweeter corn flavor that did not work, tasted like really strong turbo.
So next i am going to try a winter wheat and a rye mix and try to dry it up some......if that does not work i will bag the turbo, but for time and(being a noob), it has helped me with my new hobby.
so cool, see yall around the forums, and happy distillate!!!
Re: FNG!
Hi BootlegTurn, welcome to the forums.. Nice looking rig, although it looks like you are using some plastic sort of filter on the output, which folks here dont like much, as they can leach some nasties into your output.. (and body ) We like to use copper and stainless steel..
The grain experiments sound great, doing some myself.. good luck and again. welcome!!
The grain experiments sound great, doing some myself.. good luck and again. welcome!!
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Re: FNG!
That 5" Piece of PVC is my condenser housing, not a filter and there is about 20' of 3/8" copper tube in there. Well sealed and isolated from the distillate.
But my charcoal filter apparatus is plastic?
But my charcoal filter apparatus is plastic?
Re: FNG!
Welcome to the forums, BootlegTurn...
If you're using carbon filtering then there is room for improvement as far as fermentation and distillation are concerned... You shouldn't need to clean the spirits up if done correctly... It's a learning process... Ditch the turbos and you'll see an immediate improvement...
The rig you are running is a Cooling Management column... That design, without scrubbers filling the entire column, is contributing to the lower %ABV spirits as well as some of the off tastes and smells...
Good luck... Glad to have you on board...
If you're using carbon filtering then there is room for improvement as far as fermentation and distillation are concerned... You shouldn't need to clean the spirits up if done correctly... It's a learning process... Ditch the turbos and you'll see an immediate improvement...
The rig you are running is a Cooling Management column... That design, without scrubbers filling the entire column, is contributing to the lower %ABV spirits as well as some of the off tastes and smells...
Good luck... Glad to have you on board...
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Re: FNG!
Thanks by the way, glad to be here.
There are still scrubbers in it, i pulled some out because my distillate was @180+ and was bad news now strait from the condenser it runs about 160 and then i cut for volume.
So there are a few more steps in there.
Yeah I am trying to bag the charcoal. It seems after charcoal filtering the distillate turns quite medicinal in flavor or sharp, and even tho it is okay for mixed drinks it isn't quite as smooth as I would like.
There are still scrubbers in it, i pulled some out because my distillate was @180+ and was bad news now strait from the condenser it runs about 160 and then i cut for volume.
So there are a few more steps in there.
Yeah I am trying to bag the charcoal. It seems after charcoal filtering the distillate turns quite medicinal in flavor or sharp, and even tho it is okay for mixed drinks it isn't quite as smooth as I would like.
Re: FNG!
From what I've read about charcoal filters, you need a 1.5" pipe 5' long. I made one 2' long and it will clean up about 3 quarts of neutral spirit with a slight off taste and turn it into great vodka. Any more than 3 quarts and it is a waste of time. I agree with most others on this forum, the best plan is to practicing to get a great neutral spirit without the need for carbon filtering. Carbon filtering sounds simple, but between setting up the filter, filtering ( took me 4 or 5 hours to do 3 quarts) then the carbon needs to be cleaned. Believe me, it is a hassle. Make better spirit from the start.
myerfire
myerfire
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Re: FNG!
That is the goal.myerfire wrote: Make better spirit from the start.
myerfire
I am mixed about the filtering(charcoal, crystals, cotton) all of that.
Sometimes i think (???) i should run the whole batch through the charcoal at least once, dump as much as possible and run a new tea flavored wash, distill that then run a water wash and run that.
Say $50 for 3 gal a little more time invested is still a good deal!
Re: FNG!
Hello, FNG.
Myerfire is right. If you need to use carbon to make it drinkable, then you ain't making it right in the first place.
Either your ferments, or your rig, or how you run it, need some tweaking. And in your case, I would be looking hard at that column design. It is a poor one, and there are much better ones around now. Liquid management (LM) or vapour management (VM) designs will do a much better job than that one.
Myerfire is right. If you need to use carbon to make it drinkable, then you ain't making it right in the first place.
Either your ferments, or your rig, or how you run it, need some tweaking. And in your case, I would be looking hard at that column design. It is a poor one, and there are much better ones around now. Liquid management (LM) or vapour management (VM) designs will do a much better job than that one.
Be safe.
Be discreet.
And have fun.
Be discreet.
And have fun.
Re: FNG!
I can make the same amount of neutral for less than half that cost...BootlegTurn wrote:Say $50 for 3 gal a little more time invested is still a good deal!
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Re: FNG!
Hey i appreciate the comments.
I can squeeze for more but the proof starts to fall off so i don't mess with it under 80.
I wouldn't get far with $25 the cost of turbo and clear is almost that. plus depending on where i get it $1 a pound for dextrose. I may be able to shop around more but their is a convenience factor.
I don't have to use the carbon.I did at first because it was on the instructions.
I use the turbo classic and it now is suggested to use a carbon packet with that i used it once but that was it.
I haven't seen much in the way of still designs, but i will look. Can I modify the one i have?
I am considering using the carbon to eliminate any of the turbo flavors so they don't throw off the stuff from the tea, and then re distilling with the tea so I can manage the notes better, however if i can find a way to improve my rig, and wash so i can avoid any unnecessary processes that would be ideal.
I can squeeze for more but the proof starts to fall off so i don't mess with it under 80.
I wouldn't get far with $25 the cost of turbo and clear is almost that. plus depending on where i get it $1 a pound for dextrose. I may be able to shop around more but their is a convenience factor.
I don't have to use the carbon.I did at first because it was on the instructions.
I use the turbo classic and it now is suggested to use a carbon packet with that i used it once but that was it.
I haven't seen much in the way of still designs, but i will look. Can I modify the one i have?
I am considering using the carbon to eliminate any of the turbo flavors so they don't throw off the stuff from the tea, and then re distilling with the tea so I can manage the notes better, however if i can find a way to improve my rig, and wash so i can avoid any unnecessary processes that would be ideal.
Re: FNG!
Try looking in the tried & true recipe's in the main menu, there are lots of recipe's that will only cost a few dollars to make and a fraction of the cost that you are paying, useing items that can be found in your supermaket/ grocers/ general store, fermented & run properly do not need carbon or filtering.
OLD DOG LEARNING NEW TRICKS ......
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Re: FNG!
I will, I am looking at the still designs at the moment.
from what I have seen i should be able to recycle most of my still to make a lm of vm,
thanks for the tips !
from what I have seen i should be able to recycle most of my still to make a lm of vm,
thanks for the tips !
Re: FNG!
Hi bootlegturn,
Just re-reading your post, and it sounds to me like you are looking to make whiskys, bourbons and grain type spirits?
If so, instead of looking at reflux stills, (which will give you vodka type spirits) you need to be looking at pot stills which is what you use for whiskeys, rums and bourbons, etc.
Looking at your current still, apart from the two tubes though the column, it looks a lot like a really tall pot still.. (which could be just want you need)
So anyway, BEFORE you start cutting up your still, make up one of these recipies. do NOT use turbo's use bakers or beer yeast.
Bourbon http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=725
Scotch whisky http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =14&t=4909
Rum http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =14&t=5994
When done, run the wash slowly through your still with no water going through your column, and all the scrubbers removed. Only run water through your condensor. put in glass bottle with oak. Try after a week. (Aw well, you can have a little taste straight away..
If you do it right, you will get a taste that is so amazing you will never look back.
Just re-reading your post, and it sounds to me like you are looking to make whiskys, bourbons and grain type spirits?
If so, instead of looking at reflux stills, (which will give you vodka type spirits) you need to be looking at pot stills which is what you use for whiskeys, rums and bourbons, etc.
Looking at your current still, apart from the two tubes though the column, it looks a lot like a really tall pot still.. (which could be just want you need)
So anyway, BEFORE you start cutting up your still, make up one of these recipies. do NOT use turbo's use bakers or beer yeast.
Bourbon http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=725
Scotch whisky http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =14&t=4909
Rum http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =14&t=5994
When done, run the wash slowly through your still with no water going through your column, and all the scrubbers removed. Only run water through your condensor. put in glass bottle with oak. Try after a week. (Aw well, you can have a little taste straight away..
If you do it right, you will get a taste that is so amazing you will never look back.
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Re: FNG!
That scotch seems pretty painless, and a quick rerouting of my coolant lines.
I may give that a shot.
However I am pretty sure i still need to make vodka.
Once i figure out what the hell the guys over in the column designs are talking about perhaps i should just build a new rig.
I am going over to the beer place today to get that book, I have been eye balling it since i started and I think it is time for me to get it.
But if I do build a new rig and convert the one I have to a "tall pot" what do u think about the Nixon?
I may give that a shot.
However I am pretty sure i still need to make vodka.
Once i figure out what the hell the guys over in the column designs are talking about perhaps i should just build a new rig.
I am going over to the beer place today to get that book, I have been eye balling it since i started and I think it is time for me to get it.
But if I do build a new rig and convert the one I have to a "tall pot" what do u think about the Nixon?
Re: FNG!
Im a vodka drinker myself, and I have a 7foot VM (Vapor Management) still which produces 95.5% thoughout the run. I have also just built a convertible pot still / thumper http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 15&t=11866
If you are set on a reflux, I would recommend the Vapor Management design, as they are real easy to run. the nixon stone will work, but a VM will be easier to make and run. I will say though, that you still want a nice clean wash with a reflux. you may only get 5% of the wash in there, but that 5% definitely affects the whole product..
I'm really enjoying the pot still / thumper at the moment. You have to have a really good wash, but it produces the most wonderful spirits. Im thinking about running a vodka through the doubler too, and see how it goes...
If you are set on a reflux, I would recommend the Vapor Management design, as they are real easy to run. the nixon stone will work, but a VM will be easier to make and run. I will say though, that you still want a nice clean wash with a reflux. you may only get 5% of the wash in there, but that 5% definitely affects the whole product..
I'm really enjoying the pot still / thumper at the moment. You have to have a really good wash, but it produces the most wonderful spirits. Im thinking about running a vodka through the doubler too, and see how it goes...
Re: FNG!
I just did some recalculating last night and found that my All Bran recipe costs me roughly $1.50 per gallon of wash to produce, all in, including electricity to make the wash and distill distill... My Gerber recipe costs something like $1.75 per gallon of wash... These figures even take into account the added boiled yeast and 20-20-20 that gives them more of a turbo ferment time without the turbo side effects... These calculations are for 14% wash... But even if I was to run them at 12% it would roughly cost me $12 per gallon of 95% neutral spirits... Cut that to a drinkable proof and I'm at $6 per gallon using generic store brand All Bran... Using Gerber I'm looking at $7 per gallon...
So, why would I ever use turbo yeast...??? I wouldn't... Another advantage is that I can mess around with my still configuration, mess with take off temperatures and speeds, and still end up with drinkable spirits right off the still - even in pot still strip mode...
So, why would I ever use turbo yeast...??? I wouldn't... Another advantage is that I can mess around with my still configuration, mess with take off temperatures and speeds, and still end up with drinkable spirits right off the still - even in pot still strip mode...
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Re: FNG!
I went to the supply place i use today and bought the book"complete distiller" I should have gotten that a long time ago???
I use the turbo because that is where I started, and i was lucky enough to find these forums based on a web search looking for alternatives, and that is where I am at now.
Plonker,
yes, I would like a nice vodka still. I don't think I have wash issues, and why would I only get 5% of my wash in it? I am looking at vm designs, what type of head? shotgun or the other.
I like building stuff and am okay at it, this is my other metal type project.Ha and an old bad of grain i tried in that box on the floor.
I will have to look up strip mode? I am not really sure what that means.
This is a very easy wash I use 10lbs of sugar 16oz of wheat germ 1 tsp of citric acid I put all of that in a 5 gallon pot fill it close to the top with water and let it boil for about 1 and 1/2 hours then pour it in my 6 and 1/2 gallon fermenter top it off to 6 gallons total with water let it cool then add my yeast. I like to use red star champagne yeast it is only 79 cents around here. it should ferment in about 3-4 days be careful I have had this recipe blow the bubbler out and put a dent in my ceiling.
This was recommended, and I am going to start it next week, i have to paint my house this weekend. If I wasn't using turbo maybe i could afford to have someone do it for me but oh well. Oh I am on city water ++ chlorine so i buy my water too, but I am going to start using the stuff from my buddies well.
It is late and i need to go look something up in that book.
Thanks.
I use the turbo because that is where I started, and i was lucky enough to find these forums based on a web search looking for alternatives, and that is where I am at now.
Plonker,
yes, I would like a nice vodka still. I don't think I have wash issues, and why would I only get 5% of my wash in it? I am looking at vm designs, what type of head? shotgun or the other.
I like building stuff and am okay at it, this is my other metal type project.Ha and an old bad of grain i tried in that box on the floor.
I will have to look up strip mode? I am not really sure what that means.
This is a very easy wash I use 10lbs of sugar 16oz of wheat germ 1 tsp of citric acid I put all of that in a 5 gallon pot fill it close to the top with water and let it boil for about 1 and 1/2 hours then pour it in my 6 and 1/2 gallon fermenter top it off to 6 gallons total with water let it cool then add my yeast. I like to use red star champagne yeast it is only 79 cents around here. it should ferment in about 3-4 days be careful I have had this recipe blow the bubbler out and put a dent in my ceiling.
This was recommended, and I am going to start it next week, i have to paint my house this weekend. If I wasn't using turbo maybe i could afford to have someone do it for me but oh well. Oh I am on city water ++ chlorine so i buy my water too, but I am going to start using the stuff from my buddies well.
It is late and i need to go look something up in that book.
Thanks.
Re: FNG!
BootlegTurn, that would be the Deatwhish Wheat Germ (DWWG) recipe from the Tried and True section... Many members swear by it... I run it several times a year...
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Re: FNG!
You are correct it was late, so I missed the acronym, and Plonker shared the link.
What kind of Abv do you get with the (DWWG) nvm i will look and see if i can find some numbers.
What kind of Abv do you get with the (DWWG) nvm i will look and see if i can find some numbers.
Re: FNG!
The ABV depends on the amount of sugar you use... I shoot for a 12 - 14 %ABV wash, personally... I use a copy of the sugar wash calculator on the parent site, but pretty much have the percentage requirements memorized...BootlegTurn wrote:You are correct it was late, so I missed the acronym, and Plonker shared the link.
What kind of Abv do you get with the (DWWG) nvm i will look and see if i can find some numbers.