What'd ya'll make today?

Production methods from starch to sugars.

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japsinok
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by japsinok »

speedfreaksteve wrote:
japsinok wrote:Mashed another 10 gallon/20# bourbon bill (14.4# TSC cracked corn, 3.6#rye, 2# 6-row). They typically finish out at OG just north of 1.07 (I'll know in the morning). Will set up the fermenters in the morning, pending successful OG and iodine, and they should be bubbling away by tomorrow evening.
1.07 is decent if you get that consistently. Do you have your mash process in a post somewhere, or can you tell us?
I PM'ed it to someone but just now dawned on me that is not public. What I am making is a variation of NCHooch's Carolina Bourbon. I don't recall if I posted my protocol in that thread, though that might be the best place This morning the mash BRIXed at 17 = 1.07. I have taken things from reading reading reading to come up with what works for me, and also modified a burner to NG and about 45,000 BTU so heat up is reasonably quick and never need to replenish propane. It takes overall about 36 hrs (which includes most of a full day) so some may not want to take that much time, but it works for me. All that said, here is my protocol:

Hydrate 14.4# TSC cracked corn in 5 gal water + 2 gal backseat overnight in 60qt BOP.
Next morning, heat to 160F, turn off heat and add 2 cups 6-row and 1Tbsp alpha amylase (BSG amylase enzyme formula powder). Rest for 30 mins to loosen corn.
Return to heat with near constant stirring to bring to boil, reduce heat to a simmer/low boil for 1hr, stirring every few minutes to gelatinize the corn without scorching. Turn off power and add 2 gal water to bring temp down to about 175F. (I don't yet have a drill mixer mounted so this hour cook is the most taxing, having to stir almost constantly with a 42in SS paddle).
Allow to cool to 160F and add 2Tbsp alpha amylase + 2 Tbsp CaCl2 (though the Ca may not be needed with grains).
Cover with lid and blankets for several hours, then remove blankets and allow to cool to 145F.
Add malt grains (3.6#rye + 2# 6-row barley) and 2Tbsp glucoamylase (Novozyme AG300L) to saccharrify.
Bring temp back to 140F with heat, cover with lid and blankets.
At the end of day, return to heat to bring back to 140F and add 1 Tbsp glucoamylase +1Tbsp alpha-amylase to replenish enzymes (I read glucoamylase lasts about 2hr at these temps before it denatures).
Check OG (refractometer) and iodine in the morning (currently yesterday's mash is at 1.07 and passes the iodine check).
Split into two fermenters (9 gals liquid + 20# grains fills my two fermenters) and allow to cool to under 90F.
Add 1/2 cup oyster shells to each fermenter.
Hydrate and pitch 10g DADY into each fermenter. I ferment on the grain.
Ferment at constant 80F. Usually finishes out about FG=1.002-1.000 in 4 days.
From these, I can always strain and press 8 gals of wort to strip, 4 gals from each, which is perfect for charging my 5 gal alembic.

YMMV

I began this AG adventure about the time TB and SRD began their thread (SRD and I) so I have enjoyed keeping up with their progress.

I'm still new to AG so I appreciate any comments on the technique.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by Jimbo »

Getting 1.07 from 2lbs/gal using cracked corn is a noble feat indeed. But what you describe is an AWFUL LOT OF WORK. Have you checked out the no boil methods posted by many here, including in my bourbon recipe below? So simple, starting with boiling water over the corn, with some high temp enzymes. Wrapped and stirred occasionally for 3 hours until the temp drops to mash in temps for the malt. Done. 2.5lbs/gal will get you there with cracked corn, or 2 lbs/gal when using corn meal.

Not criticizing what you've done, and will say congrats on dialing in the efficiency so nice. But there's much much easier ways to skin the hide off that cat if youre so inclined.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by japsinok »

Jimbo wrote:Getting 1.07 from 2lbs/gal using cracked corn is a noble feat indeed. But what you describe is an AWFUL LOT OF WORK. Have you checked out the no boil methods posted by many here, including in my bourbon recipe below? So simple, starting with boiling water over the corn, with some high temp enzymes. Wrapped and stirred occasionally for 3 hours until the temp drops to mash in temps for the malt. Done. 2.5lbs/gal will get you there with cracked corn, or 2 lbs/gal when using corn meal.

Not criticizing what you've done, and will say congrats on dialing in the efficiency so nice. But there's much much easier ways to skin the hide off that cat if youre so inclined.
Thanks for the feedback, and no offense taken at all. Constructive criticism is exactly that.... constructive!
At present I will stick with this protocol until this experiment is concluded, the conclusion being 5 gallons of spirit run hearts in a barrel and enough leftover for aging in glass with toasted and charred sticks, especially since I already have the alpha- and low temp glucoamylase on hand.

In the future, I will definitely try my hand at other less tedious methods like your no-boil method and hi-temp enzymes, but since all I know at present is how I have done it till now, ignorance is bliss since I'm getting 1.07. Once I am no longer ignorant of the shorter mashing times, I might get pissed at myself for having wasted so much time, though I can always file this knowledge away as useful learning experience. I'm thinking about a blue corn mash for the next adventure in AG mashing (if I can source enough blue corn cheaply), so will definitely read over the no-boil methods that I can adapt for my use.

Gotta crawl before you walk (UJSSM), and walk before you run (AG)!!
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der wo
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by der wo »

japsinok,
I like your procedure. My mashing is complicated too. But I get good numbers like you...
My procedure is complicated and needs much time, but because I have a stirrer mount on the mashing pot, it is effortless. Mashing and cooling down without using a wort chiller, it needs 24h, but all in all there is not much to do.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

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der wo wrote:japsinok,
I like your procedure. My mashing is complicated too. But I get good numbers like you...
My procedure is complicated and needs much time, but because I have a stirrer mount on the mashing pot, it is effortless. Mashing and cooling down without using a wort chiller, it needs 24h, but all in all there is not much to do.
Thanks! Much of the procedure I have developed has come from reading many of your posts. For that I am most appreciative. You have identified the two things on my to do/wish list: automatic mixer and wort chiller. But frankly, the biggest time sink is the heat up and stirring for 1 hr. The other steps consist mostly of waiting on cooling and enzyme activity. I can take care of other things (and sleep) during these periods so it's not like I have to pay attention to it all day long.

Having converted a big burner is also helpful (as long as you keep stirring the pot to prevent scorching). With this burner, I can heat 7 gals liquid +14# corn from room temp to 160F for the alpha-amylase rest in less than 30 mins (closer to 20 when there is no wind). Then taking it up to boiling after the 160F rest is also quick (about another 15 mins). But stirring is key so I really want that mixer mounted above the pot.

But I do like to learn new things and new ways so I'll certainly look for ways to use the no-cook methods and see if I can still achieve reasonable SG.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by thumper123 »

Very interesting. We never had any phenyl - had to rely on wood ashes.

Anyway, my second run of scotch came out a little better than the first. I took considerable tails from the first, and added them to the second run. It would appear at this very early experimental stage that the tails hold lots of flavor just like corn. I'll blend everything and put it all on oak for a couple years, and see what it looks like then. In the meantime, I'm sticking with my tried and true - bourbon.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by cranky »

Finally got around to starting to run off the 2nd go round of Cheez-it. Unfortunately I didn't do something right and it sat for too long and mother came calling :( When I opened the lid I found 3 inches of mother and 30 gallons of cheezy flavored vinegar :sick: I decided to run the first half of it anyway and see what I can salvage. It took a lot of fiddling with the flute but I did manage to get 4 quarts out of 13 gallons of wash. I guess that isn't too bad considering I could have just thrown it out. I even got one pint that is actually cheez-it flavored :lol: While this wash gets a lot of grain flavor, It's hard to get that cheezy goodness to come over because it happens so late in the tails, I think in the next few days I will go ahead and run off the other half and see if I can manage to get an entire cheezy bottle. The remainder will go to the big neutral run I am planning in a few months.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by japsinok »

What did I make today? ...a broken proof and tralles alcoholometer. Dammit!!!!
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by jb-texshine »

japsinok wrote:What did I make today? ...a broken proof and tralles alcoholometer. Dammit!!!!
You gotta keep a Prozac in the case with them if you wanna keep them long....otherwise they get suicidal :wink: buying two or three at time helps too,they don't get as depressed when they travel in a herd.

Today I made bad alcometer jokes, tonight I shine! Either 15 gallons of thinmash corn or 40gallons of corn and oat uj,most waiting till after dinner to run something.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by japsinok »

jb-texshine wrote:
japsinok wrote:What did I make today? ...a broken proof and tralles alcoholometer. Dammit!!!!
You gotta keep a Prozac in the case with them if you wanna keep them long....otherwise they get suicidal :wink: buying two or three at time helps too,they don't get as depressed when they travel in a herd.

Today I made bad alcometer jokes, tonight I shine! Either 15 gallons of thinmash corn or 40gallons of corn and oat uj,most waiting till after dinner to run something.
This one definitely committed suicide. Was putting it back in the tube and the other end came out. Shot right through to the floor and into shards. Fortunately the lhbs is only a 10 minute drive.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by jb-texshine »

Cut a piece of copper pipe big enough for your alcometer plus 1.5" ,solder an end cap on one end and put a bit of ss scrubbie in the end cap then for the top another endcap and bit of scrubbie just pushed on. Gives you a carry tube and test tube that won't get brittle when exposed to alcohol...
Jbt
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by japsinok »

jb-texshine wrote:Cut a piece of copper pipe big enough for your alcometer plus 1.5" ,solder an end cap on one end and put a bit of ss scrubbie in the end cap then for the top another endcap and bit of scrubbie just pushed on. Gives you a carry tube and test tube that won't get brittle when exposed to alcohol...
Jbt
Yep,I've done it too...
Thanks for the tip. I will definitely make something like what you describe to imprison my new alcometer in its jail cell when it is not in use.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by japsinok »

Kept the li'l 5 gallon alembic busy all day today. Ran two stripping runs in the AM, of my high rye carolina bourbon. Picked up a new alcometer to replace the one I broke. Added today's stripping runs to the two previous strips to charge the still for a spirit run this evening. I think maybe I am beginning to get the hang of cuts, though much more practice will be required!! I supplied power to the spirit run to where there was just a steady drip-drip, with only an occasional stream. Collected 30x200ml fractions over 4.5 hrs. I was finally able to discern many differences between the cuts all across the run, from where the heads began to lose aroma, through the hearts which had almost no nose, but were very spicy, into the sweet fragrances of the tails. It's VERY different from UJSSM!! I have never had a preference for white dog but those hearts cuts were so spicy, with no harshness at all when diluted to 40%. And now I have the flavors that I hope will come out in an all-feints run to look forward to. I'll need to make at least one more spirit run to collect enough hearts to fill my 20l barrel (perhaps two runs), but I keep getting more excited about this first adventure in AG mashing, and continue to learn more and more along the way. Can barely wait so taste what amber goodness emerges from the barrel, with it being this good going in!!
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by Rain Distillate »

Currently making a batch with 50 lbs cracked corn. See how it goes. Is there any reason I shouldn't melt my sugar while the corn gelatanizes? I figure while it's hot why not melt the sugar too? I haven't added any sugar yet but I was just curious to the concept.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by der wo »

While gelatinizing it's thick. And sugar makes it even thicker.
I would add it later. Perhaps 1 hour after adding the malt or the glucoamylase.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by Rain Distillate »

der wo wrote:While gelatinizing it's thick. And sugar makes it even thicker.
I would add it later. Perhaps 1 hour after adding the malt or the glucoamylase.
Thanks
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by Rain Distillate »

After some good stirring I noticed a handful or so of small twigs and burdocks in the cracked corn. It's already been sitting in 180 degree f hot water for a few hours now and I'm just curious if anyone's pulled anything like this out of their corn before. Came from my local hardware store. I called the manufacturer and they said it's 100% cracked sifted corn with zero preservatives. Just curious about the "extras" I received in the corn and the impact it may or may not have in my mash.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by MmmPeace »

I made my first 2nd generation ujssm, wow is it good! I immediately started gen 3 :thumbup:
Anything is possible, just takes a massive influx of time and cash.

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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by yakattack »

50 gallons/20kg sugar wash. Cleaner for boiler and flute and some neutral to boot.

30l of molasses (feed grade) with 30ish gallons of water. Going to steep feed 8kg of white sugar along with another 20 gallons of water for a rum. Total potential for the rum. 15l of molasses is just over 21kg. At just above 50% sugar weight which puts it at 6.4%potential alcohol by weight before the aditional 8kg of white sugar to be fed in 2 steps.

Both fermenting using bakers yeast and took off like rockets.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

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yakattack wrote:50 gallons/20kg sugar wash. Cleaner for boiler and flute and some neutral to boot.

30l of molasses (feed grade) with 30ish gallons of water. Going to steep feed 8kg of white sugar along with another 20 gallons of water for a rum. Total potential for the rum. 15l of molasses is just over 21kg. At just above 50% sugar weight which puts it at 6.4%potential alcohol by weight before the aditional 8kg of white sugar to be fed in 2 steps.

Both fermenting using bakers yeast and took off like rockets.
Just a random update. Less than 24 hours an the molly wash was fermented dry. I've never had a ferment finish that fast. Confirmed this by the aditional of 2 kg of white sugar. 20 min later it's back to rolling boil activity in the fermenter. I'm going to have to keep this yeast bed for successive generations.
HDNB wrote: The trick here is to learn what leads to a stalled mash....and quit doing that.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by Shine0n »

Just finished my first AG bourbon, ended up with 3 .75 quarts of hearts at 65.5%
Very pleased with this recipe!
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by masonsjax »

Stripping some grain & sugar wash for vodka today. I haven't done a run in a while, nice to be stillin today!
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by Jimbo »

Emptied a 5 gallon barrel of a breakfast stout (oats and coffee added). Barrel was aging my last batch of bourbon for 2 years, then the stout went in for a few months, now another whiskey went in. MichiganCornhusker has a post on here about doing this, and it seems to be all the rage lately gong round and round with these barrels so I thought Id jump on the train. I did a little rinse first to get the settled yeast and loose black beer out. Then put 2 gallons in of assorted stuff I had laying around... 3 quarts of bourbon I left white from 2015, 3 quarts of aged triple smoke and 4 quarts of aged bourbon. Each a couple years old too. Triple smoke is the batch for the S3:15 get together in Pagosa.

Anyway, if I had a fresh batch of white I would have used that but I didnt, and the 100 lbs of cornmeal waiting dont do me no good until its turned into ethanol. :)
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by Odin »

Whipped up some 100 liters of molasses ferment the day before yesterday. And yesterday I started a 400 liter Turbo ferment. Both will be used for another 3-day workshop. After that the rum will go in a barrel, the Turbo GNS will be used as for cleaning and testing runs on new stills.

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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by wtfdskin »

14 jars into a 10 gal double thumped spirit run of my first all molasses rum

And contemplating how im going to turn this extra ice cream mixer motor into a mash stirrer
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by MichiganCornhusker »

So, Jimbo, how's the stout? Sounds good.

We're the whiskeys you poured back in cask strength or was some of it proofed down?
That Pagosa recipe is a good one, I just made another 50 gallon mash to put some away.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by Pikey »

13.5 LItres Apple Juice and 9 litres Red Grape (2.7 kg fermentable sugar) and 2 kg additional. ec 1118 yeast. I usually make wine out of this - I'll see what it turns out like cooked :)
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

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MichiganCornhusker wrote:So, Jimbo, how's the stout? Sounds good.

We're the whiskeys you poured back in cask strength or was some of it proofed down?
That Pagosa recipe is a good one, I just made another 50 gallon mash to put some away.
Stout is good. Surprisingly sweet from the barrel. Mashed at 152 so not so much from the mash temp. Anyway, just had a glass flat so far, the carbonic acid after carbonation should (hopefully) balance a little of the sweetness.

The whiskeys were all still at barrel strength 62% or so. I dont water them down until I bottle.

I dont think Ill leave the whiskey in there too long. I seem to pull 3.5g from a 5g barrel, so the damn angels already got their share, fuckers. With 2 gal in there, it might turn into 1g if I forget about it and likely to walk in on the angels sittin around having a party.
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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by japsinok »

Back to mashing my AG high rye bourbon this weekend after a two week absence, out of town for work. Again, mashed 20# grains in 10 gals that came to OG=1.07 again. Feeling good about the consistency of my mashing on this recipe. Pitched 10gm DADY in each fermenter and the first CO2 came through the airlock in less than an hour. Never had it take off that quickly.

As an aside, MI does seem the place to be for this hobby!!! While I was away, I was in Ann Arbor at a restaurant waiting for my table. Overheard a fellow greet his party by telling them he had just begun distilling bourbon. As he showed them photos on his phone of his operation, their still and the rackhouse, I really wanted to jump in that conversation!! Didn't catch the name of the distillery, but wish I had.

Alas, now I'm back in the Southern Plains mashing 10 gals at a time!!

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Re: What'd ya'll make today?

Post by masonsjax »

I did some brewing today, simple small mash and sugar. Now have 20 more gallons fermenting for vodka.
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