my first rye

[whisky bent 44]

Last night i finished my first rye whiskey run. I desolved 25lb of sugar in a few gallons of water in my fermenter and in my big canning pot on the stove i cooked off 12lb corn with 1lb malted barly and 1lb rye flake at roughly 150' for an hour. I say roughly because i had a hard time maintaining tempeture. I managed to stay between 148 and 160 and i cooked and stirred it contuously for 1 hourright at the end i added my amylase as i left it for 30 minutes to rest then dumped it into my sugar wash and added my liquer quick super yeast. This is the first concoction i ever put together that generated its own heat during fermentation. It was at 88' 3 days into the ferment. Now when i put a mash together i always set my sg at 1.090 unless the recipee states otherwise i ended up with 10gallons of wash and it came off starting at 148 proof after toxins were removed and i cut it off at 108 proof as the amount of product could no longer justify the use of gas. Smells good tastes a little strong on flavor. But i combined all my collections and ened up with 128 proof and im thinking if i proof it down to 80 maybe the taste will mellow out a bit. Almost forgot. Neccessity teally is the mother of invention or jerry riggin lol. I took a 5 gallon plastic water jug n cut the bottom out then drilled 1/2" holes in that bottom like a pepper shaker design the was able to force it into the remainder of the jug it locked into the premolded ring in the jug closest to the spout. I then used a straining bag i got from my local wine maker supply store and it fit nicely into my soon to be filter and had plenty to fold over the out side i put a hole in the lid if another fermenter and poured and filtered all that wash in no time. It held all the grain i had in that mash and i let it set over night to drain. Works great. Ok so i expect a little slack but i wana hear it so help me tell me what u think

[ga flatwoods]

You made a corn mash with a rye adjunct, basically a sugar head corn whiskey. You did not need to add your amylase. You had p l e n t y of sugar at 2.5 lbs per gallon. In a year from now come back and read this post Whiskey, you will see a few things that need a better understanding of. Now that you have some practice, go back and read again the parts of the distillation process , terms used with it, and cuts particularly. Instead of the bag for the homebrew store that you paid to much for, you could have bought three five gallon paint straining bags with elastic bands for the same price and the supply store.
Read on, and continue to practice. Both go hand in hand. and, Congratulations.
Ga Flatwoods

[Bigbob]

Well I'll try to be gentle...... Why the sugar?
Or if you wanted a sugar wash why the enzymes? And defininlty why the turbo? All these contribute to 'strong' flavors. Try a tried and true recipe and learn it. Then you can experiment.

Posted same time as GaFlatwoods

[woodshed]

I will be gentle as well.

Dammmmmmmmmmmmn.

[SassyFrass]

WB44,

If you wouldn't mind, could you humor a big ol' dumb hillbilly?

This is the bill for UJSSM:
Ingredients

For a 5 gallon mash: (~19 liters)
5 gallons soft, filtered water.
7 lbs (3.2kg) cracked corn. 6-8 pieces/kernel is the proper crack. If using bird feed, make sure it is perishable, or in other words is free of preservatives.
7 lbs (3.2kg) of granulated sugar.
1 tbsp yeast (distillers yeast if available.)

If you want a rye taste in your likker, substitute 3.5 lbs of cracked corn and 3.5 lbs of cracked or flaked rye. Instead of a full 7 lbs of corn.
Also instead of turbo yeast, try the distillers or (IMO even better) regular old bakers yeast. (from the iga or Kroger or whatever.)
Run the recipe as it is in T&T.
Double it for a 10 gallon wash, if you want.

Temper this and yours to drinking proof (80-100) and taste. If this don't taste better, I'll be really surprised.

Or don't. It's your call.

[phillmystill]

. Smells good tastes a little strong on flavor. But i combined all my collections and ened up with 128 proof and im thinking if i proof it down to 80 maybe the taste will mellow out a bit.

Please don't tell us you were thinking of drinking it at that strength. 128 proof is a fine strength for ageing on wood (to later be proofed down to 100 or below) but can cause severe damage to the body's tissues if consumed that strong. Personally I wouldn't even sample taste anything that strong with first diluting with water.

I also didn't see anything about what cuts you made other than " it came off starting at 148 proof after toxins were removed and i cut it off at 108 proof as the amount of product could no longer justify the use of gas."

I don't wish to sound harsh, but you did ask for a critique.

[whisky bent 44]

Thanks fellas n yes i did ask for ur honesty. Sassy frass i will try ur way. And i will explain my way of thinking. First let me say i have read and reread alot but i do have a reading comprehension problem. Knowing that. Ive always used sugar in my washes to increase alcahol production. I didnt realize i was defeating my own purpose. I used to use bread yeast but i had gotten away from it because my super yeast is cheaper and it has a cleaner taste and doesnt require as much and has up to 20% abv i do get more with it. My excuse for enzyme is gona be me contradicting myself. But ill go ahead n do it. I seen a youtube video and he said if ur makeing grain with out enzyme ur just makeing sugar shine he said u neef the enzyme to get ur flavors and i used to do corn with sugar and i used to cook it just the same way i did in this rye mess i just made. And he was right it smelled better then my sugar shine but tasted the same so i hadnt done no grains since so now i got some amylace and had some extra money to play with and decided to try a grain again and of coarse i used the amylace to get my flavors. And i had just said in one of my posts that the internet is only as accurate as the person posting the info. Lol bit my own nose off go ahead n slay me... but thats why im here as i said in my first post here i wana make a better product and learn from u all. I still have 38lbs of crack corn and 9 lbs of malted barly so im up for another attempt and rye is easy to get as well

[whisky bent 44]

Any ways thank you all for ur comments and no need to go easy i have thick skin. And if nobody tells me i may never know my mistakes. I dont personally know anybody who does this so ive adopted u guys as my mentors. Oh phil u ask about cuts ive done this awhile but ive never really made cuts. Ive tryed the taste thing and never really could seperate the differant cuts that way. I guess im not really sure what im looking for. Im open for any thing u all wana offer here

[WalkingWolf]

I will be gentle as well.

Dammmmmmmmmmmmn.

Nice to see the New Years resolution has held up to this point. Take a deep breath 'shed.

[whisky bent 44]

I know ive got some reading to do. Ive been doing so its gona take me some time to take it in and process the information. I just need a little time. Apparently ive been doing it wrong for a while.i will get this right thats my goal. Thats why im here. With my sugar shine in my opinion cuts werent important i just took off my toxins 1oz per gallon of wash i usually take a few extra ofg to make sure i got all the bad stuff but my sugar shine went into drinks apple pie, apple cinnamon, dream cycle. I desolved candy in it and even packs of koolaid. And once it set a week or so it tasted pretty damn good but to drink it straight is harsh. But since it was mixed in these drinks there was no sence in proofing it down either it would get proofed down in the mix. And i have made some batches that come off at 150 and went down smooth and didnt burn till it hit bottom. But thats very hard to replicate.

[carbohydratesn]

You can safely ignore just about anything anyone says about distillation in a youtube video. There is a lot of bad (mostly dangerous) advice being thrown around over there.

Do lots of reading - lots and lots of reading - and you'll turn things around. Here's a good place to start, reading all of the linked posts in this list a few times will give you a great all-around set of knowledge - http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 15&t=52975

[rad14701]

You used turbo yeast with grain, and sugar, and are surprised that it generated its own heat... And off tastes and smells, in most cases... If you want flavor, back down on the target %ABV of your washes... You aren't making fuel so forget about the 20% ABV potential that turbo yeast can attain... I can push bakers yeast that high too, having pushed to over 19% before to prove the point, but that doesn't mean I want to do it on a regular basis...

Take the time to do the research... If you have comprehension issues, deal with it... More times than not it has more to do with a wandering mind than an actual comprehension issues... You either want to get to the point of doing things right and being successful or you want to make excuses and continue in your [slather-ass | hodge podge| insert term here] ways... Not being harsh, merely pointing out an different perspective than you have portrayed... In short, you can, and should, do better... Slow down and arm yourself with the required knowledge before proceeding... Trust me, you'll be glad you did...

Things will get better from here...!!!

[phillmystill]

Any ways thank you all for ur comments and no need to go easy i have thick skin. And if nobody tells me i may never know my mistakes. I dont personally know anybody who does this so ive adopted u guys as my mentors. Oh phil u ask about cuts ive done this awhile but ive never really made cuts. Ive tryed the taste thing and never really could seperate the differant cuts that way. I guess im not really sure what im looking for. Im open for any thing u all wana offer here

Hi wb44, there's a lot of good threads about making cuts on here. I collect my product in about 20 numbered jars (small equal amounts in each) cover them with some clean cloth or filter paper, leave them 24 - 48 hours to air before trying to determine cuts. Start in the middle smell, dilute a sample and taste (don't swallow) wash your mouth out and move to the next jar.

Heads (when diluted) may smell chemically, occasionally fruity, may sting your nose, but will definitely sting your mouth when you taste.

Hearts (when diluted) shouldn't sting your nose or your mouth, should taste much smoother, maybe even slightly sweet.

Tails smell like wet dog or damp cardboard and may taste bitter.

That's just my take, but the most important thing is to let the samples air before trying to make cuts.

[SassyFrass]

Any ways thank you all for ur comments and no need to go easy i have thick skin. And if nobody tells me i may never know my mistakes. I dont personally know anybody who does this so ive adopted u guys as my mentors. Oh phil u ask about cuts ive done this awhile but ive never really made cuts. Ive tryed the taste thing and never really could seperate the differant cuts that way. I guess im not really sure what im looking for. Im open for any thing u all wana offer here

Hi wb44, there's a lot of good threads about making cuts on here. I collect my product in about 20 numbered jars (small equal amounts in each) cover them with some clean cloth or filter paper, leave them 24 - 48 hours to air before trying to determine cuts. Start in the middle smell, dilute a sample and taste (don't swallow) wash your mouth out and move to the next jar.

Heads (when diluted) may smell chemically, occasionally fruity, may sting your nose, but will definitely sting your mouth when you taste.

Hearts (when diluted) shouldn't sting your nose or your mouth, should taste much smoother, maybe even slightly sweet.

Tails smell like wet dog or damp cardboard and may taste bitter.

That's just my take, but the most important thing is to let the samples air before trying to make cuts.

WB,
I don't know your back ground, but cuts are a difficult thing to learn and master. Phil just gave you the condensed version that is spot on.

Old timers collected in one container, tempered everything to one % or proof (usually 90- 105 proof) and shipped it off to be sold. They worried about volume/quantity. I don't worry about volume/quantity. I worry about quality.
I collect in pint jars. So I only keep what I consider the best of the run for aging and flavoring. Everything else except fores goes into the backings/feints jug. Fores are a great metal cleaner, degreaser, etc...so that gets used around the farm too.

The UJSSM recipe can be adjusted for all kinds of flavors to come thru. Just keep the same total amount of grain. But you can change the percentages of the grain to change the flavor of your product. The sugar makes the alcohol, but the grain gives it the flavor.
I've said it before, the recipe for UJSSM is extremely versatile and you can get all kinds of different grain flavors to play with, from this one simple recipe.

[whisky bent 44]

Thankyou guys. I appreciate ur efferts to help me here. Dont think ur efforts are in vein im takeing all the advice i can get. Rad done blew my mind ur spot on with the wondering mind issue. It distracts reading and actually keeps me up at night. I never really thought of that. I do it when people talk to me to. Im not crazy really lol but yea theres a ton of truth in what rad said there. Im learning about my self here to. Man i appreciate u guys. I promise to learn all i can if u all dont mind teaching and beleive me when i tell u im here every night reafing ur articles trying to obsorbe all i can here. I have questions but its not time for them yet. I havent covered that area of study yet

[whisky bent 44]

Oh u mentioned what u do with ur toxins. I use mine to wipe down my bottles wine and whisky that stuff is awsome on glass and it removes the ink from them permanent scripto markers to and runs a lawn mower just fine. Not so good in a 2 stroke weed eater though. We light the grill and our camp fires with it as well. I wonder if it will deice locks and how well it will work in the windsheild washer tank. Any ways yea good stuff

[W Pappy]

Well little feller looks like the big boys is in good spirits today,not much of a drubbing at tal.
Just fallow what these fellas said above on the Ujssm, and come back in a week or so and tell us
the difference in likker.Git rid of that turbo crap good ol bakers will do ya fine.

[woodshed]

Aim for 8%. Best bang for your buck. You can buy DADY yeast online a lot cheaper than that Turbo crap. And make superior product.
Your experience in distilling tells me you should focus on a tried and true recipe for awhile.
Quickest way to being successful is copying those who were. Then adding your own twist. And sharing that with the community.
So much to share and learn here.

[whisky bent 44]

Will do. Ill do the bakers yeast ive used it befor and hadnt had much trouble. Ive used red star dady distillers yeast once and it went so slow ( 4 weeks ) i added yeast nuetrient to try to jump start it i added yeast energizer to try to jump start it i added turbo yeast. Not all at once of coarse and my temp was 76 i use an aquarium heater in a water jug to maintain temp i did everything except throw a peice of raw chicken in there. I read that raw chicken thing in the alaskan bootleggers bible. I just cant bring myself to do that one. Theres a horse turd recipee too nope we'll just move along from that one to. Ok i wont drag this on im gona do as u said and i wont make no changes. Thank you and God bless

[carbohydratesn]

I read that raw chicken thing in the alaskan bootleggers bible. I just cant bring myself to do that one. Theres a horse turd recipee too nope we'll just move along from that one to.

Well you've got a good head on your shoulders, those sound silly.

[W Pappy]

Dead possum works damned fine too hahaha.

[whisky bent 44]

Lol the raw chicken is supposed to jump start a stalled mash with its bacteria... that may work but i dont know much about bacteria. If theres good and bad or if its all bad. And the horse turd is a similar deal but is supposed to float on top like a cap and keep out bad yeasts and other bad things. The author is really obnoxious but the book come recomendef so i spent $25 on it n read it. It covers beer,wine and whiskey makeing and discuss' several differant kinds of still includeing the desk drawer still which i find interesting. Its a continuous still but apparently is dangerous. Its made from a soldering iron and tubeing and is drip fed which creates steam and at that points seperates water from alcahol. I dont fully understand it. I havent studied it very much but in my oppinion if its an explossion hazzard shouldnt have been mentioned and illistrated the way the way the author did. He gives a general idea about the beer, wine and spirits but hes not real indepth on any ove it

[Bigbob]

Please Whiskey bent,please please please read crankys spoon feeding post. Then go to tried and true and pick out a good starting recipe, either the sweet feed or UJSSM are perfect. Do the recipe exactly and then still. No more talk of raw chicken please.

[whisky bent 44]

Lmao u got it big bob my thoughts exactly. Im gona do just that. Ujssm step by step and a big bite on crankys spoonfeeding. U all take care. Ill see u back here in a few weeks with some results.

[NcGunny]

Forget the Turbo crap! All I have ever found is it causes unwanted crap flavor. Bakers yeast is great..but I am a Dady confirmed user. Dady isnt quite as versatile as plain ole bakers though,it works best between 80-85 deg temp. I have some barrel belts that were modified to only heat to 85deg. Total cost was 1quart of honey shine that magically appeared on the friends back porch. Go with the advice of collection pints for cuts,after a bit ya can start using a spoon. I put 3-4 drios in a spoon with 2-3 drios of water and taste. But I have to use collections on new recipes.

[whisky bent 44]

Thanks for the advice Gunny. I just wanted to check back with an update. I actually just started ujssm today. I had a question or 2 but that post is locked so i did what i thought best on the first issue. I used hot water to desolve the sugar but just hot enough about 120'. I didnt cool it with cold water i let it cool on its own. Ill pitch the yeast when it gets into the 80s i figure this if this is wrong its minor my second question hasnt come to point yet. And i do beleive its kind of a dumb question. When i get to my second run the feints or as the recipee says the entire product of the first run is to go back in. Now that goes into the boiler not the fermenter right? Because the extra alcahol would kill off the yeast befor all the sugar is consumed right?

[whisky bent 44]

As far as ujssm im doing a double batch i have an sg of 60 ill pitch bakers yeast when the temp gets to about 85. Not much else to report. Ill check back in a few days

[Bigbob]

No the lees in the pot still after distilling go back in the corn. You save the first run and mix that with the wash when ready. And the recipe is locked but if you looked lower down there is an ongoing discussion about UJSSM. Same with sweet feed and a few others.

[W Pappy]

I think you are talking about the backset and you don't want to go over 50% backset.
I don't go over 30% after you run a batch say 10 gal take 3 gal out of your boiler charge and add
that to your next ferment.You will have 3 gal backset 7 gal water.Put your hot backset in a bucket
and dump your sugar in and stir and dissolve it,let it cool to pitching temp and dump in fermenter.

[whisky bent 44]

Your first distillation run will be a "sweet" run since you will not have any backset to use for sour mashing. I recommend using the spirits you collect in your first run as feints for the next run. Yes, all of them....... thats copied and pasted directly from the post. It suggests to put the distillates in the fermenting mash. But wouldnt the extra alcahol kill off the yeast prematurely? I always thought that the alcahol accumulated in the ferment is partially what kills off the yeast and thats why to much sugar is a waste. Isnt that what we do is find a balance between sugar alcahol and yeast that is most efficient? So in turn the distillate should be added to the boiler not to the ferment for the second and third run then make my cuts on the fourth removeing foreshots from all runs correct?