Natural supply of yeast?

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Natural supply of yeast?

Postby Mark Ducati » Mon Mar 01, 2010 1:38 pm

As I've stated before, one of my interests in distilling is to be able to produce ethanol for personal consumption and maybe for fuel if the SHTF.

Lets say the Apocolypse comes and I cant run down to the grocery store for Fleschman's Baker's Yeast, cant order online either....

There was a post about possibly using mushrooms... but identifying non-poisonous fungi in the wild is probably not going to be possible for me...

So where are you going to get a source of yeast from? I've got a half dozen jars down in the basement, once those are gone their gone... I suppose one could just keep on stillin' using prior generations of yeast, but who has the time/resources to keep a continuous cycle of fermenting going?

Whatever slop is down at the bottom of my fermentation barrel... can you take it out and let it air dry? Sunlight? Possible to store this and then use later?

If you had absolutely no yeast on hand how do you get it? I've heard that in certain parts of Belgium when they make beer, they just leave the vats of beer wash open to whatever ambient yeast is naturally present in the air to make regional "Limbic" beers... could you leave a 5 gallon bucket of your wash outside for a week and get some yeast from the air?

Also, I saw a nature show on Africa once where the tribe would pass a big bowl around the camp and everyone spit in it to start a fermentation process to make alcohol... what's up with that?
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby ammo man » Mon Mar 01, 2010 3:00 pm

Mark, yeast is everywhere. The spores float in the air, it is on the skins of fruit, and in corn and flour. I made some "moonshine" just using cracked corn and sugar and water. It took about 3 days before the yeast grew enough for the mash to start fermenting.

I am in making sourdough bread. The short story: I just mixed some water and unbleached all purpose flour, and in about 4 days the yeast started growing. Some people use DME I believe it is and water to capture yeast from the air. Just start searching on the Internet to find more information in detail.

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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby LWTCS » Mon Mar 01, 2010 6:17 pm

Mark Ducati wrote:Also, I saw a nature show on Africa once where the tribe would pass a big bowl around the camp and everyone spit in it to start a fermentation process to make alcohol... what's up with that?


Dude,,,come on.... They are practicing for when the SHTF.

You are obviously behind schedule.

Better get crackin :esurprised:
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby LWTCS » Tue Mar 02, 2010 5:11 am

Just being a Mr. Smarty Pants Funny Guy.

Did they not explain on that episode how saliva has an enzyme the aids in the digestion of food?
Therefore, the addition of saliva to the ferment will assist in breaking down solids within the beer. This in turn will help the natural yeast more effectively complete fermentation.

You should know that.
Although it is tough to get past the nasty factor and let the brain think it through.

At least it' not a bowl full of "true" expectorate :econfused:
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby rad14701 » Tue Mar 02, 2010 9:48 am

<<< "I just love taking a swig of someone else's periodontal disease in the morning... :twisted: " >>>
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby blind drunk » Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:02 pm

Also, I saw a nature show on Africa once where the tribe would pass a big bowl around the camp and everyone spit in it to start a fermentation process to make alcohol... what's up with that?


Human saliva has lactic acid bacteria and also sugar breaking enzymes in it. Sounds like they were making sour mash :) bd.
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby LWTCS » Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:07 pm

Aye ya ha wah wah wah eee,,,,, sour indeed.
(jes threw up a little in my mouth)
Gotta go brush my teeth :esad:
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby rednose » Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:33 pm

I was posting about chicha a while ago, an ecuatorian sabila - corn ferment.

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=13283&start=60#p6820192

blind drunk wrote:
Also, I saw a nature show on Africa once where the tribe would pass a big bowl around the camp and everyone spit in it to start a fermentation process to make alcohol... what's up with that?


Human saliva has lactic acid bacteria and also sugar breaking enzymes in it. Sounds like they were making sour mash :) bd.
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby LWTCS » Tue Mar 02, 2010 3:50 pm

Seriously though,
indiginous peoples really are at one with their environments.

Then the we came and used up,,,,,,,,everything within a measly 250 years.

Hope mother earth can set it right again.
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby blind drunk » Tue Mar 02, 2010 4:56 pm

Seriously though, indiginous peoples really are at one with their environments.


Wonder how many carbon credits one can get for recycling saliva :lol: bd.
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby LWTCS » Tue Mar 02, 2010 5:01 pm

I assume that would be a carbon nuetural expendature.

Should be worth a bunch :D
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby Slow & Steady » Fri Mar 05, 2010 6:32 am

I remember reading about the practice of "spit" mashing. The spit converts starch to fermentable sugar. The reason for passing it around would be the "dry mouth factor". When it is time to make some hooch everyone wants to help out. This sounds OK in practice... but there will always going to be the one wise guy who slams a "lung biscuit" into the brew and ruins it for everyone. :econfused: :esurprised: :roll:

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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby Usge » Mon Mar 29, 2010 7:00 am

I just finished an experiment/run using natural yeast...ie., just let it sit till it kicked off. It went about 3 days before it slowed/stopped and a bacterial infection overtook it. Part of the problem could have been that it was a thin-mash (sugar added to cooked meal mash) and the OG was a little much for the natural yeast. Anyway, I ended up cleaning up the whitefilm/bubbles on top, and tossing in some distillers yeast to kick it back off and I ran it anyway. As far as I can see, its pretty easy to get something to naturally begin fermenting on wild yeast. The problem is in controlling the flavors of it, as well as keeping bacterial infections and other off-flavors at bay during the process.

Anyway, the end result was interesting. The wild yeast added a sort of honey/pollen note to the nose, and a sour note to the taste of the corn mash — as compared to using WD whiskey yeast alone..which is usually sweet and fruity. Seriously, the nose on it smells like a flower, almost like honeysuckle. But the mash was good and sour. I did a 2nd round (firing it back off by adding sugar/water) and it was more subdued but definitely still there. Some of my friends thought it was the best I run I ever had. Some didn't like it near as much as others. No accounting for "taste".
But, it was decidedly different and interesting.
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby Usge » Tue Apr 06, 2010 12:38 pm

Just a follow up. I started a new barrel of thin-mash and used the lees from last batch (above) for my yeast—a combination of wildyeast and WD distillers yeast after about 2 generations on previous barrel. It seems to be doing really well so far and the smell from it on a fresh barrel of white/malt corn thin-mash is decidedly more "grainy" and less sour than it was before. But, not as sweet as typical sourmash sugar /no-cook recipes. The malt corn gives it a slight "toasted" corn and earth smell. So far, so good. I'm hoping to keep this batch of yeast going for a while. After combining it with the WD yeast, it became a lot more alc tollerant and thrives on the thin-mash (which has about 1 lb / gal of sugar in it). Be interesting to see how it changes over time.
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby The Baker » Tue Apr 06, 2010 6:00 pm

Usge wrote:I just finished an experiment/run using natural yeast...ie., just let it sit till it kicked off. It went about 3 days before it slowed/stopped and a bacterial infection overtook it. Part of the problem could have been that it was a thin-mash (sugar added to cooked meal mash) and the OG was a little much for the natural yeast.

snip

.


Maybe if you tried the oldfashioned system used for home-made ginger beer;

It starts off with sugar and water, lemon juice and powdered ginger (for the flavour) and a few dried grapes (Sultanas to us, probably Thompson's Seedless Raisins to our American friends) probably to help start the fermentation.
But the starting sugars seems to be a good amount for starting fermentation but not too high; the method calls for adding a small amount of sugar each day (and more ginger for the flavour).

And I don't know anything about bacterial infections but it would seem that this method should promote vigorous and healthy yeast growth that might fight off bacterial infection.
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby Whitedog » Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:21 pm

Slow & Steady wrote:... but there will always going to be the one wise guy who slams a "lung biscuit" into the brew and ruins it for everyone. :econfused: :esurprised: :roll:

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A "lung biscuit"? uggh I just threw up on the floor!! :mrgreen:
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby Tater » Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:23 pm

lets get this thread back on topic, :)
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Re: Natural supply of yeast?

Postby Usge » Thu Apr 08, 2010 9:17 am

The Baker wrote:Maybe if you tried the oldfashioned system used for home-made ginger beer;

It starts off with sugar and water, lemon juice and powdered ginger (for the flavour) and a few dried grapes (Sultanas to us, probably Thompson's Seedless Raisins to our American friends) probably to help start the fermentation. But the starting sugars seems to be a good amount for starting fermentation but not too high; the method calls for adding a small amount of sugar each day (and more ginger for the flavour). And I don't know anything about bacterial infections but it would seem that this method should promote vigorous and healthy yeast growth that might fight off bacterial infection.


Interesting starter Baker. I didn't make a starter originally because I was trying out an old recipe from Popcorn Sutton's book, in which he uses "malt" in place of adding commercial yeast, and lets it start naturally. It worked, as he said it would (the barrel capped up and was sizzling on the top) by the next morning. But, it just stopped by the 3rd day, and wasn't done. Then came the white film with bubbles on top — clear sign of bacterial infection. I cleaned it off, and then threw in some whiskey yeast with AG to get it going again. That worked fine...and this is how I ended up with this hybrid yeast. After running a few more generations I needed to restart the recipe....which I did using a mason jar full of lees from the previous batch that I saved when I was cleaning/sanitizing the barrel. So, didn't need a starter. For yeast starter food, I hear a bit of dried malt extract (DME) from beer supply shop works a treat too!
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