best yeast for fruit brandy

[sttifyd35]

Hi, when making a good fruit brandy, which is the best yeast to use. Im trying to choose between montrachet and champagne yeast.

[cranky]

Either of those yeasts would be fine. Any wine yeast is good but cuts can be hard with some of them. I don't use red star, preferring Lalvin so I like D-47, which carries a little more fruitiness, 1122 is really nice too but hard to make cuts on, 1118 ferment very clean and is the easiest to make cuts on. A lot here use 1118 which I think is the equivalent of Red Star's champagne yeast

[sttifyd35]

Ok thank you. Yeah i have made a blackberry, blueberry, and pineapple wine that i used red star montrachet in. My hard cider i used red star champagne yeast. I just like other peoples perspectives on different strategies.

[still_stirrin]

...I just like other peoples perspectives on different strategies.

Well, that guy {cranky} is THE GUY for "all things fruity". I would strongly urge you to listen to him.
ss

[cranky]

...I just like other peoples perspectives on different strategies.

Well, that guy {cranky} is THE GUY for "all things fruity". I would strongly urge you to listen to him.
ss

I would say Jimbo was that guy

[sttifyd35]

Yeah ive done alot with wines, so i should be ok there. Its now that im experimenting with corn mash and what not, that its new to me.

[cranky]

Ferment wise brandy tends to be a little different than most people do wine. For best results, no sulfites, and no sugar, pretty much just fruit juice and yeast. Cuts are hard because fruit flavors tend to hide in the heads. I mostly do brandy and I'm happy to answer any questions you might have.

[sttifyd35]

Yeah definitely could use some advice. Ive been thinking of doing a peach brandy. Would would you recommend for that? Lets say a 5 gallon mash?

[cranky]

Peaches are something I've never done, there aren't very many peach trees here in the PNW, but you really can't go wrong with 1118, some people say it ferments slow but I never worry about how long something takes to ferment. There is a peach thread around here somewhere that might have some more info on that.

[sttifyd35]

What are some fruits you have done? Im big on Caribbean fruits. Pineapple, mango, passion fruit, etc...

[cranky]

I'm a cheap bastard so my favorite fruits are free fruits here in the PNW there are a lot of things free for the picking, blackberries are everywhere and was my first, blueberries are also available for free. Lately I have been doing a lot of apple because the area I live in used to be a major apple producing region but now the trees go unpicked for the most part so I get lots of apples and there are a few pear trees here and there. Apples and pears give the most juice in the shortest amount of time picking so they have been favored lately. I've also done strawberry and cherry but I can't get many of those for free so I haven't done any in a while. I did a mixed fruit a couple years ago that I really liked, it was basically everything that was still in the freezer when spring came but it turned out real nice. My wife would like me to do some of the tropical stuff and I've been thinking about a banana rum for her but haven't found any cheap bananas lately.

If you are interested my fruit thread is here http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =7&t=48881 it pretty much documents 2 entire years of fruity goodness.

[sttifyd35]

I have recently came across a banana bourbon which was really nice! Had the bite of whiskey in the front, with a banana after taste. Quite tasty. I can imagine that a banana rum would be nice as well. Im new to distilling, but i have whipped up some crazy things. My latest thing has been trying to replicate tropical twisted teas. Essentially its a black tea malt drink infused with tropical fruit juices. My girlfriend loves the stuff, but its a seasonal carry in the stores. Mine came out with the smell of tropical fruit, with more of a wine taste with slight carbonation. She actually likes mine better.

[MDH]

For the most clarity of fruit flavor, wild yeast is the best. Crush the fresh fruit, add water to stir out air, and leave it in a warm room, it will ferment by itself.

The only negative is that you have to keep air out of the fermenting container, and distill the mash as soon as it is fermented.

[cranky]

For the most clarity of fruit flavor, wild yeast is the best.

Unfortunately I have to disagree on that one. Of the 4 different yeasts I used last year on my apple, I found the wild yeast to be disappointing. I still haven't run the 1122 but the cider from it is by far the best flavor.

[Smokee]

Ferment wise brandy tends to be a little different than most people do wine. For best results, no sulfites, and no sugar, pretty much just fruit juice and yeast. Cuts are hard because fruit flavors tend to hide in the heads. I mostly do brandy and I'm happy to answer any questions you might have.

This is a little old thread but I came across it while looking for info on my cherry brandy.

This summer I used about 25lbs of cherries that I pitted and blended into a liquid. I fermented it with Red Star Champagne yeast and didn't get much cherry flavor. I distilled it and put it on some oak and saved it for Christmas. I've read that this yeast doesn't impart much flavor and was curious if anyone else finds this true. I certainly seems that way for me. I used no sugar and really didn't get much out of it. I had about 4 gallons of mash and got maybe 40oz total. After cuts I ended up with less than a mason jar.

[rad14701]

This summer I used about 25lbs of cherries that I pitted and blended into a liquid. I fermented it with Red Star Champagne yeast and didn't get much cherry flavor. I distilled it and put it on some oak and saved it for Christmas. I've read that this yeast doesn't impart much flavor and was curious if anyone else finds this true. I certainly seems that way for me. I used no sugar and really didn't get much out of it. I had about 4 gallons of mash and got maybe 40oz total. After cuts I ended up with less than a mason jar.

What type of still did you use to make your brandy...???

[Smokee]

This summer I used about 25lbs of cherries that I pitted and blended into a liquid. I fermented it with Red Star Champagne yeast and didn't get much cherry flavor. I distilled it and put it on some oak and saved it for Christmas. I've read that this yeast doesn't impart much flavor and was curious if anyone else finds this true. I certainly seems that way for me. I used no sugar and really didn't get much out of it. I had about 4 gallons of mash and got maybe 40oz total. After cuts I ended up with less than a mason jar.

What type of still did you use to make your brandy...???

Thanks, Rad... pot with doubler. Just not much cherry essence in the taste or smell. Just wondering if a change in yeast would make a difference.

I did two runs. The first had sugar the second was just blended/liquefied cherries with nothing else but a little Pectinase. The second run I put some mash in the doubler thinking it would give off a little more flavor but it didn't.

[MDH]

If the variety of cherry you use doesn't have very much flavor, your brandy won't either. I guess my signature is too cryptic, but what I mean to say is that distillation is not magic; it won't summon flavor (or the potential for flavor in the future) where there is none.

[Smokee]

If the variety of cherry you use doesn't have very much flavor, your brandy won't either. I guess my signature is too cryptic, but what I mean to say is that distillation is not magic; it won't summon flavor (or the potential for flavor in the future) where there is none.

They were from you neck of the woods...Washington State Bing.

[MDH]

Two recommendations, then.

Next time, don't use oak. Cherry distillate is very subtle.

Secondly, age it for a long time. Sometimes, flavors go away during distillation only to reappear after a while. This is especially true for Whiskies. Newmake is often flat and lifeless but gains much of the fruitiness from the wash back as it ages.

[Smokee]

Two recommendations, then.

Next time, don't use oak. Cherry distillate is very subtle.

Secondly, age it for a long time. Sometimes, flavors go away during distillation only to reappear after a while. This is especially true for Whiskies. Newmake is often flat and lifeless but gains much of the fruitiness from the wash back as it ages.

I still have have a mason jar full that's just been sitting, I haven't touch it...yet.

[thecroweater]

I always have to have a little chuckle when I read you can't add sugar and I read it often, really really often .
Here's the thing, you can have a fruit say blackthorn that has a ton and a half of flavour but barely a point of sugar. OK your wash is going to smell oh so good cooking but nary but a few drops are produced, why? BECAUSE THERE WASN'T ANY SUGAR , this just foolishness to waste time and money for little to no result. Such a failure should have been predicted. So what was the mistake (and such a result is a mistake) could it be you shouldn't try to ferment a low sugar fruit regardless of how much flavour it has and how available it is or (and here's a novel idea) could it be you should add that which is lacking from what would otherwise be present in a good ferment. That is frutrose and glucose, guess what sugar is . Without sugar there is no such thing as alcohol, all alcohol is the result of converting sugar although some would think sugar is the enemy of fermentation . Some will Say ah but its different as in sucrose the glucose and fructose are bonded so what and if ya want to get all OCD about it you can always invert it which is a reasonably simple thing to accomplish. Here's how it really is, more sugar more alcohol, to much alcohol for a given amount of flavour will be to light a flavour not enough and that flavour ain't gonna do ya any good sitting in kettle while ya walk off kicking the cat and yelling at the dog

[still_stirrin]

I always have to have a little chuckle when...kicking the cat and yelling at the dog.

[The Baker]

I always have to have a little chuckle when I read you can't add sugar and I read it often, really really often .
Here's the thing, you can have a fruit say blackthorn that has a ton and a half of flavour but barely a point of sugar. OK your wash is going to smell oh so good cooking but nary but a few drops are produced, why? BECAUSE THERE WASN'T ANY SUGAR , this just foolishness to waste time and money for little to no result. Such a failure should have been predicted. So what was the mistake (and such a result is a mistake) could it be you shouldn't try to ferment a low sugar fruit regardless of how much flavour it has and how available it is or (and here's a novel idea) could it be you should add that which is lacking from what would otherwise be present in a good ferment. That is frutrose and glucose, guess what sugar is . Without sugar there is no such thing as alcohol, all alcohol is the result of converting sugar although some would think sugar is the enemy of fermentation . Some will Say ah but its different as in sucrose the glucose and fructose are bonded so what and if ya want to get all OCD about it you can always invert it which is a reasonably simple thing to accomplish. Here's how it really is, more sugar more alcohol, to much alcohol for a given amount of flavour will be to light a flavour not enough and that flavour ain't gonna do ya any good sitting in kettle while ya walk off kicking the cat and yelling at the dog

That makes remarkable good sense.
Geoff

[emptyglass]

A wise man once told me, there is a difference between fruit with sugar, and sugar with fruit.

I get what your saying crow. Theres no point picking all that fruit, fermenting and distilling it if theres not enough natural sugar, but theres also no point making a fruit flavoured sugar wash.

Your point is valid, but its digressing.

I prefer to use the wild yeast if I can. It can give some unique flavour, but its fickle and hard to replicate. And sometimes it just plain doesn't work. When it does its gold.

A good wine yeast can help, and fortifying it with just enough sugar can be beneficial. Go too far on either and you start to loose character.

Thats my 2c

[cranky]

You do have a good point thecroweater, Emptyglass response pretty much sums up the way I feel. I agree sugar can help get more out of a low sugar fruit but as many like to point out if you add sugar it is no longer a true brandy. Granted, we are not bound by the semantics of laws but in general if we go around advocating the use of sugar in brandy we get novices who only see "its ok to use sugar" and don't see the part about it being under specific conditions and within certain tolerances. Then they dump a bunch of sugar into their fruit juice and come back wondering why their 19% alcohol wash made from 3 apples and a ton of sugar doesn't taste like biting into a fresh picked apple. Most fruit here in the US produces enough natural sugar that it is unnecessary to add any more. Even the blackberries I pick produce 6% alcohol, yet I have seen many people claim that they are a very low sugar fruit. I have never seen a blackthorn bushes here but I will admit there are exceptions to the no sugar rule just like there are exceptions to every rule but in generalities I feel it is best to recommend not adding it to fruit...OK most fruit. Of course that's just my feelings, people are free to do whatever they want.

[MDH]

I always have to have a little chuckle when I read you can't add sugar and I read it often, really really often .
Here's the thing, you can have a fruit say blackthorn that has a ton and a half of flavour but barely a point of sugar. OK your wash is going to smell oh so good cooking but nary but a few drops are produced, why? BECAUSE THERE WASN'T ANY SUGAR , this just foolishness to waste time and money for little to no result. Such a failure should have been predicted. So what was the mistake (and such a result is a mistake) could it be you shouldn't try to ferment a low sugar fruit regardless of how much flavour it has and how available it is or (and here's a novel idea) could it be you should add that which is lacking from what would otherwise be present in a good ferment.

I don't necessarily disagree. I've boosted the gravity of mashes made from rosehips for years. I know when to drop my pride. But for some, like rowan or june berry (aka saskatoon), yes, the yields are tremendously low but I'd try them no other way, regardless.

[AlKohol]

Hello Cranky... following on your posts: i am mainly interested in Fruit brandies- - Schnapps. with limited access to Yeast varieties. Last season i tried regular Bakers yeast on washes of Apples, Peaches, Pears, and Plums increasing SG with invert sugar, to about 13%. the only good result came from the plums a tasty 60% ( Slivovitz). The others were just.... Yukky. I'll probably polish with Charcoal, and use some essence.

1- So, in a nut shell, if i were to pick out 2 yeasts: what would you recommend?
2- if i were to run a primary stripping run and collect everything from start to , say, 90 Deg C. then, i could run a second distillation with accurate temperature cuts. where would you recommend i cut, to maintain the flavors?

Cheers

[sttifyd35]

I personally have experimented with apples using bakers, champagne, and nottingham ale yeast. For best flavor profile, nottingham takes the cake by a long shot. Strongly recommend it for hard cider and for apple brandy

[thecroweater]

That opinion doesn't surprise me as my best result was with pale ale yeast