Angel yeast question

[PoppaW]

Maybe I have this figured out already. Maybe not. So with the angel yeast you add the yeast to un mashed grains and enzymes go to work to give the yeast something to eat. Making ethanol.

So what happens if we do the same with turbo yeast? Nothing because of no enzymes and only nutrients? Or something? I realize nutrients are not enzymes but what is really in a pack of turbo? I ask only because I wonder about tgese things. I guess I can make a 4 liter ferment and add turbo and see if it can get it going.

I did ferment a G2 gatorade just because. Got some ethanol but tasted like chemical sweetener. Had a small amount of fizz in it. I did not use turbo for that. This is how I think, wonder and experiment.
Thoughts?

[Beerswimmer]

Turbo needs sugar to eat and make alcohol. Turbo yeast is a high abv "tolerant" yeast with nutrients, and is widely panned for creating terrible flavors.

[Brew bama]

I believe turbo yeast has Yeast, Nutrients (Fermax), and Diammonium phosphate (DAP). You can make your own ‘turbo’ yeast.

The starches in grains have to be converted to simple sugars. Enzymes do this for us. At certain temps and pH certain enzymes are more active.

Using 2-row or 6-row barley, because it has enough enzymes (Diastatic Power) to convert itself and other grains, I target beta and alpha amylase at 5.2 mash temp pH (5.4 room temp pH) for a 152*F mash. Kind of a happy compromise for both the enzymes. ...but there are many, many more enzymes that are more active at other temps that do more than just convert starch to sugars.

Flaked or cracked Corn and flaked wheat does not have a very high Diastatic Power. Malted Rye and malted wheat has a DP ~75.

IOW, if you use just corn you won’t have enough enzymes to convert the starch to sugar. If you add yeast you won’t do anything because normal Saccharomyces cerevisiae or Saccharomyces pastorianus yeast can’t convert the start to sugars. With an all corn mash you need to add alpha amylase enzyme, give it time to convert, then cool a bit and add yeast.

You might try an all corn mash using Saccharomyces cerevisiae var. diastaticus. It might work without converting starch to sugar first. Saccharomyces cerevisiae var. diastaticus has an STA​1 gene, which encode for the exoenzyme glucoamylase, also referred to as amyloglucosidase. ...but I dunno. [emoji2369]

If you use Flemishmann’s or Angel Bread yeast, I believe it can feed on starches (or converts starches then eats the converted sugars). So you might try it in all corn mash as well. [emoji2369]

Hope this helps

[NZChris]

Angel sell many different products, including several for various types of fermention, so read the bag of what you have bought and use it accordingly.

[Sazerac]

Brew bama is correct, the key is mostly low temp active glucoamylase, both added to the angel yeast, and also produced by the rhyzopus oryzae mould culture in it. This is because asian cultures never traditionally used malting of grains to create enzymes to make sugars, instead they use extra moulds like the rhyzopus to do so, and generally sell it ready mixed with yeast for making rice wine etc.

[Saltbush Bill]

Angel sell many different products, including several for various types of fermention, so read the bag of what you have bought and use it accordingly.

Correct Chris.
Seems to me that some folk are confused and think that any Angel Yeast product has the ability to convert grains to sugars to alcohol.
Only one type can do that as far as I have seen and that is the pack marked
" STARTER OF LIQUOR"

[Demy]

I don't know if this discussion is still interesting, but I step in to say that I have that yeast and it seems to convert the starch. I bought it on aliexpress a long time ago as a test, then a few months ago I went to the company's website and asked for an explanation via email. I was told that it is used for the conversion of rice starches and that it can do this with other starches as well. I did a test (iodine) and it seems to work with wheat flour. If anyone is interested I could repeat the test by posting photos. In my test, I heated water + flour to gelatinize the starches after throwing the yeast, the next day I did the iodine test which indicated a conversion. I don't know if this is the best way to go but I figured that, from what I know, the rice is cooked before inoculating the yeast. This product contains yeast, rhizopus (the fungus capable of converting) food additives (a-amylase, glucoamylase, phytase) which, as we all know, are enzymes known to us.

[MartinCash]

... I step in to say that I have that yeast and it seems to convert the starch...

Hi Demi, when you say you "have that yeast", can you please elaborate? That's the whole point of NZChris' post, there are a bunch of different yeasts produced by Angel. The "Starter or Liquor-making" one is the one that definitely converts starches, and has a few threads about its use in this and other forums. Are you saying there is another one?

[Demy]

I have exactly that yeast. "starter liquor making", silver packaging identical to the Saltbush Bill images. The thing that struck me is that the exact same package can have slightly different ingredients. I had bought that yeast a long time ago (before this post) because from the description (actually difficult to understand) it looked interesting. True, the company has many products for various industries including homebrewing (I've never used it though). I haven't seen any other posts on the subject and thought this was a "blocked" post.

[Beerswimmer]

There's a 7 page thread in Mashing and Fermenting called No Mash No Sugar about our experiences using Angel Yeast Starter for Liquor Making.

[Demy]

There's a 7 page thread in Mashing and Fermenting called No Mash No Sugar about our experiences using Angel Yeast Starter for Liquor Making.

Thanks I'll go read it.