Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Treatment and handling of your distillate.

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azwhiskey
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by azwhiskey » Wed Oct 05, 2016 7:56 pm

I think the pinhole would not allow any pressure to build up. Don't we want pressure/ vacuum cycles?

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by der wo » Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:44 am

If you want to copy barrel aging a pinhole helps much.
If you want oaking only, different pressure would help. But the normal pressure fluctuation is by far not as strong as for example pressure cycles with a microwave.
I age with pinholes.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by Coug95man2 » Thu Oct 06, 2016 5:10 am

der wo wrote:If you want to copy barrel aging a pinhole helps much.
If you want oaking only, different pressure would help. But the normal pressure fluctuation is by far not as strong as for example pressure cycles with a microwave.
I age with pinholes.
Yep. Think "Angels Share". Nothing big by any stretch. The smallest you can make it, at least that's what I did. Took great pains to make it as small as I could
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by der wo » Thu Oct 06, 2016 5:27 am

A 1l bottle with 3 pinholes (diam 2mm), covered with 7 layers coffee filters will have shared to the angels about 20% of your spirit after one year... at least in my apartment at normal room temps and not much air movement.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by Coug95man2 » Thu Oct 06, 2016 5:48 am

I live in an area where the temps outside run mid-30's F (3-4 C) to 60's, maybe low 70's in the day (15-21 C). I have my half gallon jars in the uninsulated garage, hidden in the corner covered with a small tarp. I made my pinholes as small as possible. I actually took the smallest hole punch I could find and started the hole but didn't go all the way through. Then I actually got a heavy duty sewing needle (think leather or upholstery style sewing) and slowly punctured to make it as small as possible. Do that for two reasons: to me it resembles the barrel more. The amount lost to the Angels isn't due to actual circulation. One hole in a half gallon jar, to me mimics the 53 gallons. 2, I put my jars outside and the thought that ANY bug could crawl in my likker gives me the heeby jeebies. Smaller and 1 has always worked for me. To each their own. I think if you actually use time, like 6 months or more, this would all be academic. If your drinking it after a month, you'll taste differences.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by Gish » Fri Oct 07, 2016 5:47 am

A question for the group. I am using toasted used bourbon barrel chunks that were made for smoking. https://www.amazon.com/CharcoalStore-Bo ... ood+chunks. I toasted them and propane charred them all the way around. My question is, how many of these do you guys think I should put in a half gallon jar? I have 2 per jar right now, but the surface area of the chunks is not very much. Chunks are about 2x2x1.

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by kiwi Bruce » Sun Oct 09, 2016 2:03 pm

Yours are probably half the size of mine and these were based on T's original pieces....so...two of yours?...Kiwi
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by LukeDuke » Sun Oct 09, 2016 2:38 pm

I believe two would be sufficient as well.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by rgreen2002 » Sat Nov 05, 2016 5:02 pm

Gish wrote:A question for the group. I am using toasted used bourbon barrel chunks that were made for smoking. https://www.amazon.com/CharcoalStore-Bo ... ood+chunks. I toasted them and propane charred them all the way around. My question is, how many of these do you guys think I should put in a half gallon jar? I have 2 per jar right now, but the surface area of the chunks is not very much. Chunks are about 2x2x1.

I picked these up about a month ago as well. Since they're only toasted on one side I was planning on sanding the char down, splitting them into about 1" sticks and roasting them, much like yourself. I will follow this with the blowtorch char. This way all the sides are charred.

My pieces are averaging about 3 inches long so roughly 14cm2 of surface are (1X1X3 calculation). I will put 5-6 per gallon for an average of around 22cm2/liter

Your 2x2x1 inches gives about 16cm2.(http://www.calculatorsoup.com/calculato ... cearea.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow). 3.8 liters per gallon so 1.9 liters total for 1/2 gallon...22 x 1.9 about 42cm2. 42/16= 2.6. See how 2 sticks does and then you have room for another possibly.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by brouwpa » Sat Nov 12, 2016 2:48 pm

I have an oak question! In the uk I can only find kiln dried American White Oak. If I leave it outside to weather for the winter, would this remove the harsh tannins and allow me to toast and char it next summer? Thanks for your patience.
As a newbie it seems I need to start with gin (I like gin) and plan ahead for whisky?

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by Badmotivator » Sat Nov 12, 2016 8:38 pm

brouwpa wrote:I have an oak question! In the uk I can only find kiln dried American White Oak. If I leave it outside to weather for the winter, would this remove the harsh tannins and allow me to toast and char it next summer? Thanks for your patience.
As a newbie it seems I need to start with gin (I like gin) and plan ahead for whisky?
That sounds sensible to me. I've seen info that cooperages weather their wood for between four months and five years. They believe strongly that it is essential. I have had enough experience with unseasoned/unweathered oak to believe them.

I recommend you buy a board, chop and rip it into sticks, and stack it outside like a loose Jenga tower. Label the stack. (Date, species, origin, whatever).

Compared to the venerable slow traditions, we often take shortcuts. Some of them work pretty well, I'm told. But planning ahead may result in a spirit which you are more completely proud of. :)

Cheers.

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by der wo » Sun Nov 13, 2016 2:13 am

brouwpa wrote:I have an oak question! In the uk I can only find kiln dried American White Oak. If I leave it outside to weather for the winter, would this remove the harsh tannins and allow me to toast and char it next summer? Thanks for your patience.
As a newbie it seems I need to start with gin (I like gin) and plan ahead for whisky?
Where did you find the American white oak? Online? Then please post the link. Sources of white oak are rare in Europe. You could use hot water to accelerate the seasoning process.
Or you could buy Jack Daniels smoking blocks, if you find some. In my country they are sold out at the moment. They wouldn't need seasoning, because they are already seasoned.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by brouwpa » Sun Nov 13, 2016 4:18 am

I found the American White oak offcuts on ebay! And have also bought some JD/Whisky chips from the same place! Just planning long term with the white oak

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by der wo » Sun Nov 13, 2016 4:31 am

brouwpa wrote:I found the American White oak offcuts on ebay! And have also bought some JD/Whisky chips from the same place! Just planning long term with the white oak
You are right. I found it at ebay.co.uk
The JD chips are not the same as the blocks or chunks. From the blocks you can make sticks, the chips are too small.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by PTS_35 » Mon Jan 16, 2017 6:17 am

I've been wondering, why do you char the wood? If toasting it provides the flavors, what does the char do? Does it act as filter to filter out impurities? Help provide color? What's the point of charring and what's it impact on the whiskey?

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by still_stirrin » Mon Jan 16, 2017 8:29 am

PTS_35 wrote:I've been wondering, why do you char the wood? If toasting it provides the flavors, what does the char do? Does it act as filter to filter out impurities? Help provide color? What's the point of charring and what's it impact on the whiskey?
Here...have a read:
https://redheadoakbarrels.com/why-are-a ... s-charred/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
http://www.gobourbon.com/using-oak-barr ... e-whiskey/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
http://vinepair.com/wine-blog/what-are- ... ey-tastes/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by T-Pee » Mon Jan 16, 2017 8:37 am

Kinda like cracking a nut plus carmelizing. Gotta open the pores.

tp

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by PTS_35 » Wed Jan 18, 2017 4:19 am

Still stirrin, thanks for those links. Look forward to reading them

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by Rick Martin » Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:21 pm

I have had the pleasure of reading this Topic front beginning to end. Wow what an education!! I know TP just wanted to post his method for others to learn but man did it explode. Thank you TP. The knowledge I gained was how to do it but how different woods, levels of toast, and levels of char effects the taste along with the description of how each ended up tasting. This has been maybe the most valuable. I think from the various taste description I was able to find a good starting point that will work with my likes. Another thing I also learned, from here and UJSSM, is that if it doesn’t taste good now just wait and the flavor will change.
Since I won't be able to start till the weather gets warmer, I went to the local State owned store and purchased a bottle of unflavored legal moonshine. Along with that I purchased medium toast white oak chips. Took half of the bottle added a handful of rinsed chips. Now I will be able to see and taste the changes. This is just for learning. I will try char later. When I am sure I have what I want then I will use sticks in the spirits I will make and want to oak.


By the way I have been reading UJSSM from the beginning and TP your comments are funny. Keep them coming.


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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by T-Pee » Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:28 pm

Yeah, well, they keep letting me out for the weekend.

Using likker at drinking proof may not be the best comparison as most of us oak at 55%-60% or "cask strength". It'l'l make a difference.

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by vernue » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:52 am

would one use a different wood or a different toast/roast for aging a single malt? just ran my first single malt and was wondering what to do with it. Thanks.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by still_stirrin » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:08 am

vernue wrote:would one use a different wood or a different toast/roast for aging a single malt? just ran my first single malt and was wondering what to do with it. Thanks.
Scotch is aged in once used oak and often also a used cask that previously held sherry. If you're aging in glass, I would think using once used oak chuncks would be appropriate. Toast them at 375-400*F in the oven for an hour and then give them a char with your torch. Rinse good with water and put them into the jar. It should give you a tasty whiskey.

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by der wo » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:26 am

vernue wrote:would one use a different wood or a different toast/roast for aging a single malt? just ran my first single malt and was wondering what to do with it. Thanks.
Generally your question sounds a bit like you haven't read much about oak until now. Because you probably don't have used oak, I would use new sticks like described here. A toast plus a char (IMO light toast and light char is best. The most common beginner mistake is to overdo both). You will not get an original Scotch taste, it will taste like a mixture of Malt Whisky and Bourbon, but that's the best you can do without used wood. Simply to take less oak for Malt Whisky than for Bourbon is not a solution for the problem IMO.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by amdamgraham » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:27 am

Good read and thank you. I did some oak stave tests in jars early-on but now use small casks. One thing that was very noticeable in my jar tests was how dramatically the spirit changed when exposed or denied the ability to breath. These were mason jars so had lids, not cork, and we would tighten or loosen the lids and then check them side by side. Big difference. Is that why you use a cork on the jar, to allow some oxidizing and how much angels share do you lose with cork and jug?

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by vernue » Mon Apr 24, 2017 5:48 am

thanks for your replies. The wood I'm using is from used oak wine barrels from a local boutique winery that's been sitting open outside for a few years (the barrel, not the winery). i've been toasting them at 200 C for a few hours and blow-torching them according to what I've been reading here. They've been fine for the bourbon - although your comment about overdoing it hit the mark. I'm just wondering if the same wood I'm using for bourbon would be appropriate for scotch. Yes, the quantities I'm distilling now means I'll be aging in glass - two liter jugs with 3" cork tops (found them at ikea!). Thanks for your help, and if you have more advice, my eyes and ears are open.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by der wo » Mon Apr 24, 2017 5:57 am

vernue wrote:thanks for your replies. The wood I'm using is from used oak wine barrels from a local boutique winery that's been sitting open outside for a few years (the barrel, not the winery). i've been toasting them at 200 C for a few hours 1.5h at 190°C is the most recommended combination here and blow-torching them according to what I've been reading here. They've been fine for the bourbon - although your comment about overdoing it hit the mark. So why don't you use the sticks from your Bourbon now for the Malt Whisky? I'm just wondering if the same wood I'm using for bourbon would be appropriate for scotch. Yes, the quantities I'm distilling now means I'll be aging in glass - two liter jugs with 3" cork tops (found them at ikea!). Thanks for your help, and if you have more advice, my eyes and ears are open.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by thecroweater » Mon Apr 24, 2017 6:30 am

Bourbon is generally heavy charred scotch is not unless its being stored in ex bourbon barrels in which case the char is leached anyways. If they are charred up for bourbon scape those suckers down
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by dieselduo » Mon Apr 24, 2017 7:44 am

for scotch I use the oak from once used bourbon and then soak it in sherry and put in jars. Makes a fine drop

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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by vernue » Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:30 am

I would use my used bourbon sticks, but they all went on the grill a couple of weeks ago. I'd be embarrassed admitting that, except it was the best grill I've ever tasted! I may never make a great bourbon or even acceptable scotch, but at least my barbecue has granted me family approval. I guess I'll go with a medium toast and medium char, and take what I get. There's always next time.
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Re: Oaking and aging the T-Pee way

Post by Fish_06 » Fri May 05, 2017 9:16 pm

I see this is an old post but I'm just starting on aging and have bought French oak cubes but like this too so think I'm going to get it a go tomorrow. Thanks for the write up maybe this will give me some good deer lease camp fire drink

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