Curing oak with saltwater

Treatment and handling of your distillate.

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cuginosgrizzo
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Curing oak with saltwater

Post by cuginosgrizzo »

Hi, I am fussing with this new idea now. Oh well, sounds new to me and I haven't found any reference to it in the forum yet.

In the future, as soon as I start doing AG, I want to try a Islay style Whisky since Talisker is one of my favourites. Besides sourcing true heavily peated barley, I am thinking about the aging that these distilleries do, supposedly with iodine and saltwater air permeating the casks. I want to try to simulate this, also.

I am the happy owner of a 120gal saltwater tank. I plan to char a few toasted sticks, and hang them in a mesh bag underneath the tank, just above the sump. There they will bath in all the humidity, moisture, salt and good smell of my tank. I plan to leave them there for a few weeks/months (until I need them), then I'll just rinse the salt crust that might have developed on the outside and dump them in my whisky.

Is this a bad idea? Has it been tried before?
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by still_stirrin »

Its crazy. But crazy comes around every once in a while. Report back with your results.

In the meantime, pour yourself another whiskey.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by bitter »

If you had a big sump in your basement might work out better to put you aging barrels above the sump. I think the salt/sea air taste/smell you are taking about is for scotch aged on the coast and the salt water vapor in the air eventually gets through the wood into the product with aging......

I would think to get any flavor/smell transfer would take a long time though...

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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by scout »

While experimenting is always good, in this case I personally would not expect the same flavor profiles as Talisker.

I love the idea, I'm just not sure that sticks (in this case) will do what you seem to be after.

The air/ wood cask/ whisky interaction that produces Talisker is largely dependent on the used Sherry casks they age in.
salt air hitting the exterior of a cask full of whisky doesn't so much permeate the barrel as much as it wets the outside (remember we are talking about a tight cask that once swollen doesn't leak the precious cargo inside).
The action of aging is more like you taking a deep breath, slowly, with the exterior of the cask acting a lot like skin, a little osmosis occurs but more than that occurs in the aging process.
Alcohol, being the liquid held in the "lung" will slowly seep towards the external air, some eventually reaches the skin and evaporates into the air (angel's share). The engine that moves these actions has regulators (atmospheric pressure, how hot it is and how cold it gets (day night fluctuations as well as seasonal fluctuations) the skin (cask) is the semi permeable membrane in all this.

A stick that has been exposed to salt air (from your tank) will seep all the way through because there is no "inside" and nothing to stop the movement (the whisky inside the cask) so your stick will end up fully saturated with the salt air.
These differences are why I am not sure the sticks will work as you desire or perhaps think. This is still a good experiment though, because you will learn something other than what is standard. You also may be onto a new flavor profile and that can be a great thing. Do expect a bit of a salty flavor, let us know how it goes so we can all benefit from your experiment.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by bearriver »

Scout, I was just thinking about you. Weird... It's great to see you still posting!
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by cuginosgrizzo »

Four heavily charred sticks just went a few inches above my sump water level. Now I'm gonna forget em there. I'll let you know how it turns out in a few months!
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by SaltyStaves »

I certainly think its an experiment worth doing. I have some dominos sitting in a kelp bed and a friend who can hold his breath for a really long time.
Don't think it will be much of a success though. The open ocean is like an industrial washing machine and its likely to rip out much more than just tannins.

I like salty islay whisky too.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by ga flatwoods »

Soooo, okay, here's a question for the gang. Who has used salt water straight out of the river for wash water instead of fresh drinking water? Anyone? ?........Anyone? I might just have to try it to compliment my Muckalee Creek Water.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by MichiganCornhusker »

ga flatwoods wrote:Who has used salt water straight out of the river for wash water instead of fresh drinking water?
I've used fresh snow, straight out of my parking lot. :thumbup:
Two different things. Using river or creek or sea water in the boiler in the hopes of impacting the character of the final spirit is one thing.
Treating the oak sticks before adding to spirit is essentially a maceration. Both ideas are interesting, I'd like to hear results from anything like this.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by masonsjax »

Seawater's pH is up near 8 or so, way too high for your yeast to get going, unless you add in some acid or roasted grain.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by still_stirrin »

Hey, don't you use brine when making pickles? What about "malted barley pickles"?

Naaaaa...I don't think so. :mrgreen:
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by ydoih8u »

There is a rum aged in casks that are soaked in the ocean... Can't think of the name just now. I remember seeing it in a TV show. I think it may have been an episode of Chug.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by Tater »

http://www.winknews.com/2015/06/30/wick ... e-new-rum/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by cuginosgrizzo »

Well here in Italy they have been doing it for a few years with a wine. It's a sparkling white that undergoes a 30 month aging underwater, once bottled. Supposedly the cork permeates some of the saltiness to the wine. The market price of these bottles is ten fold the one of the same wine without this aging (around 80€).

here is the link (sorry it is in italian only) http://divini.corriere.it/2013/08/31/la ... mmersione/
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by MDH »

Not impressed. Angel's share is necessary to soften the spirit with time.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by vqstatesman »

Old thread I realise but how did this pan out? I'm really keen to here what affect this had.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by cuginosgrizzo »

vqstatesman wrote:Old thread I realise but how did this pan out? I'm really keen to here what affect this had.
In the end I did not try it, yet. I made the mistake to char and hang below the acquarium some unused sticks, while scotch needs used wood. Those three sticks are still hanging there. Maybe I'll have the guts to age some bourbon with them...
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by vqstatesman »

Thanks for the response. Good luck should you choose to give it a go.
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Re: Curing oak with saltwater

Post by Steve Broady »

I’ll resurrect this old thread again, just to ask if you ever tried it. I found the thread while searching for discussions about the use of salt in fermentation and distillation. I have to say, there are some interesting ideas out here!
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