Beet sugar vs cane sugar

[DuckofDeath]

I recently found some extremely cheap Beat sugar and tried it in UJSSM. What I found was the same yield but less heads so better hearts. Has anyone else noticed this? Beet is about $20 for 50lbs

[goose eye]

Suger is cheap now. all the big suger Co. is
borrowin money now cause the interstate rates
is down. When them notes come due it gona
jump quick. You got the cash now the time
to stock up.


So im tole

[Sugar Daddy]

I read that rum has to come from sugar cane by definition. Molasses or cane sugar. I thought beets were used for vodka?

[heartcut]

The white sugar is pretty much the same but the molasses (for rum) is a lot different between beets and cane. I stick with cane molasses.

[cranky]

I am a long time lurker here on HD but I had to register and post to this one. In 2011 Monsanto got approval for genetically modified sugar beets and according to Mother earth news ( http://www.motherearthnews.com/homestea ... z2g8eENbPV" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow ) Monsanto controls 95% of the sugar beet market. This means that that sugar has been manufactured from GMO beets. I for one don't trust GMO and would not use it for any thing and since finding out about the GMO beets I only buy 100% pure cane sugar. It often goes on sale here for $5 for 10 pounds. That's only $5 more for 50 pounds and I know it is GMO free. Just my opinion, take it for what it's worth.
Cranky
P.S. My next post will be over at the welcome center as soon as I find the time.

[Okie-Grog]

Hi folks new here and to distilling. I came here just reading but thought I'd throw in my two since worth. I'm a reverse snow bird. I live in Oklahoma and go to Michigan to escape the heat in the summer. We go to my wife's folks and they happen to be some of the largest sugar beet producers in the country. I've been harvesting them suckers for approx 8 years. Here's what I know:

1. You cannot escape beet sugar it's in everything unless it specifically says cane sugar. The cane sugar producers add it on everything to keep product recognition to help them survive.

2. My wife is a high powered PhD Dietitian that owns here own consulting business and is a professor at a local state college. She states that sugar is sugar. She further has stated to others on several occasions that if yo don't want anything that is genetic modified, you better grow it yourself and use heirloom seeds. If you buy it at the store it's been altered. The best example is corn. All corn is genetically modified past it's original state. Corn cannot survive in the wild anymore without help from man.

JMHO.

[Bushman]

Sugar Beets are also a product produced in part of our state and depending on the micro distillers license (if it's agriculture) a certain percent of the product has to be produced in our state so if the alcohol their producing uses sugar and not AG they are also probably using beet sugar.

[Odin]

As a white sugar, I would think beet or cane would be pretty similar. Some tests on beet vs cane molasses we did in The Netherlands gave a bit "NO!" on trying to make rum from beet molasses.

Odin.

[Prairiepiss]

I still haven't found a bag of sugar that didn't say cane sugar on it. Even the generic ones say cane sugar. Where are you guys finding this stuff?

[buflowing]

Costco. Michigan Sugar Company. No mention of source other than "Locally grown. Locally owned." Don't think they grown cane here.

[Odin]

Over here, in Europe, most sugar is beet based.

Odin.

[cranky]

2. My wife is a high powered PhD Dietitian that owns here own consulting business and is a professor at a local state college. She states that sugar is sugar. She further has stated to others on several occasions that if yo don't want anything that is genetic modified, you better grow it yourself and use heirloom seeds. If you buy it at the store it's been altered. The best example is corn. All corn is genetically modified past it's original state. Corn cannot survive in the wild anymore without help from man.

JMHO.

No offense intended here, but while perhaps technically true, this is a common misconception between hybridization and genetic modification. Hybridization is accomplished through selective cross pollination (much like dog breeding) but Genetic modification (as referred to in food) is accomplished in a lab and adds DNA that could never be achieved through cross pollination. There are lots of reasons for these lab modified seeds, the Most common now is to make the plant round up resistant and with corn they have been modified to produce it's own pesticide. By consuming these genetically lab modified foods we are potentially modifying our bodies on a molecular level and being used as lab rats by corporations in the interest of profit.
On another note Just about the time this GMO sugar started hitting the market my wife began complaining that the sugar I was buying didn't taste the same any more and asked me to only buy C&H. I guess she just has a more sensitive palate but as we came to find out later she was right. So maybe most of us cant tell the difference. Maybe sugar is sugar and corn is corn but there is a reason we don't let distillate come in contact with plastics, shouldn't what it is made out of be just as important?

[bentstick]

Costco. Michigan Sugar Company. No mention of source other than "Locally grown. Locally owned." Don't think they grown cane here.

If it sez locally grow and bought in Mich it is beet sugar,ie Pioneer sugar is the biggest here I belive!

PP there so many miles of sugar beat fields here they don't need to import cane to the plants,so we get beat sugar,refineries are close by!

[friendly1uk]

2. My wife is a high powered PhD Dietitian that owns here own consulting business and is a professor at a local state college. She states that sugar is sugar. She further has stated to others on several occasions that if yo don't want anything that is genetic modified, you better grow it yourself and use heirloom seeds. If you buy it at the store it's been altered. The best example is corn. All corn is genetically modified past it's original state. Corn cannot survive in the wild anymore without help from man.

JMHO.

No offense intended here, but while perhaps technically true, this is a common misconception between hybridization and genetic modification. Hybridization is accomplished through selective cross pollination (much like dog breeding) but Genetic modification (as referred to in food) is accomplished in a lab and adds DNA that could never be achieved through cross pollination. There are lots of reasons for these lab modified seeds, the Most common now is to make the plant round up resistant and with corn they have been modified to produce it's own pesticide. By consuming these genetically lab modified foods we are potentially modifying our bodies on a molecular level and being used as lab rats by corporations in the interest of profit.
On another note Just about the time this GMO sugar started hitting the market my wife began complaining that the sugar I was buying didn't taste the same any more and asked me to only buy C&H. I guess she just has a more sensitive palate but as we came to find out later she was right. So maybe most of us cant tell the difference. Maybe sugar is sugar and corn is corn but there is a reason we don't let distillate come in contact with plastics, shouldn't what it is made out of be just as important?

If the wife is south american she has a 50% chance of having more taste receptors than normal. You have just a 15% chance of being a so called 'super taster' yourself.

Sugar is sugar. That is a line I have heard from food professionals before. It is accepted in many walks. Your not a sugar professional if your saying that though. They are different, anyone that uses it rather than talks about it will know this. In the uk most is branded silverspoon, a beet product. If I go north i can find whitworths cane which tastes a lot sweeter and burns better. Yet there site makes no mention of beet or cane when listing there varietys such as caster, brown or demerara. The industry seems in denial. Perhaps they don't want to single there product out, or limit the suppliers they could use, but for some reason they say sugar is sugar, but we know it is not from the very first post

[cranky]

If the wife is south american she has a 50% chance of having more taste receptors than normal. You have just a 15% chance of being a so called 'super taster' yourself.

Sugar is sugar. That is a line I have heard from food professionals before. It is accepted in many walks. Your not a sugar professional if your saying that though. They are different, anyone that uses it rather than talks about it will know this. In the uk most is branded silverspoon, a beet product. If I go north i can find whitworths cane which tastes a lot sweeter and burns better. Yet there site makes no mention of beet or cane when listing there varietys such as caster, brown or demerara. The industry seems in denial. Perhaps they don't want to single there product out, or limit the suppliers they could use, but for some reason they say sugar is sugar, but we know it is not from the very first post

I agree, There are ulterior motives to an awful lot of people saying things like "sugar is sugar" and "corn is corn" and suchlike and to tell the truth I have read an awful lot of posts about GMO that read almost identical to Okie-grog's post about his wife being a "high powered PhD Dietitian that owns here own consulting business". This almost seems like a standard script that always involves a woman who is a dietician and doesn't know the difference between genetically engineered and hybridized crops. (seems to me an educated person aught to know the difference and might have an opinion that maybe we shouldn't be messing with out food on a molecular level). And I honestly mean no offense to anybody but from his first post I figured him for a troll. The GMO seed companies spend a lot of money to pay trolls to do just what he did. I have read some of his other posts and figure he probably isn't a troll but boy that first post sounded just like that scripted pro GMO stuff to me.
And no my wife isn't South American but she does have an amazing palate and I figure if I have to spend a bit extra to assure I don't use GMO, I am happy to do so.

[DuckofDeath]

Sugar is not sugar. Beet sugar is not used in candy making because it doesn't silk. Cane sugar has to be used to make candy. So there is definitely something different about the two types. Now for fermenting I prefer the beet by far.

[Okie-Grog]

Sugar is not sugar. Beet sugar is not used in candy making because it doesn't silk. Cane sugar has to be used to make candy. So there is definitely something different about the two types. Now for fermenting I prefer the beet by far.

But, we rant making candy. As far as how our body's process the sugar it doesn't matter, same for the yeast. No different than the sugars we get from grains. Can't spin them either.

[cranky]

But, we rant making candy. As far as how our body's process the sugar it doesn't matter, same for the yeast. No different than the sugars we get from grains. Can't spin them either.

While perhaps theoretically all white sugar is the same, beet sugar and cane sugar do vary by a small percentage, in spite of what the sugar beet industry may say. Does 0.05% matter in taste? Depends on the taster. Does it matter in final product? You bet! Whether it is cookies, cake, candy, bread, or alcohol, differences will carry over, unless perhaps you are making neutral. Do yeast really process both types of sugar the same and does the round up ready gene or genes to make it pest resistant make a difference to the yeast? That is a question I have not been able to find an answer for, but I'm willing to bet it does.
One thing I can tell you is in the case of molasses, one study I found had this to say

" The molasses obtained after sugar beer processing contains about 60% sucrose and 40% other components. The nonsucrose substances include inorganic salts, raffinose, kestose, organic acids and nitrogen containing compounds.
The residual molasses after cane sugar processing contains about 4% inverted sugar, 30- 40% sucrose, 10-25% reducing substances, a very low amount of raffinose and no betaine and about 5% of aconitic acid"

So in the case of molasses there is a huge difference which will result in an almost completely different flavor. Also if brown sugar is being used beet brown sugar is refined white beet sugar with pure cane molasses added back in and the taste is quite different from cane brown sugar and most certainly will effect the final product, Why don't they use beet molasses in brown sugar? Because it is nasty and considered inedible and only used in animal feed. Of course this means that those sweet feed recipes are using beet molasses and that of course effects flavor.
All in all we work very hard to get a certain flavor from our products, whether it is wine, beer, rum, whiskey or any number of other products. We spend weeks, months, years and decades aging and tweaking our final product to be the best we have ever tasted. Everything we put into and take out of the entire process matters and no matter how small and seemingly insignificant an addition or subtraction may be it matters in the final product not just the sugar we use but the yeast strain and every other ingredient. It all makes a difference, It all matters.
Some people like beet sugar, some like cane, some like a certain type of molasses or corn or grain, and that's just fine. We are all individuals and we all have different preferences. DuckofDeath , who started this thread seems to think there is an advantage to beet. I personally refuse to let a giant chemical company use me as a lab rat for their own profit and don't like the fact that they control 95% of ANY food market. I feel that is an extremely dangerous position to allow a company to be in so I will stick to cane sugar and natural fruit juice and let other people who don't mind being lab rats use the beet sugar.

Just my opinion
Cranky

[plaztikjezuz]

I have been told not to use beet sugar because they spray the sugar beets with a sulphur solution to keep them from rotting while processing.

I have been told this why you do not see a Michigan sugar beet based rum.

[Shas69]

"But, we rant making candy. As far as how our body's process the sugar it doesn't matter, same for the yeast. No different than the sugars we get from grains."

With all due respect, we know better.
Fructose and sucrose are very different things,
and every competent paediatrician will tell you
to keep white sugar out of your child's diet.

We know, too, that the nature of alcohol is dependant
upon the sugar from which it is produced.
If that were not so we would be happily drinking
ethanol, methanol, and glycol interchangeably.
Until we have seen honest, long-term studies
demonstrating the safety of GMO food
(and thus far the evidence points in the opposite direction)
I, for one, will stick to non-GM sugars.

[cb_j]

I live in Australia, the sugar here is cane.
I have travelled to Europe, which i learned, sugar is beet.
I don't know to what extent, but what i do know is that i like Coca-Cola in France.
What i also learned (prior to the oversease experience) is to use beet sugar for belgian style ales.
I also prefer Heineken from Holland as opposed to the licensed stuff they make here.

To me, sugar is not sugar.

If it were so simple, i don't think there would be this discussion.

[guyonthecouch]

Monsanto is the devil!

[DAD300]

Monsanto is the devil!

And his brother DuPont...

[bentstick]

on that one DAD!

[cranky]

Monsanto is the devil!

And his brother DuPont...

Don't forget Bayer crop science. They are the ones responsible for contaminating the rice crops.

[thecroweater]

Pretty sure they don't allow GM food in Oz. Pretty sure they lost a court case on it not long ago. Personally I don't like the idea of selling modified food with out long term extensive testing. We had a case awhile back where Monsanto' s test crop contaminated neighbouring crops. Not only were the markets for those crops heavily restricted but Monsanto claimed (successfully) that it was their property so the farmers owed them. Big changes happened after that

[cranky]

Pretty sure they don't allow GM food in Oz. Pretty sure they lost a court case on it not long ago. Personally I don't like the idea of selling modified food with out long term extensive testing. We had a case awhile back where Monsanto' s test crop contaminated neighbouring crops. Not only were the markets for those crops heavily restricted but Monsanto claimed (successfully) that it was their property so the farmers owed them. Big changes happened after that

I made an incorrect statement earlier based on some outdated info. I have since deleted that post, The fact is Oz is allowing GMO crops

GMO crops accounted for about 15-20 percent of Australia's 3.2 million tonne canola crop in 2012/13, according to the Australian Oilseeds Federation (AOF), and the proportion has been growing.

I believe they are also hosting field trials of GMO wheat and The GM companies are also going after sugar cane and farmers who lose their Organic certification due to cross contamination have been told by the courts that there is no such thing as GMO contamination.

[cb_j]

GM labelling is thus, however;


http://www.foodstandards.gov.au/consume ... fault.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[cranky]

GM labelling is thus, however;


http://www.foodstandards.gov.au/consume ... fault.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Good information and labeling is required If Monsanto's anti labeling adds are to be believed your food costs must be about a million times what we pay.