Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

If it plugs in post it here

Moderator: Site Moderator

Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Pipinchaz » Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:33 pm

Hey all,
I have a Still Dragon large DIY controller kit that I am trying to put together with a couple of modifications that someone had posted (and for the life of me, can not remember where I got the diagram from). It is the standard controller with a SSR & pot. I have added a double pole 240V 30Amp switch, 240V LED indicator light, a 240V fan, and a Voltage/ Amp meter. I have attached the diagram that was posted and have wired it identical to the way it is drawn except for the terminal block for the connections. I have used a Buchanan connector to connect all of the "black and white" wires together respectively. So now that I have it all assembled accordingly, I plug it in and then turn on the switch on and the indicator light comes on and the voltage/ amp meter displays 240V on the voltage display and flashes 20 amps then goes to 0 on the Amp meter display. There is nothing going to the element at all. I have tried swapping the wires on the pot to the SSR terminals. I haven't tried swapping to another terminal on the pot.
Would someone more knowledgeable than I with electronics, please look over the diagram and see if there is something wrong.
I'm hoping to finish this up by the weekend end so I can run my cleaning and sacrificial run over the weekend. :lol: Thank you for your help.
Attachments
Controller-final.png
Controller-final.png (11.12 KiB) Viewed 487 times
Pipinchaz
Novice
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:32 pm
Location: NW Pa

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby HDNB » Wed Jul 12, 2017 6:03 pm

so what is the problem?

without having it in front of me, i'd guess the ammeter proves by flashing 20.

0 without the element connected is normal. turning the pot with nothing connected won't do anything.

or do you mean there is no power going to the element, when there should be?

need a bit more info.

resistance of element?
resistance of pot one direction, then the other?
power to the ssr but not out of the ssr?
power on the other leg?
I finally quit drinking for good.

now i drink for evil.
User avatar
HDNB
Site Mod
 
Posts: 4802
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:04 am
Location: the f-f-fu frozen north

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Desvio » Wed Jul 12, 2017 7:19 pm

Hoping you didn't do a dry-fire on your element and roast it, and energizing it with it connected to nothing, does nothing. What are you doing to test it out???
Last edited by Desvio on Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
People say that I'm a bad influence. I say the world's already f#cked -- I'm just adding to it.
User avatar
Desvio
Bootlegger
 
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:35 pm
Location: Pacific Northwest

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby kimbodious » Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:12 am

how I set up mine (240VAC Australia)
in Australia we'd call the red Active and the black Neutral

the black wire bypassed the two pole switch
the donut thing went around the red wire after the switch and before the SSVR
the black wire went from the meter to the element
mine doesnt have a fan or LED indicators (see pic from link in my signature)
kimbodious
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 285
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:57 pm

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby BDF » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:09 am

Have you measured the resistance across the potentiometer terminals you chose to wire up, to ensure it goes from extremely high to extremely low resistance as you rotate it through its position?

Does your fan spin up when you flip your power switch as well?

What does your volt/amp meter display when you plug in your controller with the element unplugged? Does it do that same flashing at 20 amp thing?

Did you try seeing if you could power your element with the SSR+Pot before adding any extras?

I recently put together the same kit, with the same mods save for the LED. Its also kinda hard seeing how the pot was wired up with that picture size and yellow wire color. Double check against the still dragon wire guide: https://www.stilldragon.org/uploads/man ... 131020.pdf
User avatar
BDF
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 240
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:38 pm
Location: USA Midwest

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Pipinchaz » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:38 am

Desvio,
I had 5 gallons of water in my keg to test the element. I had my hand held Amp meter connected to check the ampere as I was playing with the pot to make sure I was getting the correct reading on the digital Amp meter on my controller.

Thank you
Pipinchaz
Last edited by Pipinchaz on Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:14 am, edited 2 times in total.
Pipinchaz
Novice
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:32 pm
Location: NW Pa

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby StillerBoy » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:26 am

At your SSRV, your schematic showd that you have wires at 1 and 2, but no wires at 3 and 4, which are the wire to run the pot.. without these wires connected, you will get no power going to the element..

Mars
StillerBoy
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 399
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2016 6:27 pm
Location: Ontario

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby BDF » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:33 am

StillerBoy wrote:At your SSRV, your schematic showd that you have wires at 1 and 2, but no wires at 3 and 4, which are the wire to run the pot.. without these wires connected, you will get no power going to the element..

Mars


It is there, but in bright yellow:
Image
User avatar
BDF
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 240
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:38 pm
Location: USA Midwest

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Desvio » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:57 am

Everything seems to be in order, only thing that would lead me to is testing the individual components in your build. Right out of the gate my mushroom switch fried after 20 seconds running, you can pretty much guarantee most of it is made in China.
People say that I'm a bad influence. I say the world's already f#cked -- I'm just adding to it.
User avatar
Desvio
Bootlegger
 
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:35 pm
Location: Pacific Northwest

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Pipinchaz » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:13 pm

BDF wrote:Have you measured the resistance across the potentiometer terminals you chose to wire up, to ensure it goes from extremely high to extremely low resistance as you rotate it through its position?

Does your fan spin up when you flip your power switch as well?

What does your volt/amp meter display when you plug in your controller with the element unplugged? Does it do that same flashing at 20 amp thing?

Did you try seeing if you could power your element with the SSR+Pot before adding any extras?

I recently put together the same kit, with the same mods save for the LED. Its also kinda hard seeing how the pot was wired up with that picture size and yellow wire color. Double check against the still dragon wire guide: https://www.stilldragon.org/uploads/man ... 131020.pdf


BDF,
Yes I have checked the resistance across the pot, it is a 500K ohm pot and it checked 500.1K and 500K between the ends and then it will increase and decrease with the wiper and one of the ends so it is working like it should. I plan on trying another combination on the pot tonight. We'll see if that works or not. I might have the combination wrong on wiring the pot.
I did not try take the element out and see what happens, I will try that also.
As soon as I turn on the switch the fan and LED both come on.
I did not wire it up like the original SD diagram because I was pretty sure of myself (proved that wrong LOL).
I'm going to try a few things tonight and see if it will work.
Thank you
Pipinchaz
Novice
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:32 pm
Location: NW Pa

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Pikey » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:50 pm

Flashing 20 0 seems to indicate you have fried a component, otherwise where did the 20 come from ?

[Edit oh wait a minute - that ammeter only measures it's input from an inductance - so it could flash 20 0 each time yoou switch on as the voltage surge occurs maybe charging a capacitor in whatever that "SSVR" is - some sort of "black box" with all the real "gubbins" in I expect ]

The silicon is always the best place to start looking, if you ve checked the ohms each way on your heating element. You say you have a "SCR", but everything seems to get called "SCR" here. To me SCR means Silicon Controlled Rectifier - Which means that the current only flows one way and would reduce your voltage and amperage massively.

I expect what you actually have there is a triac - which is effectively two thyristors (SCR's) connected back to back. You would need to unsolder this to check it and they are not the easiest things to test, or if it has a number on it, look up the number and replace it with a similar one. Is your "240 volt led" really that, I was amazed that a led could cope with 240 volts without considerable buffering. We used to use Neons as fitted to cookers etc. If your LED is not on, check that first as it is easiest. [Edit2 - if it is blown, get rid or swap it for a neon, although on it's own I don't think it would stop the ball-game. ]
Pikey
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1550
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:29 pm
Location: At the edge of the Wild Wood

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Pikey » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:17 pm

Thanks BDF for linking to that little schematic - What voltage range are you getting from pin 4 to ground ? as you adjust the pot ?
Pikey
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1550
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:29 pm
Location: At the edge of the Wild Wood

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Pipinchaz » Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:40 pm

Houston, We have a working controller!!!
Thank you everyone for your advise and suggestions. It ended up being the wiring configuration for the pot. I had the wires on the wrong terminals, so it just took a little more experimenting to get the right set up. I now will be able to do my cleaning run and sacrificial run this weekend. Yahooooo :clap:
Thank you again!
PC

Well I was going to add a picture of the controller but it is to big and I don't know how to reduce the pixels to get it attached. :thumbdown:
Pipinchaz
Novice
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2016 6:32 pm
Location: NW Pa

Re: Modified 240V Still Dragon Controller problem

Postby Pikey » Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:05 am

Pipinchaz wrote:
......Well I was going to add a picture of the controller but it is to big and I don't know how to reduce the pixels to get it attached. :thumbdown:


http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=66849

Really pleased you're up and running :thumbup:
Pikey
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1550
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:29 pm
Location: At the edge of the Wild Wood


Return to Related Electric Accessories



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests