Steam Injection Attachment

Any steam Cooking /Distilling Device

Moderator: Site Moderator

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby ShineRunnah » Mon Dec 22, 2014 3:57 pm

Brutal wrote:Holy shit Sir! That's some stripping! You're gonna be striping more than Anna Nicole Smith at an old folks home.


I've got what my dad calls "Tim the toolman" syndrome. Its gotta be bigger, badder, faster and more powerful than necessary. I've calmed down a bit over time, but I still go for a touch of overkill.

I had a bunch of extra 2" copper I bought for my ccvm column before I decided I needed a glass column, and as I was looking at it, I got this crazy idea for a double condenser stripping head and figured why not. I like a good challenge, and this qualifies!
Figuring out how to do it safely is the biggest challenge. I get a blockage in the vapor path running that much power, it would be really bad, really fast. Ive added redundant pressure releases, pressure gauge and a manual valve on the keg to dump pressure in a hurry if needed (vented away from myself and into my explosion-proof exhaust fan)

Hey, its fun, keeps me home and out of trouble and I get to learn all sorts of stuff. Not something everyone is probably interested in, but I enjoy it.
ShineRunnah
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 313
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:44 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby shadylane » Mon Dec 22, 2014 4:18 pm

If your running a 2" condenser, a blockage isn't likely.
User avatar
shadylane
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 5320
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:54 pm
Location: Hiding In the Boiler room of the Insane asylum

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby ShineRunnah » Mon Dec 22, 2014 9:18 pm

shadylane wrote:If your running a 2" condenser, a blockage isn't likely.


As I've planned to use this keg as a steam generator for a mash tun, it would need a pressure relief anyway. And it doesn't hurt to be safe.

Murphy also stops by to visit me regularly and make sure his law is in full effect. I'm trying to keep him away from my still, and had good luck thus far. If a relief valve keeps him out of my shop, I'll be sure to have two...just because shit happens!

I also had a neighbor suffer a water heater explosion years ago, and I want no part of that. I thought my house got hit by a truck, and he's 200'+ across the road.
ShineRunnah
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 313
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:44 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby shadylane » Tue Dec 23, 2014 4:28 am

I agree with the pressure relief.
Attachments
DSCF0083 (600x800).jpg
15 psi steam rated relief valve
User avatar
shadylane
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 5320
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:54 pm
Location: Hiding In the Boiler room of the Insane asylum

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby shadylane » Tue Dec 30, 2014 6:40 pm

On of the problems with using a electric keg for making steam is that the keg needs to be modified.
Here's possibly a way of using a keg for steam and maintaining the original pressure rating.
Attachments
upside down keg steam generator.png
upside down keg steam generator.png (8.18 KiB) Viewed 2754 times
User avatar
shadylane
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 5320
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:54 pm
Location: Hiding In the Boiler room of the Insane asylum

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby ShineRunnah » Tue Dec 30, 2014 7:13 pm

Shady, had my fittings TIG welded, no worries there. Pressure tested to 60psi with no issues and no leaks.
ShineRunnah
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 313
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:44 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby shadylane » Wed Dec 31, 2014 3:32 pm

myles wrote:
shadylane wrote:Direct steam injection and enzymes !
All you need now is a mixer that clamps to the top of the barrel


Sorry shadylane but you are hitting a sore nerve now.

Anyone using steam injection has no need at all for mixer or agitator. Let the steam do the work. With the right combination of steam injectors and flow rate, agitation is no problem.

Sorry, will get off my soapbox. :lol:


Your right. Now I've got to figure out how.
This thought came to mind, don't know if it will work or what the demission's need to be, nor the steam pressure needed.
Attachments
steam injector.png
steam injector.png (5.69 KiB) Viewed 2733 times
User avatar
shadylane
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 5320
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:54 pm
Location: Hiding In the Boiler room of the Insane asylum

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby bship » Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:51 pm

Brutal, This is great! I was thinking I would have to cook small batches outside and haul down to my "shed".

This is a big step toward AG for me, nice to be able to use what I already have.

Thanks for sharing, glad I found it

Cheers
bship
Novice
 
Posts: 89
Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2014 9:01 am

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby stevem1928 » Wed Feb 18, 2015 7:26 pm

I just made a similar steam injector for mashing. I made a similar end, but do not have the ss cross sections. I plan to either cut slits or drill holes. I can't find any references ads to which are better. Also where should they be drilled? Top, side or bottom? Any recommendations for hole size?
stevem1928
Novice
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2014 10:19 am

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby Brutal » Wed Feb 18, 2015 9:22 pm

stevem1928 wrote:Any recommendations for hole size?

That's what she said.

Post up some damn pictures already!!
Steam injection rig http://tinyurl.com/kxmz8hy
All grain corn mash with steam injection and enzymes http://tinyurl.com/mp6zdt5
Inner tube condenser http://tinyurl.com/zkp3ps6
User avatar
Brutal
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1337
Joined: Sat May 18, 2013 6:02 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby shadylane » Sat Feb 21, 2015 1:45 pm

Here's what I've been using for steam injection.
It's made from SS coated hose. I cut the ends off the hose and slid the SS braid off.
The braid is clamped to the 1/2 copper tube with a piece of twisted copper wire.
The other end of the braided SS is twisted to seal the end. In hind sight, leaving the end open would probably be best.
The injector fits through a 3/4 SS ferrell welded into the top of my keg stripper.
Attachments
DSCF0002 (400x300).jpg
DSCF0006 (400x300).jpg
DSCF0005 (400x300).jpg
User avatar
shadylane
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 5320
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:54 pm
Location: Hiding In the Boiler room of the Insane asylum

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby shadylane » Sat Feb 21, 2015 2:08 pm

On a side note. The dings and dents in the braid is from my drill powered mixer.
Running the mixer so the flow is down works best for mixing and keeps from tangling the braid in the prop. :oops:
User avatar
shadylane
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 5320
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:54 pm
Location: Hiding In the Boiler room of the Insane asylum

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby humbledore » Sat Feb 21, 2015 2:37 pm

Good job Brutal. I'm liking this thread. All you folks running steam, does it create a lot of humidity in the room, or does it all just condense back into the mash? This looks like a good thing for garage or shed, but I have a small indoor space. I would love to get a massive big old brew in a bag, larger container and a block and tackle to lift it out.
User avatar
humbledore
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 899
Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:12 pm
Location: The third coast

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby TinkerTech » Sat Feb 21, 2015 4:07 pm

Brilliant solution to cooking mash without flame or ruining elements burning grain.

You said you did 50lbs of corn, and it took 1.5 hrs to get it to 190F. How much water was heated with the grain?
How much more water was added by the steam injection to reach 190F, and how much per hour to maintain 190F?
Just trying to figure out starting and ending water quantities in the mash.

I don't see steam pressure being an issue as long as there is no chance to plug, and with this rig as setup, I cant see it ever plugging.
Steam pressure simply needs to be high enough to push the mash fluid in the pipe down, ~5 psi? Must be a standard formula out there to calculate it.

Thanks, this solves some problems I was thinking about with "how am I going to do this without much pain and suffering".

smarter, not harder
TinkerTech
Novice
 
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:03 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby Brutal » Sun Feb 22, 2015 7:06 am

Pressure can be a very bad thing with a set up like this. If the boiler has 5 psi of pressure it will raise the boiling point of water to aprx. 225f. (All standard measures and assuming sea level.) The dangerous thing about 225f water is if the pressure is let off quickly the entire volume of water will instantly and somewhat explosively boil. I've discovered this recently through research and not disaster thankfully. I haven't decided yet what the best safety mechanism would be either. Having a release with a larger opening when it blows might be worse than having a smaller one. I'm just not sure yet. I purchased a pressure/vacuum gauge to hook up to mine but haven't set it up yet. It will smoothly move between pressure and vacuum, and I'm really looking forward to watching it as I run the steamer. I'm going to make a little mount for it and my remote thermostat. Little dashboard for drivin' this baby.

@TinkerTech, I tried to "eyeball" the water I used in that mash. I used much less than I should have. I won't do that again. When you heat a volume to boiling or near boiling a rough number for the volume of water added is 15%. Environmental factors can make it slightly higher or slightly lower but it won't be far from 15%. The less heat you lose (from the steamed vessel), the lower the volume added. Also starting at lower temperatures means you will add more.

I am actually going to use the steamer again today. I graduated the big ass barrel to show volumes of 10, 20, 30, and 40 gallons. I added 40 gallons of tap water to it Friday night, then stuck the steamer in, and poured 100 pounds of cracked corn in straight from the bag. I left the top off and just let it sit and soak since then. Soaking the corn like this softens it up and makes the cooking times less. Thinking of starting a thread about this one and if I do I'll link it here.
Steam injection rig http://tinyurl.com/kxmz8hy
All grain corn mash with steam injection and enzymes http://tinyurl.com/mp6zdt5
Inner tube condenser http://tinyurl.com/zkp3ps6
User avatar
Brutal
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1337
Joined: Sat May 18, 2013 6:02 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby W Pappy » Mon Feb 23, 2015 12:48 am

Well hell looks like the solder is coming back out, got to do some scrounging for parts.
Great stuff there Brutal hell of a setup! :thumbup:
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
 
Posts: 1144
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby Brutal » Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:18 pm

Thanks Pappy!

I was just walking through the garage and found something really odd looking. When I was done with the steamer yesterday I took the head off it and scrubbed it with a brush in the sink. No soap just water trying to get the corn chunks off it. It looked a little funny last time, but this time it turned white. It doesn't rub off either.

Can anyone help me understand why this happened?
IMG_20150223_171001.jpg
White copper
Steam injection rig http://tinyurl.com/kxmz8hy
All grain corn mash with steam injection and enzymes http://tinyurl.com/mp6zdt5
Inner tube condenser http://tinyurl.com/zkp3ps6
User avatar
Brutal
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1337
Joined: Sat May 18, 2013 6:02 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby Brutal » Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:22 pm

Well I posted before I googled.. Do you think it could be zinc transferring onto the copper? Where did I get zinc from??
http://youtu.be/_g_ml8tAnWE
Steam injection rig http://tinyurl.com/kxmz8hy
All grain corn mash with steam injection and enzymes http://tinyurl.com/mp6zdt5
Inner tube condenser http://tinyurl.com/zkp3ps6
User avatar
Brutal
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1337
Joined: Sat May 18, 2013 6:02 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby Brutal » Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:26 pm

Here I used a flash and it made it look worse than it is.
IMG_20150223_170935.jpg
White copper with the flash.
Steam injection rig http://tinyurl.com/kxmz8hy
All grain corn mash with steam injection and enzymes http://tinyurl.com/mp6zdt5
Inner tube condenser http://tinyurl.com/zkp3ps6
User avatar
Brutal
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1337
Joined: Sat May 18, 2013 6:02 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby shadylane » Mon Feb 23, 2015 5:45 pm

The nickel from the SS braid is plating the copper ?
User avatar
shadylane
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 5320
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 11:54 pm
Location: Hiding In the Boiler room of the Insane asylum

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby TinkerTech » Mon Feb 23, 2015 6:01 pm

Unlikely electroplating with the grounded keg and grounded drill/stirrer.
Lime/mineral scale from the mash water depositing on the ~200+F hot copper pipe?
TinkerTech
Novice
 
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:03 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby W Pappy » Mon Feb 23, 2015 6:13 pm

Well I ain't no expert but looks like hard water to me mineral deposits building up I could be wrong. :think:
It is gonna oxidize quicker being heated submerged and then open to the air I thinks.
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
 
Posts: 1144
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby Brutal » Mon Feb 23, 2015 9:15 pm

Just checked and that cheap drill is not grounded, but my boiler is of course. The mash stirrer is all stainless and I washed it pretty good before use. The first time I used this steamer it looked funny afterward too but not this bad. I kinda thought my local water was somewhat deficient of minerals, or at least not over abundant. I don't get white streaks in the shower much.

Found the report. Let me know what you guys think of my water.
Water10.jpg

water11.jpg
Steam injection rig http://tinyurl.com/kxmz8hy
All grain corn mash with steam injection and enzymes http://tinyurl.com/mp6zdt5
Inner tube condenser http://tinyurl.com/zkp3ps6
User avatar
Brutal
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1337
Joined: Sat May 18, 2013 6:02 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby W Pappy » Mon Feb 23, 2015 9:45 pm

Rad is the man on water wish he would jump in here.
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
 
Posts: 1144
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby DeepSouth » Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:00 am

http://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-chemi ... dAdditions

All your mineral levels appear to be in a normal range for brewing, with the exception of calcium which is slightly low, and sulfate which is unknown from your attached water report.
DeepSouth
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 298
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2014 4:28 am

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby rad14701 » Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:43 am

Steam causes mineral buildup to occur far more rapidly than ambient temperature water... The hotter the water gets, the more prevalent the mineral buildup... Shouldn't be anything to worry about, just something to be aware of as it may require additional cleanup procedures... I have this same issue even with using a whole house filter and water softener... I haven't had more than the standard county health department testing done but my water is safe for use... And while several measurements on Brutals report appear somewhat high, the health department hasn't issued an no drink recommendation...
User avatar
rad14701
Master Distiller
 
Posts: 20873
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:46 pm
Location: New York, USA

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby Brutal » Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:59 am

Thanks for the replies fellas. So if this is just mineral build up, and it's going to do it again, should I even bother trying to clean it off?
Steam injection rig http://tinyurl.com/kxmz8hy
All grain corn mash with steam injection and enzymes http://tinyurl.com/mp6zdt5
Inner tube condenser http://tinyurl.com/zkp3ps6
User avatar
Brutal
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 1337
Joined: Sat May 18, 2013 6:02 pm

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby Drunk-N-Smurf » Tue Feb 24, 2015 8:10 am

Try soaking in vinegar to clear off the minerals..

Minerals definately drop out faster the hotter the water. I believe when I was in trade school, they said 140f is a magic number for water heaters, any lower and bacteria can grow in the tank, any higher and the minerals start dropping out.
Hangover? I don't get no stinking hangover!
User avatar
Drunk-N-Smurf
Rumrunner
 
Posts: 684
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 11:56 pm
Location: Alberta

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby W Pappy » Tue Feb 24, 2015 8:15 am

I think if you throw a gallon or so of vinegar in a plastic tub and let that soak when it starts looking like that.
It will clean er up good and keep her in good shape.
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
 
Posts: 1144
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: Steam Injection Attachment

Postby TinkerTech » Tue Feb 24, 2015 9:48 am

Vinegar will clean it right up with an overnight soak but other than looks, its not hurting anything.
I'd let it go until it starts to offend your sense of aesthetics.. :problem:
TinkerTech
Novice
 
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:03 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Steam Mashing and Distilling



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest