Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Discussions of fruits/ veggies and grains other then just mashing

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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Sat Dec 17, 2016 6:59 pm

Today I got delivery of a 5 gallon used Balcones barrel :D
BARREL - C.JPG

I didn't really want a used one but I'm too cheap for a new one :roll: because I want it for brandy. To me a used whiskey barrel tends to impart whiskey flavor to the spirit that is put in it and I don't want my brandy to taste like whiskey. There is also a problem with a new barrel of course, that being, to me, a new charred barrel makes the spirit taste too much like bourbon. So if I were ordering a new barrel it's likely I would order it toasted but not charred. Then I might even use a neutral to condition it into what I want. But as I said, I am too cheap to buy a new barrel so I wound up buying a used barrel. It has been used twice and smells very nice, not headsy, even fruity. My evil plan is to use it to barrel age 5 gallons of apple cider, maybe even do that twice, to get the barrel conditioned for the brandy to take a nice long time to mature.

I am sort of following in the footsteps of the Calvados makers, they never use a new barrel and feel the older the better so the oak doesn't over dominate the spirit. So hopefully the whiskey flavor will be imparted into the cider, which should make a nice interesting cider. Then the barrel should be ready to be used for the brandy and hopefully in a few years I will have a nice Calvados like Brandy.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Mon Dec 19, 2016 6:43 pm

As you know from my post the other day I just got a barrel. So now I have been researching ways to use it. Of course I could do the standard and use it for brandy, whiskey and rum but as I mentioned before I want it for brandy and since it has previously been used for whiskey I need to condition it for the brandy before I put the brandy in it.

My plan is to use it to barrel age cider before using it for brandy. So I started researching barrel aging cider and got all sorts of ideas. Some people are barrel aging cider pretty much the same way as most everything else is being aged, empty the whiskey, fill with cider, wait. Then there are other interesting things going on. One thing I think is interesting is Pommeau, which is basically apple juice mixed with apple eau de vie then barrel aged. Then there is one that I am really finding intriguing, apple port. Basically from what I understand is they freeze concentrate sweet cider, ferment cold until it reaches a certain sweetness, then add eau de vie to bring the ABV to 18-20% an alternative is to ferment dry, sweeten with apple sweet cider, add eau de vie and then barrel age for a year. I would have to have more barrels to actually do that but it is a thought for the future. Right now my basic plan for this barrel is to age some hard cider in it for 4-6 months, then fill it with apple brandy for 6 months to a year and see what I think.

I am also thinking if I do manage to get to that 100 gallons of sweet cider next year I can freeze concentrate 10 gallons down to 5 and use the barrel for apple port after taking the brandy out. Then after the port is taken out use it for long term aging of brandy. Of course my ultimate goal is to achieve as close as I can to a good long term aged Calvados. They say Calvadose doesn't really come into it's own for at least 10 years and is amazing after 20. I'm not quite sure how that translates to a small barrel but I am certainly going to do my best to find out.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby Shine0n » Sat Dec 31, 2016 7:29 am

That's sounds awesome Cranky! Next weekend I'm going to start my apple juice concentrate so that by next Christmas I have some that's close to a year :thumbup

My plan is to use enough concentrate to make a 18 gallon ferment at 1.060 and then use 3 different type of apples, golden delicious, granny smith and one other to be determined and use them in the ferment. Unless that's
a complete no no, then I'll press.
I'll use 20 lbs and fine chop and let sit for 3 days before adding to the fermenter when the must is made.
I'm going to use Ec1118 since you said it's easier for cuts and let the ferment go for a month.
Once it clears I'll run through my pot still with thumper and do 1 run only and with 18 gal I will have enough to fill the thumper too.
I do have a way to connect to my worm without the thumper if you think I'll lose any flavors with the thumper.
I've used my thump for the other fruits I've done just not apples. But as for now the thumper is in my plans.

What is your take on running with the fruit in the boiler , or in the thumper? I did make the false bottom for my thumper and have pondered loading it with fresh apples to let the steam pass through.
I've been in experimenting mode for the last month or so and have gotten myself some really nice rumsky I like making but that's for another conversation, point I'm making is I have a very firm grip on my rig and it's potential and I like to mix up things a bit by not going down the beaten path.

If you see anything wrong with what I'm trying to do please feel free to point it out to me.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:31 am

Shine0n I believe Der Wo swears by running fruit including apples with the pulp in the boiler. I think he may have a thread on it somewhere. I don't do it that way for a couple reasons. The first one is the space the pulp takes up. I did the actual math one but am going off of memory, and since my memory is crap I may be wrong but I figure it takes at least 30% more space to run on the pulp, so I get a lot more product per charge by running without. Storage space is a t a premium for me too so fermenting on the pulp takes up room I really don't have to spare. The other big reason is I understand there is an increase in heads when you ferment on the pulp plus other less desirable things that come from seeds. I like the idea of running with chopped or crushed apples in the in a thumper. One of these days I hope to get around to making a thumper myself and try it. I was very impressed by what Red Rim did with his thumper.

I am actually getting close to being able to do some running. I finally got my engine back last week and have it almost ready to go in, if only the weather would cooperate. :roll: Getting that done will free up a lot of time and space in my garage and I should be able to get this years brandy run off.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby der wo » Sun Jan 01, 2017 6:42 am

A month ago I distilled two batches apples on the pulp. Two months ago two batches pears on the pulp. I never fermented and distilled without the pulp, except oranges. So I never would argue, that my method is better. I distill with an agitator, so not only scorching is no problem, but also an even temparature in the thick mash is always given without adding much water to the mash.

I only know one study about it:

Pear Distillates from Pear Juice Concentrate: Effect of Lees in the Aromatic Composition
https://www.bostonapothecary.com/wp-con ... ntrate.pdf

it can be concluded that the compounds that are considered to be negative for the quality of the distillates (methanol, ethyl acetate, furfural) diminish or do not change their concentrations when they are distilled in the presence of lees, for all of the equipment tested. In addition, the positive compounds (ethyl decanoate and ethyl-2-trans-4-cis-decadienoate) increase their concentrations in the presence of lees for all of the equipment tested. So, it can be assumed that distillation in the presence of lees leads to a better quality product.

But both mashes were fermented with the pulp, and one of them distilled with and the other without the pulp. Not exactly, what we are comparing here, because cranky doesn't ferment with the pulp. And the study is also about the effect of copper to the distillate.
And it's theoretical. Only because this study sees advantages with the pulp, it doesn't mean, that it will taste better for you too, or that it will be the same with apples or plums.

If I had a thumper and no agitator, I definetely would try out fermenting on the pulp and distill it with the pulp in the thumper. And if I had more than one batch, I would try out both.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby Worm_Drippinz » Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:56 pm

Did anybody notice that parsnip wine recipe in the beginning of this thread calls for 4lb of sugar to one gallon of water? :shock:
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby wtfdskin » Fri Jan 13, 2017 7:59 am

Tomorrows project. Not a good year for apples. Only harvested 16 bushel from my orchard. Going to turn that into ginger brandy. Did manage to collect two buckets of crabapples this year. They always seem to do well no matter the weather. [img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170113/d18e2e37c43a53b34d10603dfc756a8a.jpg[/img]
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby Jimbo » Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:31 am

Cranky, that used barrel should be perfect for your apple brandy. I wouldnt worry too much about whiskey flavors corrupting your brandy. If youre worried, pour a quart of brandy in there and slosh it around a few times for a couple days. That will at least rinse most of the bourbon. Then give it a taste, see if it tastes like it came from Kentucky not from the apples in your yard.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby wtfdskin » Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:45 am

[img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170115/4676e28e959b7e5399306911f2fa9326.jpg[/img]
[img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170115/c7340996e4b54be1db4831af148e278f.jpg[/img]
Production
Last edited by wtfdskin on Sun Jan 15, 2017 12:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby rad14701 » Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:46 pm

wtfdskin wrote:Production<SNIP>

Tapatalk image links suck...!!! Do your uploads the proper way, directly to the HD server...!!! Figure it out...!!! When you see that your attempts are broken, that's your sign...!!!

I freaking HATE Tapatalk...!!! :evil:
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby wtfdskin » Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:11 pm

rad14701 wrote:
wtfdskin wrote:Production<SNIP>

Tapatalk image links suck...!!! Do your uploads the proper way, directly to the HD server...!!! Figure it out...!!! When you see that your attempts are broken, that's your sign...!!!

I freaking HATE Tapatalk...!!! :evil:

You know, I've thought a while about how to respond to this and stay within the forum rules, but you know what.......

How about you just calm the fuck down. There is no need to act like that. Get over yourself.

Done.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby rad14701 » Sun Jan 15, 2017 7:50 am

wtfdskin wrote:
rad14701 wrote:
wtfdskin wrote:Production<SNIP>

Tapatalk image links suck...!!! Do your uploads the proper way, directly to the HD server...!!! Figure it out...!!! When you see that your attempts are broken, that's your sign...!!!

I freaking HATE Tapatalk...!!! :evil:

You know, I've thought a while about how to respond to this and stay within the forum rules, but you know what.......

How about you just calm the fuck down. There is no need to act like that. Get over yourself.

Done.

I have every right to my own opinions regarding Tapatalk, an app that leaves advertisements behind with every post made with it, as well as its use of external links which are frowned upon... The folks who are using Tapatalk are making a mess of these forums with messed up links, advertising (which is against forum policies), and expecting those of us who use real computers to overlook its deficiencies because folks feel the need to live on their phones... Prove me wrong... Now, post locally rather than using external links - or continue to make a mess of these forums like you don't even care... I'm not mad at you and don't need to get over myself... Tapatalk is the POS that irks me... The continued use by members merely disappoints me...
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby wtfdskin » Sun Jan 15, 2017 8:10 am

Yes you do have a right to your opinion as do I to use what works for me. I dont have time to sit in front of a computer. I travel for my work. I will continue to use it until it is not available to this forum. You say we expect you to overlook tapatalks deficiencies yet you expect us tapatalk users to take hours and chain ourselves to a computer.

My point was the way your post was written. Your second post was much more respectful. I have as thick a skin as anyone else. But if you decide to go off like that expect it to come right back at you.

No hard feelings here, we're all grown ups. I dont even post that much for this exact reason. Dont need the bullshit. Life is to busy abd to short for this crap. I mostly read and learn. If i feel i have something to contribute I post. If you dont like my posts block me.

I'm over it. Enjoy your day.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby der wo » Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:33 am

I think, the best would be, the mods delete those posts. Including mine.
If not, please wtfdskin repair the pictures.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby wtfdskin » Sun Jan 15, 2017 12:07 pm

Not a problem der wo. They appeared as working on my device all along. I edited and reupped. If they arent working now the mods can just delete the whole thing. Nothing important anyway. Just wanted to show a simple, cheap, easy to build yet efficient fruit pressing operation. :)
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby still_stirrin » Sun Jan 15, 2017 1:30 pm

wtfdskin wrote:...They appeared as working on my device all along. I edited and reupped....Just wanted to show a simple, cheap, easy to build yet efficient fruit pressing operation.

Well, "without pictures...it didn't happen".

You've been advised to post pictures on the HD website because we can't see what you're talking about. And without evidence, it's just hearsay. :thumbdown:
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby wtfdskin » Sun Jan 15, 2017 1:38 pm

Then i guess it never happened.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby raketemensch » Fri Feb 17, 2017 1:27 pm

Apples schmapples, is the porch done yet?
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:07 pm

raketemensch wrote:Apples schmapples, is the porch done yet?

:esurprised: :wtf: :oops: :crazy: :lol: It is down to trimwork and because I can't do anything the easy way I am making every single piece myself. The damn wet season caught me just before I finished and then I got busy working on the truck ( viewtopic.php?f=7&t=65226 ) Fortunately now the apple reaper is up and running and I'm getting around to the house again. The wife will have a cow if I don't finish various little projects before I start messing with fruit again. The rainy season makes it pretty miserable to try to work outside but the weather is starting to get better so hopefully I can get the house taken care of in time for the next fruit season, which is fast approaching. I also need to get around to running all that apple and bottle various other things. I was cleaning the garage yesterday and found out I'm down to only 12 beer and 12 wine bottles so I need to go round up more of those just so I can bottle.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby yakattack » Fri Feb 24, 2017 7:24 am

Is it apple season yet :moresarcasm: :D
HDNB wrote: The trick here is to learn what leads to a stalled mash....and quit doing that.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby wtfdskin » Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:49 am

Im concerned this year. Its been in the 60s here and 75 today. Hope the buds stay away a while yet. Back to cold and snow this weekend. Although i love the weather, its too damn early for the trees
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Fri Feb 24, 2017 6:23 pm

yakattack wrote:Is it apple season yet :moresarcasm: :D

Only 130 days to the start of apple season :esurprised: Damn I need to get it in gear or I won't be ready once again!
Cherry season is probably 4-6 weeks before that and since I got permission to pick that big cherry tree I might actually manage to do that kirsch this year. Plum season starts even before cherry season. One of the guys I work with bought a new house last year and there is a mature plum tree in the yard I hope to pick as well as the ones I did the past 2 years. That is if it survives :? We got a heavy snow a few weeks ago and it fell over. I returned his engine hoist the other day and took a look at it. It looks like the tap root is broken but it is still alive. I figure if he gets it stood back upright it will probably be OK, if not I will ask him for one of the logs to make aging wood out of.

Fortunately the snow brought in just about the right amount of freeze at the right time to do the fruit trees good, this should be a very good fruit year but I need to get my blueberries dug up and moved soon or I won't get any this year.

Then there is blackberry season. This is the year I am going to get enough blackberries that I succeed in making a blackberry brandy. I'm also hoping now that the apple reaper is back up and running the wife will be a little more tolerant of my fruit obsession but I also need to get in gear on the house. I am actually going to make it so she can park in the garage, which is an absurd idea but for some reason it's something she has always wanted to do so I am determined to make it happen. Before that I need to get some more bottles and bottle up that 5 gallons of barrel aged cider I have as well as 10 or 15 gallons of plum wine and the rest of the cider needs run off to make brandy to fill that barrel back up. Then I need to build shelves and rearrange my stilling area which is going to be a lot of work but I am determined to make that happen too.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:48 pm

I've been very busy this weekend (my weekend is Wed-Thur). Yesterday I got the front yard cleaned up in spite if the rain and still got that second run of Cheez-it done while I cleaned at the garage. Today I have been busy running off the first run of apple brandy and continuing to clean at the garage. I've made lots of progress on the garage, you can actually walk in there :esurprised: and hope to get it to the point of parking a car in it soon :D but first I need to get all these buckets and carboys out of the way. The only way to do that is to do a lot of running and bottling. So I am running. I gotta say the yield was pretty low on this first batch which was nothing but the transparent apples but it is sure some tasty stuff. I've also been working on finding and cleaning bottles so I can take the barrel aged cider out of the barrel and bottle it. It has been in the barrel for almost 3 months now and it is time to get last years brandy in there. I haven't done anything with last years brandy because I have been debating just how to oak it. When I got the barrel I didn't want to put the brandy in right away for fear it would impart too much whiskey flavor in the brandy but I now think it is at the point to make the move and see what happens. It looks like I have about 114 days to the beginning of apple season so I really need to get in gear on this. I was going through my bottles and thought I didn't have enough but found another case of them so I can finally get that done. Hopefully I can also get around to getting that package out to MCH. I have the last of the 2015 (?) brandy for him, some of Bearrivers plum vodka and should have a bottle or two of the barrel aged cider. I might even throw in a bottle of Unicorn Sweat thats been sitting on a heater vent all winter for him to share with you East coast guys. :D
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby yakattack » Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:58 pm

And the countdown begins!
HDNB wrote: The trick here is to learn what leads to a stalled mash....and quit doing that.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:09 pm

yakattack wrote:And the countdown begins!

Yep, it seems like I have so much time at the end of the season but there is always so much to get done and Seattle winters are so wet, cloudy and dark that it sucks the energy right out of you and all you want to do is sleep.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby goose eye » Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:19 pm

Get you some duckins an put under tree make you a hook an shake the tree. Don't look up. Some apples will launch a ways. Grab duckin an just pull it out then grab a corner an make a pile an sort or get you a snow shovel an load.

Get you some crab apple start an graft your Apple to that. Whip . Doin a limb try a bud or banana graft. Don't need no wax or any of that store bought graftin stuff. Keep fruit pulled off til it got a couple years. Train limbs with clothes pins an sticks. Central leader.

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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:39 pm

goose eye wrote:Get you some duckins an put under tree make you a hook an shake the tree. Don't look up. Some apples will launch a ways. Grab duckin an just pull it out then grab a corner an make a pile an sort or get you a snow shovel an load.

Get you some crab apple start an graft your Apple to that. Whip . Doin a limb try a bud or banana graft. Don't need no wax or any of that store bought graftin stuff. Keep fruit pulled off til it got a couple years. Train limbs with clothes pins an sticks. Central leader.

Ole boys was taught by one of the best not that they is.

So I'm tole

I assume what you are calling a duckin I would call a tarp or is it something else? I have a nice big tarp and might try that this year.

I got my scions for my next round of grafting ready and waiting in the refrigerator. I had a few successes last year but still haven't figured out exactly what I keep doing wrong, maybe grafting too early. last year I had some birds break some of the grafts that took including the pear graft from my favorite tree which was bulldozed and I can't get any more cuttings from :( I also have some trees I grew from seed that are good candidates for grafting into something else. Hopefully this is the year I am at least mostly successful with my grafting. Thank you for that idea for the clothes pins, I have a tree in the front yard that seems to be wanting to start leaning and I need to start training it to grow the way I want it to grow.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:25 pm

I just finished blending the run of apple. The results are a bit better than I originally thought. I tossed the first pint and collected 6 more before the tails jar. I kept 3 of the 6 and am debating keeping jar one more. 50% isn't a really great keep but since the feints will be run at the end of all the first runs I stay pretty conservative on my cuts. In the end I got 1.5 qt at 75% with a whole lot of flavor. cut to 80Pr that would come to 2.8 qt from around 11-12 gallons of cider. Not very impressive yield really but you can only get out what is in there and there was only about 2725 ml pure alcohol in there and I got around 3312 ml out of it at 75+% so the math works out. I always have to do that math when I run something like this on the flute because yield always seems so much less than in the pot still but it always seems to work out. Cuts are pretty difficult on the flute too so I have been looking for the parts for my pot head. The only thing I can't find is the piece that connects the riser to the keg. Damned if I can remember what the hell I did with that so I'm debating annealing the bottom of the riser tube and making a hammered flange so I can just connect it directly to the keg but then I would have to go through the whole cleaning run process all over again and I really don't want to do that. I would run in pot mode on the flute but the way it runs in pot mode is different that a regular pot head, I get passive reflux through the heads and the tales are severely dragged out which is just the opposite of what I want to happen. I also have to run it slow because my shotgun product condenser is too small to run full out for a fast stripping run. Plus I can't help myself, if I have reflux available I am going to use it. So I guess I will keep looking for the connector and hopefully find it soon or just keep using the flute but I really need to get this apple finished so I can get this damn garage clean.
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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Sat Mar 11, 2017 9:00 pm

Today I finally got the barrel aged cider bottled. At the moment the cider tastes pretty good but maybe a bit weak to me but we will see how it ages. After bottling the cider I dug out the brandy I ran off last year. The smell of the all feints brandy was so good I had to save a bottle white. Everything else was blended together and added to the barrel. I didn't have any distilled water handy so it went in at full strength, 75% I will pick up some water tomorrow and add a bit to bring it down to 60% or so. Then I need to get around to running off the rest of this cider so I can top this barrel up. Then it will sit for a nice long time and see how things go.
Sometimes I pretend to be normal but it gets boring so I go back to being me

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Re: Lets get carried away with fruity goodness

Postby cranky » Wed Mar 15, 2017 1:31 pm

Cleaning the garage today I finally found the rest of my pot head :D Everything was still pretty clean looking but I have a couple gallons of fores saved up so I figured I'd go ahead and do a cleaning run anyway. That went well and I am now ready to start running off all this apple that I don't plan on saving as cider. I think I have about 40 gallons to go but maybe more plus about 8 gallons of pear, or was it 18 :problem: To be honest I have some mystery buckets I don't exactly remember whats in them. One or two have plum wine, 2 or 3 have pear. There might be something else but I think I pretty much concentrated on apple last year.

This year blackberries are high on my priority list but I am building a retaining wall and that will take out most of the west berries and yesterday my stupid neighbor decided he needed to fix his fence so he completely destroyed the blackberries along my side so he could get to it. :evil: My wife is really pissed off about it because she loves to look at the blackberries outside the kitchen window and now there is just a big pile of dead canes because he didn't even remove the cut one. So now it will be 2-3 years for those berries to recover as well as the evergreens on the west side. It really isn't the end of the world because they are so prevalent here but they were really good berries that I am very familiar with.
Sometimes I pretend to be normal but it gets boring so I go back to being me

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