No yeast mash

Little or nothing to do with distillation.

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OlympicMtDoo
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No yeast mash

Post by OlympicMtDoo »

Hey guys, didn't know where to post this subject so I'll try here. I have been reading, mostly off site about mashing without any yeast at all like the old timers, and there is probably plenty of info on HD on the subject but I have looked all over and not found much. I'm talking about using nothing but malted corn to do a fermint, no yeast. Can anyone point me in the right direction for more info??? thanks OMD
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by WalkingWolf »

If you do not add yeast then the wash/mash will be fermented by strains of wild yeast endemic to your area. Golden Pond (RIP) was adamant about not adding commercial yeast to a ferment.
golden pond wrote:By all means use yeast if you like headaches, heartburn, indigestion, hicups, hangovers, aftertaste, liquor smell on your breath, and a funky tasting liquor, to each his own :D
Simple Golden Pond Mash
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by Dnderhead »

just make a mash..leave top open,with cheese cloth/other over top. you mite look for "wild yeast"
this is not the best way to go.slow and low ABV.
another way is to make mash in a jar,leave out to "ketch" yeast,then use as a starter.this is best done
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by heartcut »

I've tried using specific fruits which carry specific yeasts (crabapples, mulberries, ect) but either the wild yeast was inconsistent or I wasn't doing something right. It was me, most likely. Always said I was going to try to culture some wild yeast on a plate, but it's still on the to-do list.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by Dnderhead »

""but it's still on the to-do list."
spring is coming here..good time to do it..never try this in a house..you will just wast your time.
i mite try setting out plates. different locals.wild yeast is not as "hardy" so manual sorting will
be necessary if you want just one strain.
OlympicMtDoo
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by OlympicMtDoo »

Thanks guys, I just would like to try the old school, no yeast mash to try a one on one taste test with a regular yeast batch, some of the old timers say there aint no comparison, just curious, and also always looking for something new to play with.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by Dnderhead »

"the old timers" did not have the yeast you do to day.it was "wild yeast" or bread yeast.if your going to try this make a mash of say 5% or less.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by blind drunk »

Also, I'd make a wild yeast starter to ensure you have a big enough yeast population. By making a wild yeast starter, you add a modicum of control, which I think is good. Tater had a nice little description in a thread of how it was done. I can't recall where it is. But I do remember it was in a rye thread, more or less.
Last edited by blind drunk on Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by Dnderhead »

That's what they do in the established vineyards of France etc, the skins etc are used as mulch . also the yeast become established in the brew house.each different fermenter needs its own room.or closed fermenter if doing diferant wines.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by blind drunk »

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OlympicMtDoo
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by OlympicMtDoo »

Great thread BD, I haven't finished reading it yet but good info, Thanks OMD
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OlympicMtDoo
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by OlympicMtDoo »

Thanks dnderhead also, the wild yeast must be floating around about every where? I'm at least going to try malting some corn, come spring that is, all I could do is rot it right now here in mossback country.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by rubber duck »

I've had good luck with juniper berries. Unfortunately everything I've captured from them had a significant drift in the flavor profile after 4 or 5 generations.

The good part is that they are easy.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by Fastill »

OlympicMtDoo wrote:Thanks dnderhead also, the wild yeast must be floating around about every where? I'm at least going to try malting some corn, come spring that is, all I could do is rot it right now here in mossback country.
The malted corn mashes I have done have all taken off without adding yeast, just don't boil after you add home malted corn. I have also added yeast anyway, even if they were going very strong, because I was afraid the wild yeast would quit before the mash was done and bacteria might take over.
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OlympicMtDoo
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by OlympicMtDoo »

Thanks all, and thanks faststill, come spring I'm going to have a roll at it.
Sometimes I wonder why is that Frisbee getting bigger......and then it hits me.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by Dnderhead »

"I was afraid the wild yeast would quit before the mash was done "
it can ,that is where sour mashing came in..
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by likkerfirst »

Im up north and i make roughly 60 gallons of hard cider a year. I get the cider put in my barrel from the mill (unpasturized or uv pasturized) put it in my basement add my brown and white sugar and throw the airlock on. in a day or two she is bubbleing away. It takes a while to ferment (45days) but the taste is better than any cider ive drank with champagne yeast or wine yeast. This is the way my grandad and dad did it. The yeast is on the apples. Im thinking of sucking up some of the lees from the bottom of the barrel and use it in a usjm. Oh, the cider finishes 12-15%
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OlympicMtDoo
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by OlympicMtDoo »

Damn likkerfirst, that sounds good, you got a recipe, I'd like to try that?
Sometimes I wonder why is that Frisbee getting bigger......and then it hits me.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by Dnderhead »

"the cider finishes 12-15%"
thats good but all should not expect that.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by retlaw »

likkerfirst wrote:Im up north and i make roughly 60 gallons of hard cider a year. I get the cider put in my barrel from the mill (unpasturized or uv pasturized) put it in my basement add my brown and white sugar and throw the airlock on. in a day or two she is bubbleing away. It takes a while to ferment (45days) but the taste is better than any cider ive drank with champagne yeast or wine yeast. This is the way my grandad and dad did it. The yeast is on the apples. Im thinking of sucking up some of the lees from the bottom of the barrel and use it in a usjm. Oh, the cider finishes 12-15%
please, please and pretty please share that wonderful sounding recipe likkerfirst,
i have access to a large organic apple orchard and i am making a press,
the wife loves her cider,

once i picked apples that froze which created a brown circle around the core where the seeds are and they where no good for eating, so i juiced them and heated the juice up on the stove,
with adding nothing at all to the heated juice it made a wonderful tasting hot wine/cider drink,
very surprised of the complex-ed flavour from nothing but straight apples,
you could taste the alcohol in it,
so the frost started the process of turning the sugars and wild yeast to ferment,

do you use apples that were frozen first?
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by likkerfirst »

The recipe is quite simple actually. once I bribe a few buddies to help me get the barrel down the bilco stairs I use 1lb of sugar per gallon mixed in a stainless bucket a little at a time ( i dont heat it just stir it real well). I use 50%white 25% dark brown and 25% light brown. I have added raisins in the past but didnt this year. (raisins should be preservative free!) Where I get the cider from the guy uses organic apples so they dont get sprayed with pesticides therefore they dont have to be washed before he presses them. He has a mix of apples he uses for his cider, ill ask him what they are. Oh last year and this year I ended up with 15% on my vinometer, my buddie who does this as well has had 12-15 for the past 6 or 7 years. The stuff my family made we never tested it but was the same as what im doing now taste wise. This doesnt really end up with a real dry wine flavor like the ones ive tasted with champagne yeast, still has a "cider" taste to it.
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OlympicMtDoo
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by OlympicMtDoo »

Thanks likkerfirst, I am damn sure going to try a batch of that stuff this fall :thumbup: :thumbup:
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by islandrunner »

OlympicMtDoo wrote:Hey guys, didn't know where to post this subject so I'll try here. I have been reading, mostly off site about mashing without any yeast at all like the old timers, and there is probably plenty of info on HD on the subject but I have looked all over and not found much. I'm talking about using nothing but malted corn to do a fermint, no yeast. Can anyone point me in the right direction for more info??? thanks OMD
I know sweet feed will work without yeast, I put water in it to see what the pelots would do and forgot about it and it was working.
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Re: No yeast mash

Post by retlaw »

OlympicMtDoo wrote:Thanks likkerfirst, I am damn sure going to try a batch of that stuff this fall :thumbup: :thumbup:

me to, :thumbup:
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