Birdwatchers sugar wash recipe

Post by **Tater** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:01 am

{birdwatchers}My recipe for an 80 liter wash. Ingredients as follows:

3 cups tomato paste

Juice 3 lemons

Approx. 18 kg sugar

225 grams fresh regular bakers yeast. Buy in bulk at any good health food store.

water(I use spring well water)

Procedure:

Keep careful notes from start to finish for future reference.

Carefully mix paste, juice, say 14 kg sugar with 60 liters water at 30C. Measure SG.
(you are aiming for 1.09)

Carefully add water and sugar to bring mixture to 80 liter, WITH A SG 1.09.
Temperature of finished mixture should be 30C-35C to start.

You should now have 80 liters of mixed ingredients.

Carefully sprinkle 225 grams of yeast over surface, stirring in.
Place cover loosely, to let CO2 escape, keeping flying nasties out.
There is so much CO2 coming off; there is no need to worry about oxygen coming in contact.

Place bottomless styrofoam box over fermenter. Dangle lit lightbulb through small
hole in lid. Bulb must be strong enough to keep the mixture at a steady range of
30C-35C for entire fermentation. Size of bulb depends on room temperature. Stick
your digital thermometer through side of box to track inside temperature.

{A good idea would be to set up with water a day before you begin wash to determine
the size of light bulb to maintain water/wash in the 30-35C range.}

Check SG and temperature daily

Stir daily

On day three, syphon contents evenly into four 23 liter airlocked carboys.
(This step may not be nessesary and I may at some future date simply take the wash from start
to finish in the unairlocked storage container)

Check SG and temperature daily

Shake carboys gently daily.

After a total of 7-8 days SG should be .995. If not, wait until completion.

Note: After ten years of making 95% ethanol, and fine tuning my recipe after lots of
suggestions from people on this forum, this is what works for me. I'm always fine
tuning and welcome any comments or suggestions.

If any points above are not clear or you have questions, feel free to ask.

Cheers,

G
_________
_________________
PM me if you need a perfect sugar wash for ethanol ( birdwatcher)

Post by **Husker** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:51 am

Nice recipe for a "generic" neutral wash.

This recipe (or one scaled to 1/4 this size) is what the regulars of this site should point newer members (who are playing the turbo game) towards, as a much better substitute to a turbo wash.

H.

Post by **HookLine** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:20 pm

Yes, excellent basic recipe. Except those temps seem a little high. I keep mine between 20-30C.

Birdwatcher, could you explain to us why you run your ferments temps that high?

Rudi · Post by **Rudi** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:08 pm

Agree with Husker I have done this wash at 30-35C and also 20-30C didnt make any difference.

Post by **HookLine** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:11 pm

So what is the advantage of higher temps? Just ferments out faster?

Rudi · Post by **Rudi** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:25 pm

Didnt make any difference just used more power.

Post by **HookLine** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:26 pm

Rudi wrote:Didnt make any difference just used more power.

What do mean "more power"?

Rudi · Post by **Rudi** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 7:21 pm

Sorry
It was winter and I was using one of those belt heaters to keep it above 30C.

Post by **HookLine** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:56 pm

So, it doesn't make any difference as long as the temp is between 20-35C.

I really appreciate this info, Rudi. I live in the hot tropics, where ambient temps regularly get well above 30 (right now it is 37 outside, and the humidity is well above 50%). If I only have to keep the ferment temp below 35 (instead of 30) then it is a big plus to me, and will save me a lot of ice and stuffing around.

Cheers

birdwatcher · Post by **birdwatcher** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:05 am

Re the temperature range 30-35C. This is simply the range recommended in Jone Stone's book. http://www.gin-vodka.com/making-gin.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

He was a Phd. chemistry. Spent his career with the National Research Council
in Ottawa, specializing in distillation.

That's good enough for me.

Cheers.

G

birdwatcher · Post by **birdwatcher** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:11 am

BTW, Stone recommends a starting SG of 1.06 rather than 1.09 as stated in my recipe. I increased the SG after someone on this forum suggested it.

Than I read starting at 1.06 gives better quality. I'm seriously thinking of changing back. This really speeds up the process.

Appreciate comments on this.

G

Rudi · Post by **Rudi** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:56 pm

HookLine wrote: I live in the hot tropics, where ambient temps regularly get well above 30 (right now it is 37 outside, and the humidity is well above 50%).

Gotta love northern Aus rock on Summer

Im not 100% sure but I think the temp range has alot to do with the yeast and bread yeast as per Birdwatchers recipie can deal with(likes?) higher temps ?You might want to reaserch it a bit. Ive done this recipie alot at a range of temps and never had a problem using the SG1.09. Im going to go lower on my next washes.

mtnwalker2 · Post by **mtnwalker2** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:16 pm

HookLine wrote:So, it doesn't make any difference as long as the temp is between 20-35C.

I really appreciate this info, Rudi. I live in the hot tropics, where ambient temps regularly get well above 30 (right now it is 37 outside, and the humidity is well above 50%). If I only have to keep the ferment temp below 35 (instead of 30) then it is a big plus to me, and will save me a lot of ice and stuffing around.

Cheers

A bit lower temp. will give you much better results. When visiting my parents and when the temps climbed way up there, I used an old blanket or sheet to cover my primary loosly and kept wet. Kept it cooled, just as they used to do to cool drinking water or even canteens. Less congeners due to yeast stess. Cheap and easy.

mtnwalker2 · Post by **mtnwalker2** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:29 pm

PS. Meant to mention, those yeast activities, breeding etc. are going to produce some extra heat of thier own. Especially if you have a strong starter.

Will definately need some cooling if the ambient temp. i s already at the max range.

Post by **HookLine** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:34 pm

Thanks Birdwatcher and Rudi.

I have been running 1.06 (10%), using bakers yeast, and staggering the sugar (start with 2/3, then add the remaining 1/3 a day or two later), and am very happy with the results.

With all this hot weather here it is the right time to try a run in the 30-35C range.

Let you know how it works out.

Gotta love northern Aus rock on Summer

Yairs, wonderful stuff, if ya got aircon, which I have.

mtnwalker2:
Thanks for that. I was certainly under the impression that lower temps means less stress on the yeast and so less congeners and off tastes.

I have tried the wet blanket method (with a fan) and it keeps temps down to 30C, or a bit lower. If I use ice I can keep it to 25-27. So both methods do the job, but the wet blanket is easier and cheaper.

Should mention I run 40 litre ferments, not 25, (I got a 50 litre beer keg boiler, so 40 litre is just right). But it means the temp is a bit harder to keep down.

Post by **HookLine** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:41 pm

mtnwalker2 wrote:PS. Meant to mention, those yeast activities, breeding etc. are going to produce some extra heat of thier own. Especially if you have a strong starter.

Will definately need some cooling if the ambient temp. is already at the max range.

That is a major part of the problem. One partial solution is to use less yeast, which runs a less active and hence cooler ferment. But it takes a lot longer. The nicest result I have had so far used just 15 grams of yeast (in a starter) for a 40 litre tomato paste ferment, and it took 6 weeks! to ferment out. But damn it was clean. I am leaving the vodka from that one sit and age for as long as I can to get the best from it.

mtnwalker2 · Post by **mtnwalker2** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 5:08 pm

Hookline,

The faster your ferment can go, and shorter time, while the yeast are all happy, the better and cleaner results you will taste. Higher temp. stresses yeast, and produces off tasts. actually, if your yeast are healthy, and you are at higher temp. you should be fermenting much faster. Your results indicate stress. Cool your wort, and I think you will have a better and quicker result.

Just my dollar, 3 eighty opinion.

Post by **HookLine** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:06 pm

mtnwalker2

I agree that if you can keep temps down, then more yeast and a faster ferment is not a problem. I was just saying that one way of helping keep temps down is using less yeast, which will run a slower and hence cooler ferment. Seems to me that the ferment temp is the critical factor, not its speed.

I haven't actually had any bad results yet from a plain sugar wash (fingers crossed).

duds2u · Post by **duds2u** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:08 pm

Hookline,
If you are having problems with the temperature of your wash you can always use the old "Coolgardie safe" method as I do.
Put a tray (pot plant trays work well) under your carbouy, wrap a wet towel around it and turn a fan on. The evaporation will drop the temperature quite a few degrees without having to worry about ice.
You could get even smarter with a few mods and not have to worry about wetting the towel all the time.
You would need two buckets, a tap, a tray and a couple of lengths of hose.
The top bucket, fitted with a tap, would be your water supply and the bottom bucket your collector. Attach a drain to the tray and run it into the collector bucket.
Now all you do is adjust the water flow from the supply bucket to a slow drip, or whatever is needed to beat the evaporation, onto the towel. Anything left over will be caught in the tray and collected by the bottom bucket.
Cheers
Mal T.

Post by **HookLine** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:08 pm

duds2u

Thanks for that.

I have already tried the basic set-up, with a fan, and it does keep it below 30C. Didn't try the more advanced set-up you describe.

The evaporation rate isn't a big deal as the humidity is usually pretty high during the hot weather up here. I can get away with just having the bottom of the blanket sit in the water, and pouring some water on the top of the blanket a couple times a day.

I see you are on the Sunshine Coast. Lovely area, I got family there, near Noosa. Might be moving that way myself in a couple years. Pretty nice climate for living, and for fermenting too.

Post by **bronzdragon** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:42 pm

I never really have a problem with the temp of my fermenting bucket being too hot. But then, I only ferment in 5 gallon increments. I could see where a 10-20 gal (36-72L) tub could cause some serious heat while fermenting though.

~r~

frikz · Post by **frikz** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 4:29 pm

How do you clear this mash when fermentation has finished? Do you just leave it to settle?

mtnwalker2 · Post by **mtnwalker2** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:00 pm

frikz wrote:How do you clear this mash when fermentation has finished? Do you just leave it to settle?

This time of year where I live, I will set it outside in the 30's to settle the yeast overnight. Then bring it in to warmth to clear quickly. Deeper winter, I scoop off the pure ice on top and then bring in to clear. Already more concentrated. Barring cold weather, i use sparkaloid to clear and settle. No side affects that i have noticed. Works well for me.

Don't think i would use it for a UJSM or setback situation though. Don't know what it might do to succeding ferments.

birdwatcher · Post by **birdwatcher** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:12 am

Don't bother with clearing this wash.

I run it through my pot still once and then into my reflux.

Cheers,

G

the pure drop · Post by **the pure drop** » Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:20 am

I just started this one scaled down to about 1/4 the original volume. I am really looking forward to running this one. This will be my second sugar wash. My first was a simple gallon wash from a little tomato paste and one container of corn syrup. Which, after both gallons (did two), were ran the first time, and then a second............was not shaby at all. Actually, it is much cleaner and better all around then the burgendy wine I distilled. I charred hickory pieces and soaked them in the corn syrup distilate. I could not get oak were I am, so used the hickory. After only 2 days of stress aging.....it's beginning to taste very similar to Bush Mills/ Black Bush Irish Whiskey. Not bad........

And I know birdwatcher's recipe will turn out much better even. I will never again distill wine

But it was good for the first few tries of learning when and where to cut, and about watching the temps.

Thanks for this recipe.............

If it turns out well, I will post my measurements for the scaled down version of this.

The Pure Drop

allen42 · Post by **allen42** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 9:24 am

while running off my next to last turbo yeast batch ( I use duble runs of the turbo & make double batches that just about fills my beer keg reflux)

we started the simple to use turbo yeast/suga wash this moring to make up the last bacth of the turbo we had on hand , so I will have 3 /12 gallons or so of mash to run off in the coming weeks , if all works out well we should have plenty for X Mas gifts for the family & friends to enjoy

I will also report on how well Birdwatches receipe does wi my insulated shop without any heat on it . In the past all my washes puts off a good bit of heat while it is activey fermenting , Tomorrow morning when I stir it up ,I'll keep a check on the temps to see if i need to place a heater on it .

We cut out shine back to around 40-50 proof & make flavored sprits, ( peach ,Pomagrated, Apple( did not turn out as well as I though it should) planing on making some peppermint as well in the coming weeeks

thanks to all who helped me so far with my suga washes ,,,,next step is to make a conversion kit for my reflux still , making into a pot still & try my hand at making some Whiskey !! My 1st run then I wanna try the JD receipe & see how that turns out

frynturn · Post by **frynturn** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 3:55 pm

Would this yeast be ok? I'm not too sure what "fresh" yeast is.

edmonds yeast active dried
active yeast is suitable for breadmaking, baking, homebrewing, gingerbeer, yeast drinks.this yeast is a living organism which has been carefully grown and specially dried to maintain high fermenting power.

tracker0945 · Post by **tracker0945** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 3:59 pm

I am sure it will work fine and can be used in any recepie which uses bakers yeast.
It will work in others as well but may be restricted in some higher alcohol washes.

birdwatcher · Post by **birdwatcher** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:35 am

frynturn wrote:Would this yeast be ok? I'm not too sure what "fresh" yeast is.

edmonds yeast active dried
active yeast is suitable for breadmaking, baking, homebrewing, gingerbeer, yeast drinks.this yeast is a living organism which has been carefully grown and specially dried to maintain high fermenting power.

Looks fine, but why go to that expense. If your aim is to create 95% ethanol
in the quickest, least expensive manner, buy fresh refrigerated bakers yeast
in bulk at any good health food store.

Good luck and seasons greetings.

G

birdwatcher · Post by **birdwatcher** » Fri Dec 21, 2007 4:03 am

Not earth shattering. Simply adds a few dollars to cost of wash. Check the use before date on the jar.

Good luck and keep us posted when you do your wash.

Seasons greetings.

G

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