Better Cuts with better Dilution

[PoolGuy]

F-ing brilliant post Yummyrum. I found a short little brass tube out in the shed from some questionable high-school "project". Maybe 1/8" diameter. Way too small for that "project", but just right for this. Now I know why I am a junk collector. Cleaned it up and marked it off with a small triangle file. Ran through the cuts I laid out yesterday tablespoon by tablespoon. Sure the heck beats my newbi stick-a-finger-in-it approach. Now if I could just master the art of making the cuts. Gotta' keep training my senses, and this is a great new tool in the toolbox.

Invited my wife to the "cuts party" this evening. How come we disagree so much?


Never mind.

[venkman]

Well HD crew, it is with great sadness and humility that I report that I don't know a dang thing about making good liquor. I want to put this before the critical eyes of the forum, where there is a vastly superior wealth of knowledge and experience than I can muster here.

I credit Yummyrum and this thread for the fact that my first large batch AG mash ended up being a passable drink. It was a very tight and conservative cut, and although my newbie eyes wept at the thought of disgregarding so much hard-won ethanol, I stuck to my guns and made the tight cut. The result was a pleasure to drink, even white. So naturally I came back here to read and study and second guess myself when the time came to make cuts on my current run.

See this post for details on the batch.

My goal here was to make a sizeable batch for aging (4-5 gallons). I really thought I had it. I set out last night to taste and make some decisions on cuts. Using this thread as I guide, I blended a small sample of each jar down to 35% ABV to smell and taste. Here's the copper straw I used to dilute.

As I worked my way from the middle of hearts, up toward the beginning of the run, I stopped when I had the faintest sickly sweet taste of heads, with the accompanying throat sting. I put a post-it note on that jar, labeled "First taste of heads." Then I worked my way down toward tails. The grain flavors intensified with each jar on the way down, until I got the faintest whiff on the nose of wet cardboard funky stuff. I couldn't taste it, but just smell it faintly. The next jar, I could smell AND taste tails, so I put a label on it, "First taste of tails."

The first two jars were fores, 650mls in each for a total of 1300mls.


In all, I took 13 jars of 500ml that I felt were COMPLETELY safe, if maybe a little boring. I did several small sample blends with all the safe stuff, adding a little more tails to one, a little more heads to another, a little of both. I just couldn't decide. I felt like adding anything outside the 13 safe jars made it taste weird. Inexperience on display here.

I went ahead and blended the safe jars, to get an idea of what it might be like, and I had two drinks from that last night (delicious!) and walked away. When I come back to blend again, I know I can put 13 parts of that blend to 1 (or 1/2) part of each additional jar I want to evaluate. So I'm not so far gone that I can't change my mind.

I guess, the takeaway here is I'm just scared to screw it up. Fear is holding me back. I was estimating I'd end up leaving 6-8 jars of heads on the table, but my taste buds told me I had 12 - 500ml jars that shouldn't be in my product. I don't like leaving this much ethanol on the table. Did I just smear it that badly? Or am I being too conservative? I've read here over and over again that time and oak can be forgiving of wide cuts. Time and oak are the plan. Can any of you master distillers give a new guy some sage counsel? Thank you in advance!

[NormandieStill]

There is a way of "cheating" slightly. Assemble your tight cut, and keep one or two jars each side which you'll age separately (be sure to scale down the oak amount accordingly). I did this with my first apple brandy, because there was more apple flavour in the late "heads", but also some slightly nasty stuff that I wasn't sure about. After about 5 months of aging, I tried the hearts cut, "late heads cut" and a blend of the two. Turns out I could have just included them, but now I'm far more certain. There's some chemistry that you might miss out on through this segregation, but it's easier to blend in the futre than to "unblend".

Also, the jars that you don't use can go to feints (except the fores if you didn't already discard them). Either recycle them into the next batch, do an all feints run when they've built up, or reflux them for neutral.

[ShineonCrazyDiamond]

There are 2 stages to learning cuts. The first is to learn to take the cognengers out, the second one is to learn to put them back in. The master has gone through both journeys. Hearts only is for neutral. I never achieved my full potential until I learned to let go of control and allow heads and tails into my whiskey.

[venkman]

The master has gone through both journeys. Hearts only is for neutral. I never achieved my full potential until I learned to let go of control and allow heads and tails into my whiskey.

SCD, I reached for the secret too soon.

Seriously, thanks guys. I'm planning on putting this in a Gibbs barrel (on the way!) to age for at least a year. I think I just needed the guts to get a little wilder with what I'm about to put in there. I need to be less precious with this batch and take the Nike tact, and Just Do It.

[venkman]

I let go of the fear. After making up some mini blends in shot glasses and tasting them all, I put in three more jars from "possible heads" and four more from "possible tails." The flavor is great. There's a touch of sting on the finish, but not even as much as you'd find in a commercial bourbon. There's the faintest little whiff of tails on the nose but hardly any in the taste or finish. Now comes the hard part.. patience.

[shadylane]

Cuts also depend on how long you plan on aging the spirit.

[samwell]

Such a good post. Bought myself some glass straws from Amazon a bit ago and excited to try this when blending on my next run. Cheers

[Stringplucker]

This post is awesome! I have completed my first batch from my pot still.( three stripper runs, one spirit run) . I followed your guide to better cuts, and I have never in my life tasted better product. I have obtained moonshine for 45 years from many sources, but have just started producing my own. Using this site and your guide to better cuts, I have produced the best moonshine that I have ever had. I never knew it could be this smooth, without the terrible bite that I've experienced for so many years. I guess I have always been given the heads or tails of a batch. Obviously, I have never had hearts before. I made some apple pie moonshine from a recipe on this site and I can't believe how good it is. I'm so grateful for the information from the members of homedistiller.

[Yummyrum]

Glad to hear you guys are getting some good stuff as a result .
It’s not the only way to do it but a good place to start .
Like SoCD said , the hard bit is working out how to add back the parts you excluded .

[Stringplucker]

I plan to just add all that I excluded, except for the foreshots of course, to my next spirit run and see what that does for me. I wonder if I should add it to a stripper run instead of the spirit run. Does one way work better than the other?

[Yummyrum]

I add it to the next Spirit run …..but thats me .

If you are stripping wash looking for a combined total ABV , ( IE , you keep stripping until the Low wines gets to a certain point ) adding Feints in with the Wash will stuff up the readings .

[Stringplucker]

I will add it to the next spirit run this time. I'm sure I will also try adding the feints to the stripper runs in the future. Thank you, Yummyrum, for the information.