Search found 779 matches

by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:29 pm
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: New Packing
Replies: 122
Views: 11637

Re: New Packing

The reason I'm mad is that I dont have time to dispel all the myths and folk tales of HD, I came here to support one customer running my SPP that I have tested to work successfully under certain conditions but now he's being confused by an out pour of half truths and hearsay. -The 1/10th of the colu...
by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:19 pm
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: New Packing
Replies: 122
Views: 11637

Re: New Packing

Odin wrote:Yep, 2.0 is the minimum for a 2 inch column.
no odin you wrote 2kw was optimal for SPP on 2" that's very different from the word minimum. Do you mean you were wrong back then, but now you are right ? Please be clear
by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:08 pm
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: New Packing
Replies: 122
Views: 11637

Re: New Packing

Yes, manu de hanoi, I do have SPP here that was supplied by one of our members... I am not echoing anything I have read... Do you think I have no experience at all in the hobby...??? Perhaps you should ratchet it down a bit... I spend far more time here in these forums than you do and have a far be...
by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 15, 2016 11:39 am
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: New Packing
Replies: 122
Views: 11637

Re: New Packing

Bigger diameter columns need much more power to create enough reflux to create the much needed top column liquid bath. 1.9 kW is not enough. It's enough to power a 1.5 to 1.75 inch column. No more. If you run less than needed power, which makes sense, because 3 inch is too big for this size SPP, yo...
by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 15, 2016 11:27 am
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: New Packing
Replies: 122
Views: 11637

Re: New Packing

Too cold reflux is waste of energy, because every redistillation needs more energy Guys would you please stop this @#$%%^@^% ? What is so wrong, that I got such a reaction, manu? it is no more a waste of energy than increasing reflux, therefore if you suddenly have sub cooling, just increase output...
by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 15, 2016 11:10 am
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: New Packing
Replies: 122
Views: 11637

Re: New Packing

So, the OP's SPP probably was not the correct specification for his column size and boiler heat source. *If* that was the issue, I rather say the power was too much, you dont need to change the packing each time you turn the power knob, you rather adapt the power to the packing. 1.9 kw is very reas...
by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 15, 2016 9:28 am
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: New Packing
Replies: 122
Views: 11637

Re: New Packing

But does the "size" of the SPP influence the "effective cross-sectional area" of the column? If so, would such micro-SPP as this reduce both the power input capacity and the vapor production (rate) tolerance? So, in a sense, they are inter-related, right? you are correct, that's why the SPP is rate...
by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 15, 2016 9:11 am
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: New Packing
Replies: 122
Views: 11637

Re: New Packing

Super cooled (too cold) reflux will cool the SPP on top and cause a pool of liquid only at the top. . Too cold reflux is waste of energy, because every redistillation needs more energy That dreaded shock cooling effect rearing its ugly head again which causes vapor collapse in the top portion of th...
by manu de hanoi
Fri Dec 18, 2015 8:13 am
Forum: Pot Distillation/Thumper and Design
Topic: Herbs continuous steam distiller
Replies: 3
Views: 527

Re: Herbs continuous steam distiller

Looks like a nice steam rig. What makes it continuous though? perhaps the name is confusing, the steam generation is continuous but the herbs loading/unloading is batch Nice design. Wish I had welding skills. Tig welder costs 300 usd , it helps to see pple welding to learn but it can be learned alo...
by manu de hanoi
Fri Dec 18, 2015 4:16 am
Forum: Pot Distillation/Thumper and Design
Topic: Herbs continuous steam distiller
Replies: 3
Views: 527

Herbs continuous steam distiller

The continuous steam generator on the right has a toilet float valve ( stainless steel float) to control the height of water. The boiler water goes through the condenser upper section first for pre heat.
IMG_4122.JPG
by manu de hanoi
Wed Nov 25, 2015 8:38 pm
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: fractional condensation??
Replies: 28
Views: 2051

Re: fractional condensation??

Tomb wrote:Sorry for this aside.....

Is there a link to an English translation of Barbets book?

Tom
no
by manu de hanoi
Wed Nov 25, 2015 1:40 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: fractional condensation??
Replies: 28
Views: 2051

Re: fractional condensation??

I was using the term "analyzer" to refer to a Gas Chromatograph or Spectrograph analyzing the composition of the process stream. Don't know what else to say after watching these effects in real time. Good luck. Barbet was talking about ethanol and heads. These real time effects (I understand instan...
by manu de hanoi
Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:15 pm
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: fractional condensation??
Replies: 28
Views: 2051

Re: fractional condensation??

The Krell text is very disturbing. Here's a quote from Barbet : Chapter " Le condenseur n'est pas un analyseur " start at PDF page 326 (book page 308) explains the whole thing and ends with this : theoreme.png it says if you see changes in composition at the condenser it's because it refluxed things...
by manu de hanoi
Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:47 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: fractional condensation??
Replies: 28
Views: 2051

Re: fractional condensation??

Quoting from: Handbook of Laboratory Distillation By E. Krell 1982 5.2.3 Separation by partial condensation The term partial condensation is used to denote the liquefaction of a fraction from a flow of vapour. It can be brought about deliberately by interposing a special condenser- a so-called deph...
by manu de hanoi
Sun Nov 22, 2015 3:31 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?
Replies: 19
Views: 1765

Re: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?

costs vs benefits. I was looking to make 100%, I ended so far off I had to drop the project, make sure you know why you want the vacuum.
by manu de hanoi
Sun Nov 22, 2015 12:14 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?
Replies: 19
Views: 1765

Re: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?

Oh, of course. Pv=nrt. I had never thought of that in relation to vapor speed before. Is that why packing doesn't work, you think? Vapor speed too fast? That's my belief, vapor is either too fast (unless the diam is x 3) or not dense enough to heat the reflux running down on the packing or both. I'...
by manu de hanoi
Sun Nov 22, 2015 12:09 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: fractional condensation??
Replies: 28
Views: 2051

Re: fractional condensation??

That's what a dephlegmator does, the balance and composition of phlegm and vapor depends on the coolant flow. no, a deflegmator is just a condenser and it condenses everything blindly (apart from air and such), the amount it condenses depends on the coolant but the composition of the condensate doe...
by manu de hanoi
Sat Nov 21, 2015 11:22 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: fractional condensation??
Replies: 28
Views: 2051

Re: fractional condensation??

heartcut wrote:Fractional condensation works just fine..
Coffey still doesnt use fractional condensation ̣(because it doesnt exist), are we talking about the same thing ?
By fractional condensation I mean the ability to condense various gases (boiled off a liquid mix) selectively based on the temp selection.
by manu de hanoi
Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:48 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?
Replies: 19
Views: 1765

Re: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?

To get a global idea, same power will give 10x the volume of gases at 0.1 atm. How does that work, Manu? The latent heat of vaporization doesn't change, right? yes the heat of vapo doesnt change. You just get more gas volume because the volume is much less dense. Same number of atoms, they are just...
by manu de hanoi
Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:45 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Removing ethyl acetate by room temp fractionation
Replies: 139
Views: 14693

Re: Removing ethyl acetate by room temp fractionation

oh my god , you remove ethyl acetate by adding an alcaline to the stripped alcohol.
It breaks the ester into ethanol and acetate

it's hard to find food safe soda
so baking soda can be used (also avail as antacid)
by manu de hanoi
Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:25 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: fractional condensation??
Replies: 28
Views: 2051

Re: fractional condensation??

im right because we all had the same idea as you and some spent a fortune building huge stills that didnt work. I was lucky enough to read early a great account of such failure and why this doesnt work in Barbet "manuel de distillation" from 1880's.

Named my son Emile after the chemist.
by manu de hanoi
Fri Nov 20, 2015 12:35 pm
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?
Replies: 19
Views: 1765

Re: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?

Manu, so if you wanted to exceed azeotrope (for biofuel or other anhydrous EtOH uses)... what would you use in your column? Just an empty column to naturally fractionate?. - I would *try* trays if I had to, but from what I read it's tough too because trays have to be supersized. To get a global ide...
by manu de hanoi
Thu Nov 19, 2015 7:58 pm
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?
Replies: 19
Views: 1765

Re: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?

tl;dr my vacuum stills work on that principle already, except that I do use vac pumps once in a while but not continuously . About gases, there are some non condensables dissolved in the liquid initially and I believe there are more created along the distillation *of herbals*. Now that I have improv...
by manu de hanoi
Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:09 pm
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?
Replies: 19
Views: 1765

Re: Do you really need a vaccum pump to vacuum distill?

tl;dr it will work, except that you may have to bleed the still a few times to expel non condensables gases to the atmosphere (othrwise pressure will creep up). And for that you 'll need to reach atm pressure & temp
by manu de hanoi
Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:02 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: CCVM Inclined still
Replies: 21
Views: 2119

Re: CCVM Inclined still

The CC condenser is supposed to work with a coil so that the condensate runs more or less perpendicular with the length of the condenser. I m afraid a cold finger wont be that good. I like the super cheapness and simplicity of your design. You'll need a power controller to keep the surge under contr...
by manu de hanoi
Fri Nov 13, 2015 8:42 am
Forum: Continuous Stripping stills
Topic: Still design (continous stripping)
Replies: 7
Views: 1166

Re: Still design (continous stripping)

Concept: a continous stripping still which resembles a spiral staircase inside an outer tube. Mash would be pumped up the center of it to help preheat and then trickle down the staircase (about thirty steps or so). The heat would be applied by steam in a slot cut under the stairs so would never be ...
by manu de hanoi
Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:22 am
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: fractional condensation??
Replies: 28
Views: 2051

Re: fractional condensation??

john2674 it doesnt work, you cant separate by condensation. Separation only occurs on evaporation, on condensation, everything condenses at once regardless of temperature.
by manu de hanoi
Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:29 pm
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Revolving column
Replies: 12
Views: 1108

Re: Revolving column

NZChris wrote:It could be an Archimedes screw continuous still with the spent wash exiting at the raised end.
I believe so, there is a drawing about these in Barbet's manual. They are used for distilling continuously thick washes (wouldnt work on a plated column)
by manu de hanoi
Fri Oct 17, 2014 4:52 am
Forum: The Construction Site
Topic: Grain Roller build
Replies: 6
Views: 911

Re: Grain Roller build

do you know what was the grade of stainless steel used please ?
by manu de hanoi
Thu Sep 25, 2014 10:58 pm
Forum: Research and Theory
Topic: Mini Gas Chromatograph
Replies: 11
Views: 1359

Re: Mini Gas Chromatograph

good old spectrometer wouldnt do the trick ?