HDPE

[rgreen2002]

I was wondering what people thought about food grade HDPE. I'm looking to make a gasket for my pot and so far my everlasting ptfe gasket gets wet and occasionally leaks. It's a 13 in diam gasket and I used 2 rolls of 1" ptfe tape to make them. I was looking at a sheet of ptfe big enough to cut a solid gasket from when I noticed the site had "FDA approved to be used in the food processing industry." hdpe. The HDPE was considerably cheaper and I was curious to know what the thoughts here were regarding HPDE for a gasket in my distillation product flow... before I throw a few more rolls of tape at my gaskets.

[bearriver]

There seems to be a movement of people taking unacceptable materials and wrapping it in ptfe for a gasket. Folks can do whatever they like, but that isn't going to make an unsafe gasket safe...

No synthetics in a still means "no synthetics in a still". You can and should do better!!!

[der wo]

The only safe considered plastic is PTFE. Perhaps if someone invents a new plastic, we can talk about again, and perhaps this rule will change. But HDPE is not new, you can find many chemical resistant charts here, which say, it's not safe. And btw HDPE is not very flexible, it would seal worse than wrapped cardboard.

[Wooday]

...so far my everlasting ptfe gasket gets wet and occasionally leaks.

So you want to switch it for something that will leach/dissolve when the PTFE tape fails again?

[Goofylunatic]

Supply and demand could be the simple driving force at work here. The more an industry shifts material standards, the more available the material will become as new suppliers enter the market. Competition takes over and you get reduced pricing.

On the other hand, sometimes cheap material is just Chinese crap. Look at the stainless steel market. Chinese stainless if WAY cheaper than state side... But if you dig it turns out theirs is far inferior and often poorly recycled material.

Only the way to know, buy some and check it out for yourself.

[rgreen2002]

Thanks for the thoughts everyone. I had an idea where this would go but good advice goes a long way... (my organic chemistry ain't what it used to be). I'm satisfied and before this becomes the spark for a flame war (this topic always seems to get someone's goat)... question answered. Thanks again for great direction.

[bearriver]

question answered. Thanks again for great direction.

Thank you for the positive attitude!

[bluefish_dist]

Realize that ptfe is porous. It has holes in it on a microscopic level, so wrapping things with tape probably does not provide a barrier. Goretex is simply stretched, thin ptfe. Ptfe is also much more heat resistant than uhmw. Ptfe is safe to over 500 deg f. Uhmw will be a liquid at that temperature.

[S-Cackalacky]

rgreen2002, with the ptfe/cardboard gasket, maybe its the materials you're using. What kind of cardboard are you using? I've had good luck with picture framing mat board. You can find it at any place that does picture framing - Michaels, Hobby Lobby, etc With the ptfe tape, the more wraps you do, the better. For my 12 inch stock pot, I start with 3 rolls of 3/4 inch ptfe tape. If it starts showing wear, I put another layer or two on it. It gets better with more layers. I also make the gaskets a little bigger than they need to be because they will expand and contract with heat. I store them between two plywood panels with spring clamps holding them together. This keeps them nice and flat and much easier to position on the rim of the pot. If you're using a regular stock pot lid, it's easier to get a good fit if you turn the lid upside down. That way, the inside diameter of the gasket doesn't need to be so precise. Are you using binder clips to clamp the lid down? I use 10 of them evenly spaced around the circumference of the lid. My boiler and my thumper are both stock pots and I've never had a problem with them leaking. Been doing it the same way for near 3 years.

Hope this helps and good luck to you.

[Truckinbutch]

Probably beating a dead horse here , but why are all you guys so afraid of getting your fingers dirty and being a little messy ? I set the cap on my keg boiler with a half cup of flour and some water made into paste and a few pennies worth of jute string . Cotton t-shirt strips would work as well . This is on a keg boiler . The cap stays in place for 6 to 7 runs over 2 to 3 weeks . I got to use a chisel to unstick the cap at the end of that time to have an open top boiler to recharge my fermentors . Total cost of the seal is way less than $1 .

[rgreen2002]

I love this place... thanks for all the advice folks.

SC - I just used a standard box for my cardboard. I put the gasket back around the lid rim and then put it on the pot for "safe keeping". Your plywood storage sounds like a great idea as well...flatten that thing right back out. I was at first considering a few more wraps with the tape but the mat board sounds like a "do over" might be better. Here is a quick look at the rig... a few small changes since this photo... I added a 45' column instead of 24 and I have it on a shelving unit to help support h the column. I use clamps as well (12 I think) ...they're unsightly and make the pot cumbersome but they get the job done.

Truckinbutch - I think its fate that you stopped by here. Yesterday I was skimming the forums and was just looking for a "better mousetrap" solution to the issue. Over and over again I kept seeing your flour paste sermon...then I saw your idea for dipping string or rope in the flour paste. Lightbulb over head moment ... walked into the basement... 50 feet of cotton clothesline rope. I'm going to give this a shot as well... might make clean up a little annoying but less annoying than losing product for sure!

Thank you both for the suggestions...somewhere in there is the answer I'm sure.

[Truckinbutch]

Rgreen , keep in mind my situation and solution . I had a damaged keg and cut the top off and used a domed cap on top of it . I joined the two with flat ss flanges 1 1/8" wide fastened with vice grip pliers . The problem I encountered was paste squeezing out between two flat surfaces . I countered that by smearing a thin , sticky layer of flour paste on the boiler flange and then closely spiraling 1/8" jute twine on that paste .
Then I smeared a thicker paste on top of that and then set the cap on it and clamp it down . In effect , a safe fiber gasket that will still seal with uneven mating surfaces and withstand mild back pressure when I fully deploy my thumper . I also built my rig with fill pipes and bottom drains . Once assembled I have no need to break down until all of my runs are completed .
>I'll be glad to answer further questions here if I haven't been clear enough .

[aircarbonarc]

I bought some food grade Hi temp silicone rubber gasket material and cut my own gasket. It's been close to 4 years, countless runs and its still as pretty as the day I cut it. Well maybe it gets some gunge on it from the copper oxides and occasional molasses stain which washes off with a bit of soap and hot water.

[cob]

rule #8 has not been recinded

[thecroweater]

I bought some food grade Hi temp silicone rubber gasket material and cut my own gasket. It's been close to 4 years, countless runs and its still as pretty as the day I cut it. Well maybe it gets some gunge on it from the copper oxides and occasional molasses stain which washes off with a bit of soap and hot water.

Cob is right . Thing is silicon like plastics covers a vast sum of different products and where as some silicones are formulated to withstand given solvents others are not. Some are formulated specifically for the commercial distilling industry and tested for such so there are a couple out of hundreds maybe thousands of formulas/compounds that maybe suitable, is your baking sheet one of them ? Who knows, I bet you don't conclusively. I am not taking a shot at you at all bud, we all make our own decisions but we don't make the community rules that are in place for the safety of all as these compounds are all very varied and have a shit ton of chemicals. One thing against my better judgment I feel I should say is on a personal level I would be much more comfortable using your heat proof silicon baking sheet wrapped in ptfe tape than some random cardboard crap as the sheet is impervious and could only leach from the surface where as the cardboard would give it all up and pulp mills use a shit ton of chemicals also but this is just my private personal opinion

[aircarbonarc]

Well seems the same silicone rubber material I'm using is also being used in one craft distillery I know about. If it was reactive then it would be losing shape and the physical properties would have changed. It doesn't stain, it cleans easy, its also listed as safe to use on the parent site. So have fun with your flour paste I'll stick to this magical compound.

[Truckinbutch]

Well seems the same silicone rubber material I'm using is also being used in one craft distillery I know about. If it was reactive then it would be losing shape and the physical properties would have changed. It doesn't stain, it cleans easy, its also listed as safe to use on the parent site. So have fun with your flour paste I'll stick to this magical compound.

You seem to be more interested in arguing the point than understanding the message . We don't give a fuck about what you use . The owner of this site set the rules for what is acceptable here . Do what you will . Just don't bring it here in violation of the forum rules and all is good .

[corene1]

When I make my gaskets I cut the ring out of thin copper sheet then anneal it so it is soft them wrap it with PTFE tape. Works well and is long lasting. Every so often I give it a couple more layers to freshen it up.

[rgreen2002]

LOL... I was worried this could spin off into a rule 8 discussion. Oh well.

Still want to thank everyone for the great discussion. corene1 I had thought about making a copper gasket for some of my other connections but I thought i would be too rigid. Its great to see than annealing would solve that problem. This gasket is 13 inches in diameter and I don't have a sheet of copper to cut that one from.

Truckinbutch - thanks again for the good info. Even though your setup is different I still think your solution is viable. I will use the cotton rope dipped in flour paste and just boil some H2O to see how it goes (if I get leaks). The rope is highly compressible and I think it will work great. In essence I will get a fiber gasket as well covered in paste to fill in the "dead spots". I had originlly thought of taking strips of PTFE tape, rolling them up and using them but the rope is already "rolled". I had even thought of some fettuccine noodles as mentioned somewhere here on the forums or the biscuits in a similar fashion.

One cat....many skinnings!
As always...thanks folks!

[corene1]

You can always use a piece of copper wire and braze it together , then anneal it and pound it out flat. That is the way the narrow one in the picture is done.

[Truckinbutch]

I use the smaller diameter string in a continuious spiral to counter a potential blow out point where 2 ends meet .

[Hound Dog]

I had thought about making a copper gasket for some of my other connections but I thought i would be too rigid. Its great to see than annealing would solve that problem. This gasket is 13 inches in diameter and I don't have a sheet of copper to cut that one from.

Use a piece of copper wire and hammer it flat.

[rgreen2002]

When I make my gaskets I cut the ring out of thin copper sheet then anneal it so it is soft them wrap it with PTFE tape. Works well and is long lasting. Every so often I give it a couple more layers to freshen it up.

P1090006.JPG

I had thought about making a copper gasket for some of my other connections but I thought i would be too rigid. Its great to see than annealing would solve that problem. This gasket is 13 inches in diameter and I don't have a sheet of copper to cut that one from.

Use a piece of copper wire and hammer it flat.

Both great ideas. I may go this route if the cotton gasket doesn't "hold water"... ok...corny..
You know what would really solve this problem....a keg with a 2 inch takeoff and some triclover clamps.... addictions....they sure are persistent.

Thanks everyone!

[pfshine]

I got to use a chisel to unstick the cap at the end of that time to have an open top boiler to recharge my fermentors.

This is why I used flour paste once and only once. Reusable gasket is the only way to go I'm my train of thought.

[rgreen2002]

Well... I was planning on a flour paste coated piece of cotton rope but i got to thinking about what pfshine had said. The whole reason I made a gasket in the first place was to make it a little easier (less messy and reusable). So I had the rope already and I was about to rewrap my gasket when I thought I would combine the two. The cotton rope is very compressable and I thought if I could wrap it onto the already made gasket...it just might work.

Wrapping the gasket and rope together. If i were to do it again I would spot tack the gasket in a few spots first (to get the length correct and make it easier to work with) then wrap.

I wrapped it with two layers PTFE and I suspect I will wrap it again.

I sat nicely on my pot.

...and it clamped down well.

Clamps in place with good seal.

I boiled a gallon of water for about 10 minutes with no leak. I plan on doing a run soon so I will report the performance then.

[Truckinbutch]

I like that idea . Keep us posted on how it performs .

[MichiganCornhusker]

Over and over again I kept seeing your flour paste sermon...

I seen it once and abide by it, easy peasy, hallelujha!

[DFitz]

Paste works well for the most part. I bought some of this packing for mating flat surfaces. Works very well.
http://www.ptfegraphite.com/Pure-PTFE-T ... cking.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Hound Dog]

Paste works well for the most part. I bought some of this packing for mating flat surfaces. Works very well.
http://www.ptfegraphite.com/Pure-PTFE-T ... cking.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Looks like Dfitz found the shit! If that is affordable it is a slick looking solution.

[rgreen2002]

Paste works well for the most part. I bought some of this packing for mating flat surfaces. Works very well.
http://www.ptfegraphite.com/Pure-PTFE-T ... cking.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

DFitz...I saw this before (I think a post here mentioned it.) but I never bothered with a quote. What is the damage for it?