Butter Rum

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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Pfretzschner » Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:53 pm

I've made 1/2 dozen runs since I was last here. I've used several combinations of sugar, molasses, put pretty much use the same recipe at the beginning of this post and I'm getting butter everytime. I made a large batch of mash last week that was pretty basic. I used a different brand of back strap molasses from Bulk Nation, with dark brown cane sugar and this time I put about 1/2 pound of all spice leaves along with a couple whole vanilla beans and about 1/4 pound of cinnamon sticks in a cheese cloth wrap and left it in the mash for the week. I preheated 1/2 the batch yesterday to butter it up and ran it this morning. It came out very buttery and you could taste a hint of mainly the all spice and cinnamon. Turned out to be a pretty good rum with a good nose and smooth taste. Now the other 1/2 of the mash, I put right in the pot and ran it this afternoon. It had no butter smell at all, but had the taste and a little of the mouth feel , and was also smooth. You could taste the spices, but like the first batch, there just needed to be more. But I can tell you for sure that my two runs, from the same batch, one preheated and one not,, definitely came out different,, the first having that strong buttery smell and a thicker mouth feel. And,, ShineOn,,, putting that 5 gal thumper in front of my 1 gal one, gives me one heck of a better clean product. I've been putting a quart of mash along with a quart of heads from a previous run in the big thumper, and a quart of tails in the small one. Takes about 10 extra minutes or so, to get the second up to temp and running,, but the results , are amazing. I've also been doing a 24 to 48 hour airing out,, and I have ended up with some really nice spicy buttered rum and some reg. spicy rum. Cold weather is moving in so playing with the rum again won't be until spring. Loquats are in bloom so brandy season starts soon. :D
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby MtRainier » Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:23 pm

Thanks for this method, shineon. I am drinking the product tonight. It's not like commercial rum that I've tried, but is so good. Thanks.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Beerswimmer » Wed Nov 28, 2018 5:33 pm

I'm doing a strip tomorrow of some butter rum, on accident. I racked my wash of the last strip before a spirit run into the boiler, attached my pot head, and grabbed the hose and....it was stuck....under my wife's tire :roll: No cooling water today, smashed the brass fitting flat. So I decided to heat it up to 130-ish and held for 20 mins and now it's cooling down. I'm hoping to detect a difference from the last 4 strips!
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Shine0n » Fri Nov 30, 2018 6:02 pm

I hope it works out for you, did you by chance get any of the yeast trub in the boiler?
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Beerswimmer » Sat Dec 01, 2018 6:49 pm

I got the yeast in there, but not too much. The Herdlife leaves gooey shit balls in the bottom of the fermentor and I don't want those in the boiler. Next time I'll try to hold it longer, I stripped it tonight and didn't really notice any difference :(
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Pfretzschner » Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:40 am

ShineOn and dd,,,,, I've made several runs of Loquat and Carambola Buttered Rum and so far it has been working rather well. I've used 5 gal of either fruit that I have frozen first because it turns to mush when you thaw it and seems perfect for the mash. 8Lbs of dark brown cane sugar, 1/2 gal of fancy molasses and 3 pkg of EC1118 and 1/3 cup of bakers yeast. It took about 11 days for the Brix to drop to 5, so I strained the mash and put it into the pot and preheated it up to 135 degrees for a couple hours, then let it cool over night and ran it the next day. I charged my large thumper with 1 qt of heads and 3 qts of mash, and my small one with 1 qt of tails. The butter was very evident during the distilling and came out in the finished product. The combination of everything puts a nice mild fruity, nose, mouth, and taste to the Rum. I proofed it out to 95% and it's really pretty good. The next run, the mash will have additional spices,,,,, vanilla, cinnamon, allspice, and mace. I'm hoping that the combination gives me a unique fruity, spicy, rum, fit for sipping. :)
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Saltbush Bill » Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:12 am

The fermented liquid used to make rum is called a wash , NOT a mash. A mash is made from grains.
It becomes confusing for long term distillers and newbies alike if we all start using the wrong terminology for the wrong things.
You cant proof something to 95%......but you can proof it to 95 proof......95 proof is 45%ABV......95% is 190 proof.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Pfretzschner » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:09 pm

Saltbush Bill wrote:The fermented liquid used to make rum is called a wash , NOT a mash. A mash is made from grains.
It becomes confusing for long term distillers and newbies alike if we all start using the wrong terminology for the wrong things.
You cant proof something to 95%......but you can proof it to 95 proof......95 proof is 45%ABV......95% is 190 proof.


I was always under the impression that a mash had solids and when it had fermented and was strained, it became a wash. I start my run with mashing in 5 gal of Loquats. Shouldn't become very confusing to anyone.
Sorry, I meant 95 proof, not %,,,, and I really imagine that anyone that read this would realize that.
Thanks for clearing things up though.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Saltbush Bill » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:22 pm

My point is that I see newbies calling alsorts of things by wierd names.....if we all use different terminolgies for things it ends up a shit fight and makes it difficult for the more experienced to help when answering questions.
Easier to just use the right words to begin with.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby rubelstrudel » Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:41 am

A major part of learning a craft, is learning the proper vocabulary so that, when you do nont know something, you can talk about it in an unambigous way. So... a vocabulary, a dictionary of proper words for this craft would be really handy. I know I have stumbeled, and still keep searching for words, and using the wrong words when I describe things all the time.


On the other hand I tried Shineons method for buttery rum today, and that was an eye opener. Letting the wash sit over night after a heating before running my spirit run made a huge diffrence. I have just completed a 140l barrel brute was with only feed grade molasses, and the two first spirit runs I did fast and hard, but the third I let sit over night as Shineon suggests, and that made a huge difference.

I'm going to do the spirit run with a really good chunk of backset, heated and left to itself for a night. This is really starting to smell like rum.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby ShineonCrazyDiamond » Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:23 am

rubelstrudel wrote:A major part of learning a craft, is learning the proper vocabulary so that, when you do nont know something, you can talk about it in an unambigous way. So... a vocabulary, a dictionary of proper words for this craft would be really handy. I know I have stumbeled, and still keep searching for words, and using the wrong words when I describe things all the time.


You mean like this, found in the mandatory reading new distillers lounge?
"Come on you stranger, you legend, you martyr, and shine!
You reached for the secret too soon, you cried for the moon.
Shine on you crazy diamond."
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby The Baker » Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:35 pm

I think you could probably call any kind of a ferment a "ferment"

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Re: Butter Rum

Postby rubelstrudel » Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:18 pm

ShineonCrazyDiamond wrote:You mean like this, found in the mandatory reading new distillers lounge?


Exactly like that Shineon. Exactly like that.
But looking at the length of that list, and all the implied understanding that lies under all these terms, it is a solid job that needs to be done to get all those concepts into ones brain. I am working on a similar list in norwegian. We all have different words, but the concepts are the same.

BTW: My latest rum batch really started coming out now, and I think your idea of heating the wash and leaving it to get the esterification going is mostly the reason for that. My previous four rum batches weren't all that much to write home about, but this time I believe I have nailed it. Good molly, good procedure and it smells really wonderful. Thanks. I am now drinking white rum straight off the still, and it really is pretty decent if I should say so myself. WAY beyond my previous experiences. If you'd asked me after my first one or two batches if that would be even possible I would have refused to believe it would be.

EDIT: I am completely wasted on rum right now. Just wanted to say three cheers for Shineon. (You're my bestest friend in the whole world and so on.) I have made, with the advice of Shineon, something that is really good right now, and by the grace of all gods, will be really really good in a year or so on oak. If I manage to keep my hands off it.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Cabron99 » Mon Apr 22, 2019 9:38 am

ShineOn... Thanks so much for this idea. Did a stripping run on about 10 gal of some half arsed rum recipe I found. The results were meh. Read your take on rum and decided to try it, adding some dunder back into it before the spirit run. This seriously got my attention. The results were nothing short of sterling! Thank you so much.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Mendel » Thu May 16, 2019 5:57 am

Coming from a beer brewing background, diacetyl taste is something we try hard to avoid. It certainly might go better with rum than beer, but too much is disgusting and I would worry I'd get too much.

Has anyone tried to 'cheat' and just add diacetyl? You can usually find cheap butter flavoring in grocery stores that is all diacetyl. It should have the same taste added directly to your finished product as if it occurs naturally before distillation. I am not advocating flavoring their rum, just wondering if someone who had a positive experience with the butter flavors could post if this is exactly the same or how it is different.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Shine0n » Wed May 29, 2019 9:33 am

Diacetyl is highly toxic so the butter flavorings i would believe to have other components to achieve the flavors.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby TheJollyBrewer » Sun Jun 02, 2019 12:34 pm

I tried this method with my first ever rum run and it really seemed to work. Only difference is that my wash was not fresh, it had been sitting waiting for me to run it for weeks. Also it was completely clear, no yeast in it at all. I did overpitch with bread yeast so I fulfilled one of the criteria but it definitely worked. I’ve another batch which has fermented out which I used some backset/dunder to and used a still spirits rum yeast and it smelled sooooo much better fermenting than my first batch so I’ll try the butter treatment with this one too and see how it turns out.

So my main question here is has anyone every used this method in other spirits? I’m thinking a corn or malt whiskey might work quite well with the butter treatment?
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Shine0n » Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:43 pm

If you decide to give the corn or anything else please post here as well of the outcome.

I've been mia for a while because of personal conflicts with the father inlaw. Long story but I'll toss it about in another thread "off topic"

The last one I ran with this protocol turned out as well as the first. I hope the folk who try this ends up with a nice rum.

I've downsized to just a normal pot still (15.5 gal)and no thumper so now I'll have to strip all my runs, I will save 20% wash for the spirit run too.

Time to dust off the cobwebs and grind on.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Mendel » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:44 am

Shine0n wrote:Diacetyl is highly toxic so the butter flavorings i would believe to have other components to achieve the flavors.


There are some concerns to inhaling it, especially on an industrial scale, but I can't find anything on harm from ingestion.

This is one of those chemicals where 1 part per million is a lot, so especially on a home production scale, no one is consuming more than a gram a year at most. So I don't know if a kilogram all at once could kill you.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Expat » Thu Jun 13, 2019 6:21 am

Mendel wrote:
Shine0n wrote:Diacetyl is highly toxic so the butter flavorings i would believe to have other components to achieve the flavors.


There are some concerns to inhaling it, especially on an industrial scale, but I can't find anything on harm from ingestion.

This is one of those chemicals where 1 part per million is a lot, so especially on a home production scale, no one is consuming more than a gram a year at most. So I don't know if a kilogram all at once could kill you.


Oral LD50 is something like 990 mg/kg (animal tested), which means you'd die of alcohol poisoning or hyponatremia long before diacetyl caused you harm.
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Re: Butter Rum

Postby Shine0n » Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:55 am

Well thats great news because mine is super buttery
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