Green Walnut Liquor

[OtisT]

Green Walnut Liquor - Learn as I go

I’ve been wanting to make a green walnut liquor for a few years now and finally remembered I wanted to do this at the same that there happened to be green walnuts on the tree, so here I go.......

A few old threads that inspired me were these:

my mother’s walnut liquor recipe
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=6119

Walnut Brandy / Dio Palinka
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=31092

I decided to somewhat follow the “my mothers” recipe, as that one does not involve cutting or cooking the walnuts. The spices I will use later are similar between the various recipes. I’m a bit late picking the walnuts according to some traditions, which involve picking the green walnuts in the early morning on a specific date in late June. It’s July 15th today and the walnuts are still plenty green. If this batch turns out halfway descent I’ll try and remember to pick these a little sooner next year.

Walnut Tree

Above is the walnut tree. For 23 years I’ve seen this tree drops thousands and thousands of walnuts and I’ve never seen anyone use them. My neighbors have just shoveled what falls into compost. The squirrels sure do love them. I had a few of the furry beasts chattering at me while I was up on a ladder picking about 50 green nuts from their personal stash.

Green Walnuts

About 50 green walnuts. I pulled off the stems and gave them a gentle rinse.

Macerating in 3 different base spirits

I am using about 18-20 green walnuts per quart jar, then I am topping them off with a high proof spirit. The recipe calls for neutral.

Center Jar. My best neutral, proofed down to 80%.

Left Jar. Late heads from a recent single pass panela rum. 72%. I’m on a new mission to include more heads in some spirits, so this is my start. The base spirit is not half bad as is, even though it was just outside of my white rum cut. Smells wonderful while the taste has a small bit of a heads kick to it.

Right Jar. My “Rum re-do” spirit is a batch of rum made from mixing together a lot of my past wood aged rums experiments and running those through the pot still one more time. Super clean from a heads/tails standpoint. An interesting smell/taste that is not bad but defies description.

That is the start of this green walnut journey. I’ll be letting these macerate for a while before I add spices. Recipe calls for macerating 40 days in the sun. They will be getting some morning sun on the sill I have them on.

Otis

[HDNB]

maybe MCH will offer some advice. i got my hands on a small sample of his walnut liquor and it is the best liquor i've enjoyed.

[Oldvine Zin]

Trying to get my sisters recipe for you, waiting for a response

OVZ

[NZChris]

My six year old Nocino includes cinnamon, cloves, vanilla bean and lemon zest. Even though it is improving with age, I suspect I'm probably going to be served it in the rest home as my family and friends think it tastes too much like medicine and don't like it enough to drink it themselves. Tasting it again today, after having made other alcoholic drinks high in chlorophyll, I suspect the flavor we are not liking is from an overload of chlorophyll.

[seamusm53]

Somehow lost my post from last night. I made nocino 3 years ago buying green walnuts from a grower in California. I tried to keep close to the usual timeline of harvesting on the feast of St John the Baptist' 6/24 (summer solstice) and steeping the mixture for about 3 months. I used a mixture of everclear and vodka - I make whiskey not neutral spirits. The concoction included a number of spices - Star of Anise, cinnamon, cloves, vanilla per recipes here and elsewhere online. It was very bitter at first. I added a ton of sugar to calm the bitterness and stored it in a carboy. This spring I shared it with friends. Time has mellowed the liquor greatly but it is a very acquired taste best served chilled and sipped either neat or on ice. I'd read it was great on ice cream but none of us thought that to be true.

[OtisT]

After re-reading the old threads I realized all but one green walnut recipe calls for quartering the green walnuts, so I decided to go ahead and slice them up this morning. Most of the walnuts had a thin hard shell forming inside them already, but not so well formed that I had any trouble slicing these up.

The smaller nuts I picked had a shell so thin I didn’t even notice it when cutting. I guess I could have been more selective, picking only the small nuts. I’ll have to remember that if I get to the tree late again next year.

Quartered green walnuts

These things leave quite the stain. Green fingers. Be careful where you cut and what you are wearing. If you are a hand model, don’t even consider doing this.

Back on the sill they go.

Back on the sill

Otis

[OtisT]

My six year old Nocino includes cinnamon, cloves, vanilla bean and lemon zest. Even though it is improving with age, I suspect I'm probably going to be served it in the rest home as my family and friends think it tastes too much like medicine and don't like it enough to drink it themselves. Tasting it again today, after having made other alcoholic drinks high in chlorophyll, I suspect the flavor we are not liking is from an overload of chlorophyll.

Interesting notes on the chlorophyll. There does seem to be a lot of green coming out of these. Sounds like you think that bad medicinal taste could then be coming from just the outer skin only? I wonder if a thin peeling could address that without taking too much away from the good qualities of the final product? If mine ends up have too much of a bad medicinal taste quality to it, it may be worth a test next year involving thinly peeled walnuts. (Just taking the green skin, leaving the pith.)

Otis

[MichiganCornhusker]

Happy to see you brewing this up, Otis, I think you’ll like it.

I’ve always liked the smell of black walnut husks, always reminds me of hucking them around as kids.
I can understand the “medicinal”character, but for me it wasn’t an acquired taste, I liked the liquour right away.

I went with the Dio Palinka recipe pretty much as presented. I remember adding a little bit of lime and lemon zest as well.
The flavors from the spices are powerful but they do blend, especially over time, letting the stuff clear out and decanting the liquour off from the settlin’s.

This year everything in the Midwest that grows was growing behind schedule. I got me walnuts about a week later than usual and had to freeze them because I didn’t have any neutral ready.

I now have about 4 quarts of potstiller’s “neutral” ready to go and will be doing this later this week.

I’m going to experiment with tweaking the spices and sugar a bit, not really to improve it, just to explore.

Good luck with yours, keep us posted.

[Kareltje]

A colleague suggested to boil the wallnuts shortly to remove the bad taste.
We suggested to warn each other in time next year, to make a pool of different procedures to compare.

[OtisT]

A colleague suggested to boil the wallnuts shortly to remove the bad taste.
We suggested to warn each other in time next year, to make a pool of different procedures to compare.

Thanks. I saw that Odin boiled his for one minute as well, but I thought that may be for dissolving the sugar he was adding up front. So for removing the bad taste, Is your colleague suggesting to boil the whole nut before cutting, or after cutting?

I’m in on the reminder idea. If I think of it first, I’ll post a reminder around mid June unless I see someone else do it first. Of course, maybe that reminder should be in May so we have time to make neutral first.


And...... since I’m posting again I thought I would share this. Just a couple of hours since cutting, a super dark layer of something has formed on the top of the jars.

Dark layer

Otis

[NZChris]

Thanks. I saw that Odin boiled his for one minute as well...

Odin included the water in his method.

I'm tempted to try a batch or two where I boil the whole walnuts for a minute or five to see how much chlorophyll and flavour boiling removes and how discarding the water affects my finished Nocino. Tasting the water should give me some indication of what to expect before I commit the whole pick to my chosen method.

[Kareltje]

A colleague suggested to boil the wallnuts shortly to remove the bad taste.
We suggested to warn each other in time next year, to make a pool of different procedures to compare.

Thanks. I saw that Odin boiled his for one minute as well, but I thought that may be for dissolving the sugar he was adding up front. So for removing the bad taste, Is your colleague suggesting to boil the whole nut before cutting, or after cutting?

I’m in on the reminder idea. If I think of it first, I’ll post a reminder around mid June unless I see someone else do it first. Of course, maybe that reminder should be in May so we have time to make neutral first.


And...... since I’m posting again I thought I would share this. Just a couple of hours since cutting, a super dark layer of something has formed on the top of the jars.

F6395BA2-4A3A-4387-B9AB-B002B8219A24.jpeg

Otis

He wrote: First thing is to boil them shortly and discard the water. So I guess he boils the whole nut. Which is logical, if the bitter taste is in the skin. He also claims the black wallnut is much more harmful than the normal one.

About the black layer on top: I remember it too. When I shook the bottle the blackness spread all over the bottle. Next time I leave one bottle at rest, to see how fast it spreads on its own downward.

[OtisT]

Cinnamon is not cinnamon? I went to the local specialty spice store to get spices for my green walnut liquor. Multiple types of “cinnamon” were available which raised some questions for me about what many of these traditional and regional versions of green walnut liquor use for spices.

The common “cinnamon” I see in most grocery stores is actually Cassia root. There is actually a true cinnamon made from Ceylon that is quite similar in smell and taste but it is different in strength and smell. The true cinnamon is more mild than cassia and is floral. All this made me wonder what were these traditional liquors made with? Anyone have any info or opinion on this?

Label of “true” cinnamon

The other cinnamon related question I was pondering is how much? I see recipes that call for 1 stick for a given volume. Cinnamon sticks vary in size greatly, and I know cinnamon is very powerful. The cassia I see at grocery stores is relatively small compare to what I just bought. Since I’m dealing with big sticks, I need to adjust the amount I add.

Size of my stick

Here is my spice list I have decided to use for this year’s batch of green walnut spirits. For each 800 ml (qt) jar I am macerating in, I have added:
* 4 grams of Ceylon “true” cinnamon (about a quarter of that big stick)
* 3 whole cloves
* Zest from one medium sized orange
* I will be adding sugar to taste after maceration and will post the amount used at that time

Otis

[OtisT]

I was at my local spice shop today looking for a secret ingredients for my Limoncello. Unfortunately he did not have it, saying it was not common and he no longer carried it because he could not keep a fresh stock of it. So, off to the Internets I go.

The owner knows me and what my hobby is so I told him the origins of my recipe, from a very old Italian man who’s family have been making this spirit for several generations.

After hearing my story he told me to wait in there and he went to the back room where he keeps his personal books on cooking and spices. He brought out a cook book originally published in Italian in 1897 and translated to English more recently by a friend of his. In it, there was a small section of spirits and wouldn’t you know it, a very similar recipe to the one I am looking to reproduce, complete with the “secret ingredient.” I guess it’s not so secret, but it’s not been mentioned on HD for making Limoncello, so it is somewhat unique. More on that when I make it....

So I told that long story just to get to this. Also in the book was this recipe for green walnut liquor. I figured I’d put it here for future reference.

Old Recipe for green walnut liquor

One other cool fact about that book. The Author lived in the 1800s and was quite the famous cook, raconteur, and world traveler. In the liquor making section he just drops this little story about his conversations with Napoleon (yes, that Napoleon) about one of the ingredients needed for a liquor. Damn, that’s cool.

I also took pics of the half dozen other liquor recipes and will post those in an appropriate location at some point in the future.

Otis

[Saltbush Bill]

is actually Cassia root.

Ottis as far as I am aware Cassia is not from a root ......it is the bark of a tree just like True Cinnamon.
This link shows you very clearly how to tell the difference between True Cinnamon and Cassia.
http://www.differencebetween.info/diffe ... and-cassia" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
A lot of what I see sold as Cinnamon in shops is actually Cassia.
Cassia is usually cheaper and is used extensively in the baking industry in a lot of countries.

[OtisT]

is actually Cassia root.

Ottis as far as I am aware Cassia is not from a root ......it is the bark of a tree just like True Cinnamon.
This link shows you very clearly how to tell the difference between True Cinnamon and Cassia.
http://www.differencebetween.info/diffe ... and-cassia" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
A lot of what I see sold as Cinnamon in shops is actually Cassia.
Cassia is usually cheaper and is used extensively in the baking industry in a lot of countries.

My bad. I knew that, and for some reason threw in “root” rather than “bark” by mistake. Thanks for catching that.

So do you happen to know how long folks have been using the term cinnamon interchangeably for these two products, and what these old recipes actually are referring to? Cassia bark or Ceylon bark?

Otis

[OtisT]

After 10 days this stuff is starting to smell interesting/good. A few days back I could not smell much from the jars but in the last few days it has taken on a Jagermeister type smell. I’ve not tried this liquor before myself so I’m not sure what to expect from the final product but I’m getting excited to find out.

Otis

[RunRufusRun]

I mixed up a batch of green walnut liquor at the end of June this year. I followed Odin’s Dió Pálinka / Walnut Brandy Recipe except I used black walnuts. So it’s been in the bottles for about 2 weeks and I noticed something. I have one half gallon jug full almost to the top and although it is as black as night when shaken a green foam comes to the neck of the jug. Then I have a second half gallon jug that’s about 3/4 full when I shake that jug a tan foam comes to the surface. Here’s the important part, the jug with head space has a noticeably smoother less tannin taste. So I think maybe cracking the cap and introducing some oxygen to the head space in your storage container might make for a better walnut liquor sooner.

[OtisT]

Sweetness - How much sugar to add?

The four recipes I read on making walnut liquor have drastically different amounts of sugar added to them. The range per finished liter is 160g to 660g.

Approximate amount of sugar used per finished liter:
- Odin’s Walnut Brandy (Dio Palinka) uses 160g of sugar per finished liter.
- BlindDrunk’s family recipe for Walnut Liquor uses 190g of sugar per finished liter.
- The recipe I found in a 112 year old Italian cookbook for Nocino uses 490g of sugar per finished liter.
- EuroStiller’s Nocino uses 660g of sugar per finished liter.

I’m going to start at the low end of the range and work up from there.

After a little more than two week macerating I have strained out the solids and am left with 600 ml of liquid in each jar. I used three different base spirits and each spirit has a different proof, so I need to do some math to determine the different amounts of sugar to add to each jar.

Math Values: My desired finished ABV is 50%. The least sweet recipe uses 160g of sugar per liter.

Jar 1 - base spirit is my Rum Re-Do. (Wood aged rum redistilled once in a pot)
600ml @ 60% is 720ml @ 50% (+120ml)
Sugar added to 720ml is 120g

Jar 2 - base spirit is Flagship Panela Rum Late Heads. (last jar before my white cut of rum)
600 ml@ 70% is 840ml @ 50% (+240ml)
Sugar added to 840ml is 140g

Jar 3 - base spirit is my Neutral #3.
600 ml@ 80% is 960ml @ 50% (360ml)
Sugar added to 960ml is 160g

I proofed each jar down to the same 50% ABV by adding the amount of distilled water listed above.

I added the amount of sugar needed directly to each jar and will shake daily until it is all dissolved. Yes OVZ, I need to get a Brix Meter.

Each test is now in a 1,750 ml jar (half gallon) so per RunRufasRun’s recommendation I have plenty of head space to improved/expedite aging.

[Math Note - I understand that my math is not perfect. First of all, I rounded a few things. I did not account for the increased volume of my finished product from the added sugar, so my ABV will be driven a bit lower. I use a dilution calculator that is based on volume, not weight, so my final ABV will be driven a few points higher. I’m making this for myself and friends so in the end these little discrepancies just don’t matter. ]

Cheers.
Otis

[Odin]

Use my amounts and if you don't like it you can still sweeten it up easily. Working the other way around won't work.

Good to see you enjoy yourself with this great recipe.

Regards, Odin.

[OtisT]

Use my amounts and if you don't like it you can still sweeten it up easily. Working the other way around won't work.

Good to see you enjoy yourself with this great recipe.

Regards, Odin.

That’s my plan, to start at the low end and add more sugar if needed. Even if I like it, I made sweeten up a sample to see what the other amounts taste like. I do have a sweet tooth.

Thanks. I’ve been wanting to make this for a few years, but in the past I’ve not thought of it until it was too late for green nuts. I’m usually reminded of it too late, once the squirrels are going crazy all day long chewing off the husk, dropping the nuts down, then stashing the nuts for winter. That squirrel madness actually started this week. I walk by the tree each day. Cars park on the street there, and I will hear at least three “bangs” each time I pass by, when the nuts dropped hit the car parked under it. Between that and the crunch, crunch, crunch under foot it’s hard to miss the squirrel’s walnut season. It makes one hell of a mess.

Otis

[OtisT]

The minimum amount of sugar that I started with is more than enough for my tastes, and I won’t need to add more. I let these all sit for a few weeks after sweetening and proofing and just had my first taste. I understand that these get better with months of aging so will be reporting again later this winter.

I really like this stuff, though not as a main drink but something for sippin on at the end of an evening. The recipes claim to have a way of settling a stomach so next time I’m feeling a bit queasy I’ll give this stuff a try.

The first whiff of this brings back memories of Vics Formula 44 cough syrup, but a bit lighter. It is a brown color too, which again reminds me of my family’s go-to cough medicine. It tastes really sweet up front and has no alcohol burn, only a little warmth, which is surprising for a 50% ABV spirit. I can detect the clove in this, but not the cinnamon. I think I can detect citrus lingering in this, but it is very faint. The green walnut flavor comes through up front with the sweetness then the pallet clears a bit and I get some clove (and possibly an astringent feeling) before the green walnut flavor comes back as a light/crisp “green” taste that lingers. There is a kind of drying sensation in the middle of drinking this ( just after the sweet start and before the lingering taste) that I am guessing is the sensation of Astringency. It only lasts a second or two before the lingering flavors come back. [sorry. I’m not good at describing this stuff but it will help me with subsequent tastings]

I have decided to add a small cinnamon stick to each jar for a few weeks and see what that does for the spirit.

Otis

[Odin]

That astringency will go away if you let it age a few more months, Otis.

Regards, Odin.

[Oldvine Zin]

Wow Otis this is fantastic !!

Having some with some cookies that my daughter sent from Switzerland

stay safe
OVZ

[The Baker]

I made some a long time ago and from memory it was pretty horrible.

I have it in mind to try again one day...
There is a walnut farm fifteen minutes away.

Geoff

[Tummydoc]

For 2-3 months it is unpalatable. At 4 months the bitterness dissipates. Traditionally Nocino was made late June but consumed at Christmas. I prefer a traditional Nocino recipe to Oden's Palinka, but both improve with time. But for 3-4 months you'll think it was a waste of neutral.

[Saltbush Bill]

So do you happen to know how long folks have been using the term cinnamon interchangeably for these two products, and what these old recipes actually are referring to? Cassia bark or Ceylon bark?

Sorry Otis missed your question till now.
I have no idea how long people have been confusing the two products for, how confused people are seems to vary from country to country., and from profession to profession. Ive only really leaned the difference through my Gin making. I think it could also be done on purpose at times for marketing, " selling a cheaper easily available product for a higher price"
I Guess if the recipes you have call for True cinnamon that is what you use , if it says Cassia use it .....or make two smaller batches using one of each as an experiment.
For what its worth Ive tasted a few different Walnut Liquors made by different distillers. They ranged from something I don't wish to drink again, through to one of the nicer Liquors Ive ever drunk. Empty Glass's was a stand out, very drinkable indeed. Even it seemed to improve a lot as time went by.
I think Its one of those things that need time to develop the flavors.

[OtisT]

Season Reminder - Start Making Neutral

Hi Folks. Just a friendly reminder that green walnut season is almost here. You will need some good neutral available when the time for picking comes in June, so break out your favorite neutral recipe (mine is Shady’s Sugar Shine) and start fermenting. .

Otis

[NZChris]

I doubt the base spirit was all that neutral back in the early days. Tasting my first attempt, I suspect that using my white grape spirit instead of Birdwatchers might have been an improvement, not because I can taste the tomato, but because I think the grapes would be a match with the walnut.

I have a 'grappa' ferment going that is made with sugar, lees and backset and will be run with heads and tails from this years brandy, that makes a lightly flavored grape spirit that I find suitable for many European likker experiments without needing to be run through a reflux column. Our walnut season isn't for another six months, so this batch will be perfect for Nocino by then. I'll try to make a couple of batches with wider appeal than the medicinal tasting batches I've made so far

[OtisT]

Just a reminder to folks that it is now June, and it is Green Walnut picking season in the northern hemisphere.

Almost every thread on this drink I have read includes at least one comment about wanting to be reminded when it’s walnut time, so here is your reminder.

Otis