Final proof question

[akdaltron]

Hello all.

Got a question maybe you can help me with. I have been making some very yummy beverages using fruits to infuse flavor after distilling. My question is how to acuratly figure prof after.

Here is an example

In a 1/2 gallon jar.

1/2 cup sugar
1 cup of raspberries
1600ml of 90 proof alcohol. (Sweet feed shine)

Let us sit for 3 weeks. Filter out the raspberries and you have 1700 ml of liquid. What is the proof of what left.

At first I thought it would be as slimple as measure the gain and calculate the proof based on the gain being the same as water.

But then I figured that the raspberries are going to leave some fluid behind but they would absorb some of the alcohol as well.

Any suggestions ???

Thanks in advance for your help!

[NZChris]

Why does it matter? If it tastes nice and the abv is near enough, that's good enough in my shed.

[pope]

If you need to know the abv, what if you simmer raspberries in syrup and then blend the two by volume? Or redistill raspberry infusion and add simple syrup to a known abv volume? Or use dried raspberries?

Or like Chris said just enjoy!

[zed255]

I'm sure it is not entirely accurate, but I always took most fruit added as essentially 80% water by volume. I calculate based on that premise and the measured volume. Truth is, for us hobbyists anyhow, as soon as you add anything other than water to your booze your ability to measure it goes out the window. You must rely on what your known variables are (like the starting ABV of your booze and volumes of fruit and syrup) simply calculate your end result. I'd say by taste I get pretty close that way.

[akdaltron]

It tastes great. I shared some with a friend and he wanted to know proof. Was hoping to give a answer at least in the ballpark.

[still_stirrin]

It tastes great. I shared some with a friend and he wanted to know proof. Was hoping to give a answer at least in the ballpark.

Well, making some assumptions, ie - all alcohol was extracted from the maceration, you could safely say the “not to exceed” proof is:

1600 ml x 45%ABV (90 proof) = 720 ml alcohol
720 ml / 1700 ml (final volume) = 42.35%ABV, or 84 proof.

But this is high, so more likely your fruit sucked up some of the liquor during maceration. If 10% of the alcohol was lost in the fruit, you would more likely have:

(720 - 72) / 1700 = 648 / 1700 = 38.12%ABV, or 76 proof.

Bear in mind this is just an “approximation” based upon some experience with macerations and some assumptions. Regardless, I hope it was a tasty treat.
ss

[NZChris]

I just have an educated guess. As long as it sounds about right, that keeps them happy.

[akdaltron]

I have just been reflecting on the last post about fruit being 80% water by volume. I think that is prolly a good way to do it. When I calculate it this way it comes out to about 75-80 proof. That matches what I feel it tastes like

[Tennessee_Spirits]

I love my blackberry cordial but have the same question and I don't have available advanced chemical techniques such as NMR or column chromatography. Unfortunate, refraction is affected by sugar. I start with 95% NGS and extract the fruit for 3-4 weeks and then strain that tincture to a demijohn for temporary storage and add simple syrup (equal mass sugar and water brought to clearing and cooled) to the fruit. This needs 2 weeks to make a nice dark color liquor that is drinkable. I then combine the two extracts.

To make matters more confusing, sugars are chemically related closely to alcohol, so chemical tests involving reactions with the hydroxyl group might fail by reacting with sugar.

What I think is going on in the extraction is that the alcohol replaces the water in the berries until it is at equilibrium with for both water and alcohol inside and out. That tincture is not sweet to taste at all and measures 82 proof by density. It probably contains some sugar from the fruit, but how to detect it?

The same volume of simple syrup shrinks the fruit. What is happening is the higher osmolarity is bring the alcohol and water out of the fruit.

So I'm stymied about proofing this and anyone who tastes it says "this is goood" and immediately wants to know the proof alcohol.

I tell them it aint Kool-aid! I think it is about 50-60 proof but there is no science I can think of that is affordable to know at home.

[StillerBoy]

Here's the formula I use to determine alcohol content when making liqueurs..

This formula is base using syrup/sugar on it own.. if you are macerating / infusing using fruits, the sugar content of the fruit will need to be determine, at least within a ball pack figure..

Copied and Paste from.. https://tickledpalate.wordpress.com/201 ... r-liqueur/

When creating your liqueur, the first thing to do is to determine the actual amount of ethanol in your base spirits. Take the volume of the spirit in liquid measure (fluid oz, cups, ml) and multiply it by the percentage of alcohol by volume. Divide that amount by 100. That will be the liquid measure of ethanol in your base.

(Total Volume X Percentage of Alcohol) divided by 100

For example: Let’s say we’re creating an amaro that begins with 2 cups (16 oz) of grain alcohol at 75% ABV

1) Multiply alcohol volume by its ABV concentration:
16 X 75 = 1200

2) Divide the product by 100:
1200 ÷ 100 = 12

There are 12 oz. of ethanol in our 2 cups of grain alcohol at 75% ABV.

This is the alcohol liquid measure that will (more or less) remain constant for all of your concentration calcuations of this particular batch (assuming little evaporation).

Now, the alcohol percentage of your finished amaro, liqueur or spirit can be calculated by dividing the original alcohol liquid measure by the total volume of your finished spirit. If two cups of liquid (water, infusions, syrup) are added to the 2 cups of grain alcohol, the total spirit volume is, of course, 4 cups. The resulting spirit is now:

12 oz ethanol ÷ 32 oz (4 cups) = 37.5% ABV or 75 Proof

Note that this is completely different than comparing the specific gravity of wort and the finished beer to determine ABV. In that case, no additional liquid is added so the process is more or less isochoric (constant-volume).

Mars

[corene1]

Why does it matter? If it tastes nice and the abv is near enough, that's good enough in my shed.

Perfect answer!

[Sulaiman]

If you have a small still you could distill a known volume of your concoction and measure the ABV of your distillate,
from this you can calculate the ABV of your concoction... no need for fancy analytical tools.
But unless it's really important to you to know the ABV,
it's not worth wasting your concoction.

[WithOrWithoutU2]

I have a related question. I know how to calculate the ABV when proofing down with water. But does it matter what liquid I use (assuming it is not another alcohol)? Does it matter if I proof down with tap water versus fruit juice, syrup, cream, etc? Will the proofing formula on this forum still be accurate?

[Tummydoc]

Alcohol By Volume. So as long as you know the volume it doesnt matter what diluent you used.

[StillerBoy]

But does it matter what liquid I use (assuming it is not another alcohol)? Does it matter if I proof down with tap water versus fruit juice, syrup, cream, etc? Will the proofing formula on this forum still be accurate?

As long as you are using water or another pure liquor, the proofing of the abv by using an alcometer will do..

But if you diluting using fruit juice, syrup which content sugars, the alcometer is not the tool to use, but the formula outline in this thread..

Mars

[1Panama_Red]

I started out with 156 proof white liquor, I poured it into a gallon jar with about a quart and a half of fresh peaches that had been macerated with sugar for several days. The liquid that came out of the peaches was about a quart. The peaches, peach juice and white liquor were put in a closet in the dark for two months. The liquid looks very peachy, however, it has a flavor like you would expect of high proof liquor. Now I understand that Peach Brandy/Schnapps is meant to be sipped, but very little of this will have you chasing parked cars and you will NEVER catch one. When making corn liquor, I put it onto the oak chips at high proof and later cut it back with water after it had achieved the color and flavor profile I wanted. Should this be cut down to safer proof with water, or should I use peach juice? Or just pull up my big boy panties and sip it slowly?