Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby zapata » Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:37 pm

Lol, and that is why you have a different opinion than most here :) By the way, I've actually done what you are doing for drinking liquor with waste from a Swedish bakery. it was interesting. Kinda All over the place pot stilled, but as an almost vodka from the reflux rig it was unique and worth doing. So maybe taste some of your fuel if you equipment is consumption geade.

Just happened across these guys mentioned in a rum thread, and laughed when I read this in their faq:
http://www.whitestaryeast.com/about/faq#f17
Can the yeast be re-pitched and how many times?
Yes, but as the yeast reverts back to slurry, the pitching quantity needs to be increased by at least 10% Extra care also needs to be taken with regard to maintaining the microbiological purity of the yeast when recycling. A maximum of 2-3 cycles is a general guideline for most whiskey and rum strains, as long as the viability and relative sterility of the yeast is kept intact.

If a business selling yeast says to reuse slurry 2 or 3 times and just increase the pitch rate by 10%, I think that's pretty good validation.
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby Saltbush Bill » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:20 am

zapata wrote: A maximum of 2-3 cycles is a general guideline for most whiskey and rum strains,

PFFFFT at 2-3 cycles ....Ive been using the same yeast bed in my UJ now for over 50 gens / cycles. :lol: Its still working as well as the day I first pitched it.
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby fizzix » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:38 am

I'm not here to join the fracas, but to enter some real life current experience.

By sheer coincidence this is right up my alley for what I'm doing these days --harvesting yeast.
I took the Nottingham yeast bed from a beer brew 2 weeks ago and saved it in a 0.75 liter canning jar in the fridge.
Made up 18 gallons of Birdwatcher's last night (3 buckets), warmed the yeast to room temp from fridge storage and poured off the beer on top, and pitched equally.
The Birdwatcher's is going frantically this morning in all 3 buckets.

The quantity I'm sure is a factor, as 1/4 liter yeast in each bucket is more than a normal dry yeast pitch.
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby butterpants » Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:29 am

zapata wrote:I know what you are saying is 90% true. 95% true for beer. There's just one problem.
I am saying that if you want to inoculate the next batch with the previous one, the active yeast is better.

Nope. Better by some measurements a scientist might make? Sure. Better in a practical manner for the home distiller? Not a chance. The logistics just don't work for most home distillers, when the wash is at high krausen, the fermenter is full. Most of us aren't in a production cycle that includes starting a new batch before the current wash is even done. Add to the fact that I give you a zero percent chance of tasting one of my spirits and accurately guessing if I pitched onto a yeast cake, krausened, or pitched a fresh starter. There just isn't really a "better" to it. Other than in theory, which as I mentioned, your theory is 100% correct. But pitching onto a yeast cake just flat out works fine.

I don't think anyone is being mislead, even beginners are capable of learning both theory and practicality.
My issue with pitching onto a cake in distilling is excessive trub and loss of wash even after cold crashing because I refuse to pour all that excess yeast n muck into my boiler.

For some Booners I recently did, the 2nd gen pitch onto cake (in a bucket) was eating up about 1.5 gallons. Maybe this is unique to corn squeezins but I found it unacceptable. Back to harvesting and repitch a smaller amount.
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby zapata » Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:22 pm

Yeah, that sounds like trub more than just yeast, but yes I can see that being a problem, especially in small fermenters. Pitching a smaller amount makes sense. Washing it would make sense in your case too. In beer, trub particles are heavier than yeast. Swirl the cake in excess water, and the trub drops out first while the water stays cloudy with yeast. You can pour off the yeast water, and let it settle to concentrate.

This might not be the case with your booners, depending on how you handle the corn I could see some really fine corn flour precipitate forming that might be difficult to wash out, not sure, and it might be specific to how one handles their corn.
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby MtRainier » Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:19 am

I just did one of these pretty much straight by the recipe using SAF Gold bread yeast.

It was right on the money with 5-6 days of ferment and ending at 0.995 at 80 degrees after starting at 1.070.

I monitored pH each day and did end up doing additions of 14g of calcium carbonate each time the pH went below 4.

I get a fresh apple flavor when tasting it, but that's probably pretty normal. I remember that flavor from other high-sugar ferments I did with meads in the past.
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby Expat » Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:42 am

You might consider using oyster shells instead of calcium carbonate powder. Adding a handful at beginning will normalize the ph throughout the fermentation.

Essentially the same chemical composition, but a heck of a lot cheaper.
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby MtRainier » Fri Aug 10, 2018 10:28 am

Expat wrote:You might consider using oyster shells instead of calcium carbonate powder. Adding a handful at beginning will normalize the ph throughout the fermentation.

Essentially the same chemical composition, but a heck of a lot cheaper.


Would the crushed kind from TSC work ok in some cheesecloth or something or is there a benefit to having them whole?
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby Microplaned » Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:49 am

I just started my first batch today! Used everything but the Epsom salts, didn’t have any handy. Also used Red star dady. I added an extra tbsp of dady because I got a bit heavy handed with the sugar! SG was 1.072 so I feel pretty good about the start! Already starting to burp a little, can’t wait!
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby TDick » Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:51 am

Expat wrote:You might consider using oyster shells instead of calcium carbonate powder. Adding a handful at beginning will normalize the ph throughout the fermentation.

Essentially the same chemical composition, but a heck of a lot cheaper.


What about throwing a Tums in?
Active Ingredient (per tablet): Calcium Carbonate USP 500mg
Purpose: Antacid. All varieties of TUMS® Regular Strength product are Gluten Free & Kosher Pareve.
Each tablet contains: elemental calcium 200mg.
Assorted Fruit - Inactive Ingredients:
adipic acid, corn starch, FD&C blue #1 lake, FD&C red #40 lake, FD&C yellow #5 (tartrazine) lake, FD&C yellow #6 lake, flavors, mineral oil, sodium polyphosphate, sucrose, talc
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Re: Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

Postby MtRainier » Fri Aug 10, 2018 12:03 pm

I'd need a lot of tums if each has 0.5g of Calcium Carbonate. I put in a total of 3 additions of 14g, so 42g total. That would be 84 tums, lol. Maybe I overdid it, but it doesn't seem like some chalk will hurt it and it kept it from crashing. I have relatively soft water.
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