uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

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bitter
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by bitter » Mon Jun 01, 2015 4:14 pm

Just started a wash.. only changes was I scaled it up for 23l instead of 19l. I also used 1 lb of rye in the mix and the rest corn. Everything else was scaled perfectly to the original recipe.

23l water
8.5lbs Sugar
7.5 lbs cracked corn
1.0 lb of rye flakes
1 TBS of baker yeast plus a little to account for the extra wash size

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by bitter » Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:55 pm

Tested the wash tonight already down to 1.010 and boiling its fermenting so well.
Was a bit cool too so pleasantly surprised (was in the mid to high 60's in the house for part the time and still did well). Now the temp is back to 75 so shoudl move along nicely now.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by bitter » Tue Jun 09, 2015 4:01 am

Checked lat night and things were down below .990 ... just letting things clear up and wait for the second batch to finish fermenting that I started about 2 days after the first (needed sugar). This way I have 46L or so to put in the keg still. Might just run these off as somewhat neutral in reflux mode and then get gen 2 on the way and wait to taste UJSSM till then when its really UJSSM

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Appalachia-Shiner » Tue Jun 09, 2015 4:52 am

How many Generations can you go with this? I actually lost count, but I'm on 8 or 9....

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by HDNB » Tue Jun 09, 2015 5:12 am

i got into mid 20's after a year -and all on the original yeast.

the best one was gen 17 or 18 when i added a bunch of malted 2 row, just for funzies.
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by S-Cackalacky » Tue Jun 09, 2015 5:17 am

Appalachia-Shiner wrote:How many Generations can you go with this? I actually lost count, but I'm on 8 or 9....
There was something written about this - I think in a different thread. After a number of generations, things will begin to go south and it will be necessary to start fresh. The yeast will begin to morph into something enviable. There isn't a whole lot of consensus on when that might happen. Some folks like to save some of the later gen backset (gen 4 or greater) for restarting. Put it in the fridge or freezer so that you have it for restarts. I know that some folks have gone as high as 20 or more gens while others might start seeing problems after 12 or 13 gens.

Posted while HDNB was posting.
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by chris_zx2 » Tue Jun 09, 2015 6:25 am

Could you (if feasible) boil it at that generation to kill the yeast and add fresh yeast, hence continuing the generations with fresh yeast.
Or perhaps pulling off the Yeast like they do for beer (not sure you could get it all...)

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by S-Cackalacky » Tue Jun 09, 2015 7:20 am

Don't see why not. The only concern might be having too much nutrient. There might be other opinions. If you have any concerns, try it on a small scale first to see how it goes. Good luck with it.
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Snackson » Mon Jun 15, 2015 8:53 am

Trying to use up some ingredients before a move later this year and i mixed up my first batch of UJSSM last night. 7# cane sugar, 6# flaked corn, 1# flaked wheat and 1 tbsp bakers yeast. Can't wait to run it through and try it. I have a lot of extra grain from beer brewing and will be making some single malt whiskey soon as well.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by moosemilk » Mon Jun 15, 2015 9:33 am

Snackson wrote:Trying to use up some ingredients before a move later this year and i mixed up my first batch of UJSSM last night. 7# cane sugar, 6# flaked corn, 1# flaked wheat and 1 tbsp bakers yeast. Can't wait to run it through and try it. I have a lot of extra grain from beer brewing and will be making some single malt whiskey soon as well.
Sounds yummy! The cane sugar may give it a very light rum flavor.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by chris_zx2 » Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:36 am

Need some help guys. I used to make ujssm all the time with no problems and then I switched to AG.
Well I finally built my new still and bought a brute and thought it would be easier to do ujssm for the first time.
In my 20 gallon brute:
I used 5 lbs malted barley (no cooking)
15 lbs cracked corn
21 lbs sugar
15 gallons water
I checked sg : 1.060
Added nutrients and pitched yeast: 2 packets of us-05 temp was at 74°
Next morning it had a nice cap and when I broke the cap to test it foamed like soap out the hole.

After 5 days sg dropped to 1.011 and hasn't moved since. The cap has mostly fallen and I see bubbles rising and a mild lactic infection. Ph was 3.5 so I added a 1/4 cup of baking soda which brought it up to 3.9. I don't have any us-05 left only bakers. I tried adding more nutrients and even a little enzymes to see if it would help with no affect. It's still bubbling very slowly but sg isn't changing. Should I just wait a little longer or should I try pitching some bakers yeast?
Let me know if there is any info I missed.
Oh and no backset was used.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Snackson » Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:05 am

My experience with US-05 in brewing a high adjunct beer it finished at around 1.011. I would siphon it off into another container, taste a sample, and pitch a little bakers to take it the rest of the way down.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by chris_zx2 » Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:12 am

Good idea! That way I don't create a cross strain.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by still_stirrin » Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:14 am

chris_zx2 wrote:...After 5 days sg dropped to 1.011...hasn't moved since...
How long is, "hasn't moved since"?

Ferment slowed (stopped?) due to the plummeting pH. If it's truly stopped, you may have difficulty restarting it unless you raise the pH to optimum (4.5-5.0) and pitch an active starter. You also could raise the ferment temperature a little up to 80 F, or so. That might help with the energy level too.

You may try to fiddle with it to get it to restart, but you'll spend some time and effort to accomplish it. It may be more advantageous to run it and add some oyster shells next time.

If the yeast would've hung on to terminate closer to unity (SG=1.000), then it would be "textbook". What you've experienced is just an anomaly. It happens sometime.
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by moosemilk » Wed Jun 17, 2015 10:02 am

Sugar heads and anything with high sugar tend to have pH crash as the ferment goes on. I never had problems with 5 gallon ferments, but noticed the same you are when I started using a brute. Handfuls of oyster shells at the start will keep it optimal as mentioned.

I would say since you may have an infection, run it now. Just be careful of puking because there is sugar left. I put a little slice of butter in my boiler when this happens to me, keeps the foaming down, and you can still use the backset.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Haus » Thu Jun 18, 2015 3:27 am

moosemilk wrote:I put a little slice of butter in my boiler when this happens to me, keeps the foaming down, and you can still use the backset.
Out of curiosity, I always throw a splash of EVOO (extra virgin olive oil) in my pasta pot to eliminate the foam up. Same thing apply here or is that going to impart a flavor?
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by HDNB » Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:31 am

i used butter (AG) once and safflower oil (rum) once. never noticed the flavour of either...not that safflower oil really has any flavour.

the HBS has a product called fermcap that does the same thing without flavour. it's about 3 bucks an Oz. probably a few years worth.
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by chris_zx2 » Thu Jun 18, 2015 2:52 pm

moosemilk wrote:Sugar heads and anything with high sugar tend to have pH crash as the ferment goes on. I never had problems with 5 gallon ferments, but noticed the same you are when I started using a brute. Handfuls of oyster shells at the start will keep it optimal as mentioned.

I would say since you may have an infection, run it now. Just be careful of puking because there is sugar left. I put a little slice of butter in my boiler when this happens to me, keeps the foaming down, and you can still use the backset.
Moose where do you get your oyster shells?

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by moosemilk » Thu Jun 18, 2015 3:14 pm

chris_zx2 wrote: Moose where do you get your oyster shells?
Local feed store. They have them with the chicken feed stuff. 50lb bag is about ten bux and lasts forever. I dump backset in my garden and spent grains, so I also use the oyster shells in there to keep pH level of soil good.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by greenthumb » Sun Jun 21, 2015 11:21 am

wasn't too sure how this would turn out as i'm a hard core spiced rum drinker, but this came out amazing, I add 60ml of caramel per 750ml bottle and now the wife loves it too, the spiced rum is on the back burner now :-)

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by hexed » Fri Jun 26, 2015 5:34 am

greenthumb wrote:wasn't too sure how this would turn out as i'm a hard core spiced rum drinker, but this came out amazing, I add 60ml of caramel per 750ml bottle and now the wife loves it too, the spiced rum is on the back burner now :-)
It's amazing how a few kgs of corn just thrown in to a sugar wash can make it taste pretty darn good, eh?

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by bitter » Sat Jul 04, 2015 9:01 am

hexed wrote: It's amazing how a few kgs of corn just thrown in to a sugar wash can make it taste pretty darn good, eh?
I second that notion! Got 2l of really nice product from my Gen 1 Corn and Rye UJSSM!!! Just put it on oak! Now have to wait for a month or so see how the oak helps it along. If there is not enough carmel flavors will maybe try adding a small amount when I cut things to drinking strength after aging. Can't wait to compare with Gen 2 already fermenting along nicely.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Thehoff69 » Thu Jul 23, 2015 12:56 pm

Hello,

Maybe a silly question?
My first 2 gens of Ujssm took 2-3 weeks to finish and I ran them before the mash had cleared.
I have since added a fish tank submersible heater inside my fermenter to keep temp at a constant 24c.
(I'm in Ireland and it's cold here!)
This has finished my ferment in 5 days, it tastes dry.. Sg was 1.065 and now sitting at 0.995

I've turned heater off and placed somewhere slightly cooler.


So what does everyone do?
Run it or wait a few days for mash to completely clear?
Will the quality be better the clearer mash is?

Just doing stopping runs until I have enough for a spirit run.

Thanks
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by Fastill » Thu Jul 23, 2015 3:58 pm

Thehoff69 wrote:Hello,

Maybe a silly question?
My first 2 gens of Ujssm took 2-3 weeks to finish and I ran them before the mash had cleared.
I have since added a fish tank submersible heater inside my fermenter to keep temp at a constant 24c.
(I'm in Ireland and it's cold here!)
This has finished my ferment in 5 days, it tastes dry.. Sg was 1.065 and now sitting at 0.995

I've turned heater off and placed somewhere slightly cooler.


So what does everyone do?
Run it or wait a few days for mash to completely clear?
Will the quality be better the clearer mash is?

Just doing stopping runs until I have enough for a spirit run.

Thanks
I run as soon as it is done, don't let it clear otherwise Lacto takes over and I seem to get less finished product when that happens. I have one for over 2 weeks and it still isn't finished but weather has turned hot here and I expect it to go fast now.
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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by HDNB » Thu Jul 23, 2015 5:36 pm

i'd agree with that and run it. a day or two of clearing and go...i left a couple for two or more weeks and the result was not as goood.
I finally quit drinking for good.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by stilldistillin » Mon Aug 03, 2015 12:45 pm

Lately I have been testing different types of yeast other than bakers yeast for UJSSM.

I have run about 20 barrels of UJSSM with bakers yeast so my technique is pretty consistent.

To read my logs on S-04 and S-05 brewers ale yeast and how they compare to bakers yeast, see here:

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 7#p7334137

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by biggybigz » Sun Aug 16, 2015 7:13 pm

I have had much luck with distillers yeast. Give it a whirl!

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by slowNlow86 » Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:01 am

Made up my first sour mash using this recipe over the weekend. The first (sweet) run the yeast was kind of slow and stalled at 7 brix. The second generation was much more active! Put everything in the fermenter around 10pm. At midnight the wife woke me up because my air lock bubbling away "sounded like water dripping somewhere". Then she woke me up again at 4am because she "heard a loud noise". It was my fermenter. The lid had blown off the darn thing! I know the backset acts as a ph buffer, but the difference was night and day! I used red star DADY for reference. Cant wait to run it in a few days and do a taste comparison.

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by hotrodelrod » Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:01 pm

How long will the backset keep?

Thanks

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Re: uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

Post by dieselduo » Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:44 pm

hotrodelrod wrote:How long will the backset keep?

Thanks
refrigerate it and it will keep a long time :)

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