Pressure cooker vs Stock pot w/ thumper

[MidnightBrewer]

Tried to wade through the ocean of information, but couldn't locate an answer for this.

The abandonment of pressure cookers, due to volume and difficulty to get one that is stainless steel I can understand to a point.

If I use a thumper, then wouldn't the resulting pressure require a pressure cooker, or is the pressure not enough?

I have 1/2" copper tubing, and a 2l glass thumper (once I get how I want to run it down pat, It'll become 1 gallon stainless steel) with brass compression fittings (2% lead to make it machinable, to be replaced with stainless, as soon as I can aquire some). sealant was teflon, replacing with a flour paste.

Advice for build #2 is welcome, as I'm in awe of this database and a bit overwhelmed, but determined to press on.

[bilgriss]

There should be NO pressure build up in a pot. That's extremely dangerous.

Before making plans or comitting anything to an experiment, please please read materials until some of the most fundamental concepts seem second nature. Then you'll have some questions to ask.
Start here
viewforum.php?f=46

Then follow all of the links here:
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=52975

You still won't understand it all, but you will have a better idea of how to proceed and what questions to ask.

And this is the welcome center. Welcome!

[fizzix]

Another consideration with a pressure cooker is the seal. Just because it's food-safe doesn't mean it's hot, high-proof vapor safe.
We're essentially cooking potent solvents and not many materials safely stand up to that.

[BlackStrap]

I agree with bilgris, Please keep reading, Use the links bilgris provided, you can use the links in my signature as well. I would caution using glass as well, (a very delicate container with possible open flame?) In the setup you described, IMO the first purchase I would make would be a fire extinguisher in working order, I'm not trying to be a jerk. I'm trying to stress the importance of caution and common sence.

My first still was a 5 gallon stainless pot with a big stainless salad bowl held in place with spring clips and flour paste, (No thumper, yet) ran 1/2 OD soft copper to a copper worm in a 5 gallon bucket. My heat source was electric hot plate... It was just a simple pot still, but from there and through lots of help from this forum. Before I even drank a drop, I made sure I understood what 4shots, heads, hearts, tales were. The more I read, the more I knew how to ask questions using the terms those in the forum can understand to reply back with good advice.

You are going to exercise things like patients & problem solving, I would suggest taking notes (I often am forgetful, and find that having something to go back to really helps). This hobby can be very rewarding, but it can be dangerous, not to mention at the moment illegal (in most places)

[markieb]

hi abadbrewer these guys may seem a bit harsh sometimes but remember 1 mess up could be fatal its for your benefit of staying alive lol!i take it your doing it indoors due to the equipment your suggesting?
personally if it were me doing it soley indoors then id go for a catering boiler/tea urn,they hold enough for a decent run and already have the heating element attached and usually a couple nuts and bolts and you can attach your own controller to dial in the sweet spot when doing a run.
hot plates and cookers can cause issues with cycles which can throw off the heat.
if you have access to a shed then id go the keg/half keg route alot easier pleanty of fitments that attach straight away so minimal fuss!
theres a wealth of info here have fun but remember when making highly flamable volitile gases dont some around it and keep an eye on it always when running.

[MidnightBrewer]

I wondered about the seal and if it would hold up. I'm using a 2l bernardin canning jar for a thumper, but been rethinking that due to lid material and the coating underneath.

I chuckled at the concern for safety and not trying to sound like an ass, I struggle with that everyday at work. I do my job, plus safety officer, rescue, First Aid lv3, elected as 1 of 4 safety champs last year and held on as support for this years selection. Simply asking some of these loggers, millwrights and sometimes managment, simple things can be a chore. So I actually really appreciate that shaz. sometimes I'm in a shop, sometimes a cleared and tarped spot, doing it while ice fishing seemed smart at first... till u catch something and have to watch for a cut at the same time.

I was thinking the pressure needed to bubble into the thumper would lift the lid first without something to clamp it down... suppose my small woodworking clamps would work... having a duh moment.

between studying and being there for my buds brewing, I have the cuts down pat. I also threw out the 12 liters (some heads, hearts and tails combined) produced with the first set up, as there was contamination. I take detailed notes of, propane used, costs, itemized ingredients, techniques used for mixing, starting gravity, finished gravity, ph level, distillate measured with proper hydrometer, how much produced, any cooking irregularities, date fermentation began, date it was cooked, what setup, add pictures of ingredients, fermentation, cook system and end result. I grew up in a science and chess mind frame world with computer experience starting at 8, but it was a logging household as well... so I had to learn to be tough as well... which took a bit.

I've partnered up with a chemist who doesn't drink, so there have been some interesting.... ideas. This wasn't in his area, but he's clearing somethings up as I proceed and feed him data back. We both overlooked the seal tho.

[greggn]

I run reflux columns, not pot stills, but ... you need to flip that worm 180 degrees. The input from the pot should be from the top so the distillate runs downhill. Your configuration runs the likely chance of a blockage and pressure build-up. Not a good scenario.

[Yummyrum]

Welcome ABadBrewer .

Pleased you joned up and are taking on board the recommendations about your still setup . We really do discurage the use of those glass thumpers . ...... especially seeng how close it is to the gas burner .
Even if it was all metal I think its a bit undersized for the boiler you have . It almosts looks full in the pic giving an indication that its really pushing the limit .

Also as mentioned the synthetic seal n the pressure cooker is a bad idea and breaches the safety rules on this forum .

Looking forward to seeing an improved version of your still setup .

BTW Karltje will be impressed with your spiral riser . By the looks of all the snow you have , would imagine some interesting reflux happening .

[jon1163]

+ however many others commented on the thumper. It's like what I tell my daughter about drugs. It might not be the first time it might not be the thousandth time but it'll get you. Here's what will happen with that Thumper, you, or the dog, or the wind, or an earthquake will knock that thing over someday and it'll break. The liquid will Splash on to the flame from your burner that's close and then you'll have the open copper pipe from your boiler acting as a flamethrower. You'll have the flamethrower going igniting everything around and you'll have the floor fire with all your liquid alcohol burning all around your propane tank and you won't be able to get close to the propane burner to turn it off. You'll just have to evacuate and hope for the best which won't be good.

[MidnightBrewer]

well... those crates are just there for support, I can take them away and it just hangs there (compression fittings through the lid), I ran it too hot though and my mash bubbled all the way up the first worm (which is supposed to act like a weak reflux) and poured into my jar a little, before going out to my bucket condensor.
The head is usually 85%, heart is 75% and I cut the tail around 30- 40%ish depending on taste, the rest is collected to be added to the next run.
using 1/2" copper and no solids in my cook, so I'm not sure about the blockage scenario, but with the one end in the fluid of the thumper, that is the blockage, which so far takes less than 5psi to overcome.. well it doesn't pop the 5lb pressure weight, if thats relevant.

So far the next build is two stainless steel stock pots with stainless steel lids, 6 quart in place of the jar and a 20 quart for the main pot. This should clear up issues, plus this time I will be tapping my drill holes for a better fit for the fittings. possibly a support stand to stablize and protect it from bumps

the image of a copper pipe flamethrower is gonna stick with me tho

[MidnightBrewer]

I have a video of it running, but i cant post it here.

I could defend the jar, as I chose that type for a reason, but thermal shock is it's weakness, and I'm in sub-zero temps. SS Thumper and boiler should be here by friday. I did end up learning a lot of how to run the still by using the jar, but that was it's only purpose and will be replaced this week. I'd love to get my hands on a keg, but no such luck around here.

[MidnightBrewer]

After considering what this site is about, I abdicate glass (except in fermenting). It can be used if done in a safe manner, but the odds for error make that an impossibility. Part of the safety team, and still learning it. It's not about having a safe way to do it, it's about being integrally safe, so that your not hurt when a mistake is eventually made. I'm a canknuckle head, so I grew up without regard for safety, and am playing catch up.... a effing lot of catch up, but I'm starting to bag what they are mowing.

When I tried to figure out what the lid was made of, and coated in... then just dismantled it without a real answer cause I didn't like where the rabbit hole lead.

Build #3 is now a 20l SS boiler, same 1/2" copper tubing, 6qt SS thumper and 1/2" copper condensor.
This system has a pressure due to the thumper. A proper thumper will always cause a pressure build up, but less than 10 psi. I don't have a guage, but my 5lb release valve doesn't pop either. Though this means I require securing it to prevent steam escape. I use a small amount of dough to form a seal ring, I keep flour paste on hand in case, but this is cleaner, more effective and takes very little work.

I noted that debate still exists over aluminum occasionally. I'd argue against, my bud has done this for a few years and uses an aluminum boiler. he makes low yield mashes though and never seen a problem. I used a 20L aluminum pressure cooker for a short time to do the leg work. can't see anything in them first few, he crowed. last one I made with it was a little cloudy, we held it up to the light and the cloud of floaties sparkled... it was an aluminum cloud. opened up the boiler and a silver slick was floating on top and was a wild rainbow, like it was oil. wasn't the mash, other than it's acidity. ran new mash from same batch through my SS still setup and it came out beautiful. 80% and apple hints when drinking it and exhale. He still uses his aluminum one, but I think he hesitates a little now.


Thank you guys for the advice. I will keep reading and studying to improve before practicing to improve.

[Hilltop]

I notice when you came out of the pot with your tubing you made several large coils straight up then over to your jar. Whats the reasoning behind that? Reflux? Find you a small Keg for a thumper or stainless pipe.

[MidnightBrewer]

it was a minor reflux, it did boost %, but ultimately I have since removed it, as I'm looking to make a more moderate % to stay closer to true moonshine. the head was 85- 78% for about 500ml, next liter is usually 68-63%, next liter is 60% - 53% then it drops steady and begin to taste of tails quickly. I want to have something closer to 60 - 65% at the head and keep the thumper.

Boiler was replaced, as was the thumper so that the system is 100% copper and stainless now. Removed the reflux coil today as well. I'll post a pic on 'hallo from canada'

I'll report my results after three runs tomorrow, but on Hallo from canada. This thread was to push discovery of why the difference, and after being pointed to seals, I feel as though this thread has served it's purpose now.