Teddy's fast ferment vodka really has a bran aftertaste

[Simple Sam]

Hi. I made the recipe just like the instructions said. One exception it took 6 days for me. Its getting cold here and had trouble keeping 100L plus ingredients warm. It finished fermenting to .990 it tasted quite neutral with a bit of brannyness... is thats a word. I made no substitutions and followed the recipe with the ingredients.

I did 3 stripping runs and 1 spirit run. I was hoping the spirit run would remove the aftertaste but it didn't


My question is it supposed to taste like that or really be more neutral?

[JesseMarques]

What is your equip? pot still or packed column?

[SaltyStaves]

I pot still it and as the recipe stands, it is anything but neutral. I modify it for my purposes by using stale wheat bran and only pouring boiling water over it and covering in the pot for no more than one minute before I discard the bran and transfer the liquid to the fermenter.

It takes longer to ferment dry, but it is a nice white spirit that I enjoy chilled in the summer months. Still not neutral though.

[JesseMarques]

So my guess is that you may gone too far on tails. Making neutrals with a pot still demands to keep only the purest hearts, or several distilations.
Dilute it down to under 40%,or even 20% and distill again, you'll end with a way more neutral product

[Saltbush Bill]

I don't think Teddy ever claimed or said that this was a Neutral wash.......infact I can see a few instances in the first page of the recipe where he says things like "I find this has a nice slightly wheaty taste and is much nicer than the tomato paste based wash" and "As above but 200g of bran and 100g kibbled rye
This have turned out to be even better - just as fast but with a little more bite/flavour in the end result. It depends on the finish you want in your vodka.".

[tubbsy]

If you've only double distilled it, of course flavour will carry through. If you want a neutral spirit, you need to run it through a reflux still.

[NZChris]

I'm not a great fan of wheat flavor in my drinks, so my bran method has a fraction of the bran, which is steeped in hot water until it cools, then sieved out. That method makes a lightly flavoured vodka when double distilled through a pot still. The feints run through a Bokakob are also more like a grain vodka than a neutral.

For my latest batch of neutral, I went back to my thirty year old sugar shine method with only DAP & Vegemite for nutrients. To hurry it up I put an aquarium air pump inside the head space to agitate it. It worked so well that I won't be using bran or tomato paste again.

[StillerBoy]

I went back to my thirty year old sugar shine method with only DAP & Vegemite for nutrients. To hurry it up I put an aquarium air pump inside the head space to agitate it. It worked so well that I won't be using bran or tomato paste again.

That's in line with the sugar wash I do.. very little ingredients both in amounts and number of ingredients.. done in no time, and no after flavor residue in a reflux column.. the other part that's interesting is the amount of sugar used.. there's a fine line between not enough sugar and to much affecting the flavor product..

Good one Chris..

Mars

[NZChris]

If I was making a mistake thirty years ago, it was starting with too high an OG, a typical newbie mistake.

[Corsaire]

I do enjoy a little wheat flavor. But if you only have a pot still, it needs three passes and strict cuts.

[dukethebeagle120]

If I was making a mistake thirty years ago, it was starting with too high an OG, a typical newbie mistake.

Agreed,
My sugar washes are no higher og then grain mashes.
I try to keep between 1.060 and 1.070.
Not harsh and neuetral
I use wineo sugar wash recipe.
Always works for me

[StillerBoy]

If I was making a mistake thirty years ago, it was starting with too high an OG, a typical newbie mistake.

I recently done some sugar wash experiences using 3.5K, 4K, 4.5K and 5K in 6.5 gal batches and making enough batches of each recipe to have a 6 gal of 35% low wine, all stripped to the same abv level, for the spirit run.. variant amount of sugar used both dry and inverted., ingredients, fermenting temp, step addition, ended with twelve different recipes/methods.. all run through using the same reflux column length and packing..

The results provided some interesting insight.. the 4.5K in step addition out shine all others even the 4.5K one step.. and the worst one was 3.5K.. the other point that was interesting was if added an extra say tp of DAP or Fermaid, the ferment took longer to finished dry.. so little ingredients is really required but what the yeast don't like temp and Ph variant much more than the ingredients.. when these are off, the ferment takes time to finish and don't clear well either, and if the Ph is high it will foam..

Mars

[Simple Sam]

I have a 50l keg boiler with a 40 inch 2 inch colum i used that foe the 3 stripping runs to go through the 120l. Then I ran it slow by packing the colum with copper mesh and added a dephlmator on top b4 the turn to the condenser. I tasted the jars that came off . Proofed down to 40 from 92% jar 3 was amazing. 7 through 11 were very wheat like. I guess that flavkur will ways be there. Then what is a great neutral recipe? I'd like to get away from the wheat flavour in my ceaser!

[Teddysad]

This is a vodka not a neutral and was designed that way.

[Simple Sam]

Ok. I thought vodkas were neutral.. is a bit if bran aftertaste nirmal? Just wondering if it's my process..

Thank you. .. its a great recipe though!

[CoogeeBoy]

At least you can get the Wheat Bran!!!

[Kareltje]

If I was making a mistake thirty years ago, it was starting with too high an OG, a typical newbie mistake.

I recently done some sugar wash experiences using 3.5K, 4K, 4.5K and 5K in 6.5 gal batches and making enough batches of each recipe to have a 6 gal of 35% low wine, all stripped to the same abv level, for the spirit run.. variant amount of sugar used both dry and inverted., ingredients, fermenting temp, step addition, ended with twelve different recipes/methods.. all run through using the same reflux column length and packing..

The results provided some interesting insight.. the 4.5K in step addition out shine all others even the 4.5K one step.. and the worst one was 3.5K.. the other point that was interesting was if added an extra say tp of DAP or Fermaid, the ferment took longer to finished dry.. so little ingredients is really required but what the yeast don't like temp and Ph variant much more than the ingredients.. when these are off, the ferment takes time to finish and don't clear well either, and if the Ph is high it will foam..

Mars

This is what science is about: testing and trying and then drawing conclusions. Well done!!

I have a few questions, though, as you do not give us the complete results.
1. Which gallons you used? The ones of 3.8 litres or the ones of 4.5 litres?
2. Was there any difference between inverted or raw sugar?
3. Was there any difference between fermenting temperature?

Then there are some things that puzzle me.
You have 4 amounts of sugar. Then there are several other variables. Inverted or not, ingredients, temperature, step addition or not. And still you have only 12 different recipes/methods?

Then there are your remarks about DAP and Fermaid, pH and temperature.

Please tell us more about these variables.

[Corsaire]

Perhaps it's time for a step feeding thread? I've read about it in mead making, rum making and now Mars' sugarwash.