Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

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stogie
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Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by stogie »

Absolute new guy here. I've read (and READ) many posts on this site (isn't HD great?!!). For reasons too boring to get into, my objective is to only work with 5-gallon (+/-) batches. I have been 'shopping' 5-gallon and 8-gallon units (of various configurations). However, I've seen it written in HD (several times!) that a minimum start-up should be 13-gal./3". So, my question to the group: can I run small batches (5-gal) in a 13-gal rig without losing anything? I understand the 'buy once-cry once' mantra of the site, but I seriously have no intention of growing into anything larger than 5-gal. Thank you~~~
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

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Alcohol has been made in a teapot. You can make any size you like.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by greggn »

NeilElliott wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 5:56 am I understand the 'buy once-cry once' mantra of the site, but I seriously have no intention of growing into anything larger than 5-gal.

There's nothing wrong with running an 8 gallon boiler if your charge is 5 gallons.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by still_stirrin »

NeilElliott wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 5:56 am Absolute new guy here. I've read (and READ) many posts on this site (isn't HD great?!!). For reasons too boring to get into, my objective is to only work with 5-gallon (+/-) batches. I have been 'shopping' 5-gallon and 8-gallon units (of various configurations). However, I've seen it written in HD (several times!) that a minimum start-up should be 13-gal./3". So, my question to the group: can I run small batches (5-gal) in a 13-gal rig without losing anything? <— Fermenter size doesn’t dictate boiler size. But, fermenting enough to charge your boiler 3 times will give you approximately a full boiler for the the spirit run. Conversely, if you only can ferment in 5 gallon fermenters, ie - carboys, then you could always use 2 or 3 to make enough.

A 13 gallon milk can boiler is a “nice to have”, and is a good size for a hobbiest, especially if you’re a new-to-the-hobby distiller. But, I’d suggest starting with a potstill head for the boiler before spending all the cash on a fancy reflux column and head. A potstill will give you the foundation for the process first.

Sometimes, newbies have more dollars than sense. Don’t be “one of those guys”.


I understand the 'buy once-cry once' mantra of the site, but I seriously have no intention of growing into anything larger than 5-gal. Thank you~~~<— This comment makes you sound a little “unteachable”. I hope that’s not really the case. Because you have a lot of learning ahead of you.
Have a look at the ginstill build hotlinked in my signature. It’s a 16 quart stock pot with a 1-1/2” potstill head. I heat it with a modified hotplate (the build is also hotlinked in my signature). The system is small and easily portable. And not too expensive to build either. I can run it in the kitchen. I usually make 2 liter of gin per gin run with it. I’ve even used it to rerun a gallon of whiskey low wines to clean them up a little more. A good size for small scale runs.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by Demy »

I have produced ben below those quantities, perhaps they are one of the members of the forum that produces less than all. For those quantities I don't think you'll have problems, just knowing how to manage what you have.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by Deplorable »

5 gallons is fine for a beginner still as long as you're doing close to 5 gallon spirit runs. You'll find it difficult to make good cuts on anything smaller.
I have a 13 gallon boiler/ 2inch still and routinely run 5-7 gallon spirit runs to net about 1.5g after selecting my blend.

If you elect to go with a 5 gallon boiler and internal element, be mindful of the placement of the element.

For a 5 gallon boiler, 1.5 to 2 inch diameter riser/column is plenty.
You'll need to run it slow to make good cuts anyway.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by stogie »

THANX for the speedy responses. I picked up some good info.

Re. "still-stirrin 'unteachable': not the case at all ....... I have LOTS to learn!! I just do not want to run anything more than 5-gallons at a time (whether I buy 13-gal, 8-gal or 5-gal. boilers). Make sense?
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by ShineonCrazyDiamond »

NeilElliott wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:57 am THANX for the speedy responses. I picked up some good info.

Re. "still-stirrin 'unteachable': not the case at all ....... I have LOTS to learn!! I just do not want to run anything more than 5-gallons at a time (whether I buy 13-gal, 8-gal or 5-gal. boilers). Make sense?
Not to me. How do you know what you want to do? Don't you think it's best to keep an open mind about something you have no real world experience in yet?

With that said, I started with a 5 gallon boiler and (3) five gallon buckets (HBS 6.5 gallon for head room). It was perfect as an intro - and all you ever NEED. Now, once you have a couple years under your belt and you start to know what you're talking about, you'll understand what you WANT. But for now there is no reason for us to try to convince you otherwise. Just remember - every 5 gallons of ferment gives you 1.5 gallon of low wines. When you run it a second time, you get maybe a quart of 65% to age for 6 months. 5 gallons to one quart to drink. That is assuming, of course, that you have a boiler that can run 1.5 gallons down to 1 remaining gallon in the boiler. How do you really think 1.5 gallon will fair in a huge 13 boiler? About enough to coat your lining. In short, you ain't getting nothing but a bottle, and you basically can only run on gas.

Now if you plan to do it right, you save up (3) stripping runs, for 4.5 gallons low wine, and get a gallon keeps. And maybe now your 13 gallon rig can get in the game. Maybe. Generally you build the boiler size for the amount of times you want to run whiskey in a year, and then get a ferment that is boiler size x3. For the exact above reason. I had to run my still 3 out of 4 weekends to get drinking stock. Now with 15 gallon, a few times a year. But if you did that, then your really just running any gallon ferment in 3 different buckets, and maybe at different times. But they are all part of the end product.

If you think 5 gallons will give you a "its beer, not mash" defense, you better think again.

Welcome, and enjoy the ride.

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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by rubberduck71 »

Welcome! +1 to what the veterans said above.

You'll see a lot of opinions on the build vs buy argument. If you're looking for a multi-purposed rig & good bang-for-buck, might I suggest the Kegland conversion kits? Here's a link to one site that from what I see has the cheapest price (& free shipping for over $100): https://www.williamsbrewing.com/Gifts-M ... ll-Package

They also have the reflux column for the same price. But depending on what you're into (whiskey = pot still; vodka = reflux), you could just get the other still head later. I have both & just interchange the heads on top of a 2' stainless column extension that I pack with copper mesh (attached to lid with $25 bulkhead attachment). You can be up & running w/ under $320 out of pocket ($250 for the unit + $70 in upgrades that make it modular). Can you build a better still for that money? Heck ya, but I didn't have the skills, tools, or the patience (HD veterans: you may fire when ready... :D )

You can heat your water, mash, & distill all in the same unit. Are there drawbacks? Yes, but they are minor in my opinion:
1. With that column extension, the whole riser can sway a bit (the lid wasn't designed for the extension), but I just stabilize it with some bungee cords to the ceiling joists.
2. There is no variable control for the heating elements, but you CAN run efficiently using the 500/1000W switches individually or together. Plus there are threads on here on how to wire up the higher one to an SCR contoller.
3. Is it as pretty or rewarding as a self-bit one? No, but it works!!!

Here's the link for a pic of it in action: https://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtop ... &start=450

Keep researching, read more, and make an informed decision on what's right for YOU.

The search function in the blue bar at the top of this page is your friend. Lean on the Tried & True recipes (SCD replied above, & his CROW bourbon is delicious! It's actually this weekend that his recipe in a 3L barrel will be gifted to my best friend who turns 50.)

Have fun, enjoy the ride!
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by stogie »

rubberduck:
Mucho thanx for the info. Re. your DigiBoil: If the heating element goes out (doesn't everything eventually?!) can it easily be replaced? As I read the info provided, the coils are welded to the bottom of the boiler. ]
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by rubberduck71 »

NeilElliott wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:12 pm rubberduck:
Mucho thanx for the info. Re. your DigiBoil: If the heating element goes out (doesn't everything eventually?!) can it easily be replaced? As I read the info provided, the coils are welded to the bottom of the boiler. ]
This is very true. I see 2 options if/when that happens:
1. Buy a new boiler ($160)
2. Drill hole on the side & slap in a water heater element (less than $50)

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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by stmaus »

Also note that the minimum startup is not 3". 2" is certainly very common, even amongst the old timers. And well-matched to anything 15G and under.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by Tummydoc »

Gotta second deplorable and shineoncrazydiamond. I started with a 5 gallon copper potstill. Because volumes are small cuts are difficult and the temptation is to keep less than great jars. My quality vastly improved when i built an electric keg still because cuts are easier to separate with larger volumes.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by IMALOSERSCUMBAG »

NeilElliott wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 5:56 am but I seriously have no intention of growing into anything larger than 5-gal. Thank you~~~
HeHe.... I said something similar once before. HONEST, there's no way in hell I'm going bigger than my 26 gallon boiler........

I should note, I started with a 1 gallon air still and thought that would do just fine. Got bored quickly but also learned and figured out what I wanted.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by still_stirrin »

IMALOSERSCUMBAG wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:04 am
NeilElliott wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 5:56 am but I seriously have no intention of growing into anything larger than 5-gal. Thank you~~~
HeHe.... I said something similar once before. HONEST, there's no way in hell I'm going bigger than my 26 gallon boiler........
:clap:

When your products are as good as (better than) “top shelf”, you’ll find that your close friends help you consume your products quite fast. Hence, the “need” for a bigger boiler.

Likewise, I used to have to purchase glassware to bottle into. Now, I get returning empties enough to fill such that my casks “struggle to stay full”.

Plus, I’m kinda’ getting used to the smells from active fermentation around the house.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by IMALOSERSCUMBAG »

What's funny is I made a batch I didn't really care for. Gave a bottle to a buddy and he loves it. Every now and then I do a run just for him. A bag of corn shows up in my garage and I get a shit eatin' grin from him.

I don't give out my good glassware unless it's for a special occasion. Those few that know, will bring an empty bottle over from time to time and it magically gets filled. At least I'm not the only one that has a collection of random liquor bottles.
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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by rubberduck71 »

IMALOSERSCUMBAG wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:04 am I should note, I started with a 1 gallon air still and thought that would do just fine. Got bored quickly but also learned and figured out what I wanted.
I'm same boat as you - started on the Airstill. Do you still use it, perhaps for running small batches of macerated neutrals for gin???

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Re: Slightly different approach to the "what should I buy?"

Post by IMALOSERSCUMBAG »

I use it to make distilled water. Sometimes I'll make a small 2 gallon experiment to play with but mostly to make distilled water.
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