How do the big producers make their cuts?

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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by stevea »

Background: I'm not a home distiller (something abt US laws - grrr) but I and a partner had an LLC (now defunct) worked ~3 years toward forming a larger scale whiskey distillery using a continuous still. My only interest is in whiskey, not azeotropic stuff.

Continuous Distillation: of course tails are in the "bottoms" fraction, but what of heads ?

The vid by Toxxyc, is at 'Still Austin' (Austin Texas) distillery. I've spoken to a former distiller/consulant there, to the still designer (Michael DeLevante (sp) Canada), and gotten a quote on a slightly smaller version of this still from Forthys Scotland. Spoke to their Forsyths' design team a few times. This is a 50ft tall, continuous still based on a rum distillation model (DeLevante's expertise). It was cleverly designed to be flexible enough to make anything from vodka to whiskey. Still Austin had many initial problems with the automated controls provided by a US engineering company, not Forsyths. I've also discussed the design with our consultant,. My from-a-great-distance vague opinion is that this still is a jack of all trades, master of none. I might change that opinion based on tastings. It's modestly more expensive compared to alternatives, very flexible, but it is VERY VERY tall making facility logistics terrible. Also not very power efficient. This still *could* remove heads from upper plates above the distillate-product plate, but I have doubts that they do this in practice while making whiskey.

==
Another continuous still that allows for head removal is Headframe Stills. They include a "barbet" column (also from rumtech) after the main separation. It is basically a simple column where the products is the heavy-key (hearts) and heads come off of the top of column as the light key. Some commercial vodka still use this methods as well.
https://headframestills.com/stills/
https://headframestills.com/wp-content/ ... -still.jpg
Copper bit at the left of pix is the barbet.

Some claim that the Headframe still can't produce a heavy-body whiskey. That matches my tasting of products, but doesn't prove "can't".

==
I've spoken with one guy who owns & operates a 12 inch Vendome continuous & the accompanying steam operated doubler. He claims that there is a vent pipe between the column & doubler, and that the hot condensed column product evaporates some heads up the vent. I've never seen such a vent on any drawing, but ...

===
As a rule large US whiskey is made using continuous columns and passive doubler and my observation at very large scale places, like MGPI, indicate absolute no heads separation. A passive doubler does an amazing job removing simple organic acids (formic, acetic, proprionic, butyric, isobutyric, valeric) compared to batch distillation or to a column alone.["Whisky Science, A Condensed Distillation",G.Miller]. Any heads removal from large-scale US whiskey happens during barrel aging.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by LWTCS »

I would implore you to try some of Adam Stumpf's whiskey.
He is Stumpy's Spirits.

You can indeed make a heads cut. In order to do so, you have to have a product take off port at the chosen plate level and pull product off as liquid.
Doing so allows for the low boiling point constituents more opportunity to reflash and continue upward and be vented off after the top dephlegmator that does require some precision fine tuning and a uniformly stable cooling media.

I would say that the continuous still is more specifically capable of mimicking a classic Armagnac still. Translation = very aromatic distillate.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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At scale running a continuous still you can pour off at any plate you like. and mix your "cuts" as they come off.
BUT At SCALE you can make thousands of barrels and pour and mix your final product to your recipe as well.

For a hobbyiest the closest to this I think we can reasonably achieve is to have a perpetual barrel.... A big enough barrel that you can be adding new make to it as you drink and sneak up on the flavor that you want over the years. Y
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:49 pm At scale running a continuous still you can pour off at any plate you like. and mix your "cuts" as they come off.
BUT At SCALE you can make thousands of barrels and pour and mix your final product to your recipe as well.

For a hobbyiest the closest to this I think we can reasonably achieve is to have a perpetual barrel.... A big enough barrel that you can be adding new make to it as you drink and sneak up on the flavor that you want over the years. Y
Or a solera.

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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by tiramisu »

Hmm, a solera of 500ml glassware in the basement. That seems like a very big commitment.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:49 pm A big enough barrel that you can be adding new make to it as you drink and sneak up on the flavor that you want over the years.
Thats how I’m using mine ATM tiramisu . Its never got mire than half full , I take some out and every so often get around to making some and top it up . Definitely getting better and better .

But not a process for commercial .
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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Yummyrum wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 10:57 pm
tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:49 pm A big enough barrel that you can be adding new make to it as you drink and sneak up on the flavor that you want over the years.
Thats how I’m using mine ATM tiramisu . Its never got mire than half full , I take some out and every so often get around to making some and top it up . Definitely getting better and better .

But not a process for commercial .
Is a 5 gallon barrel practical?
My scale is essentially a 50 gallon fermenter and a beer keg boiler.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by The Baker »

tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 10:31 pm Hmm, a solera of 500ml glassware in the basement. That seems like a very big commitment.
I am actually kicking that very idea around right now.
1500 ml glassware...
Dunno if it will happen.

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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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LWTCS wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 1:49 pm ....
You can indeed make a heads cut. In order to do so, you have to have a product take off port at the chosen plate level and pull product off as liquid.
Doing so allows for the low boiling point constituents more opportunity to reflash and continue upward and be vented off after the top dephlegmator that does require some precision fine tuning and a uniformly stable cooling media.
....
I had a brief online chat w/ Stumpy on another forum a while back. Stilldragon bits, and a plate or 3 above the D plate. Yes I'd love to try his product. Great guy too.
My quibbles - As I get farther into theory I realize it's not "low boiling point constituents" but relative volatility under column conditions; these are significantly different, tho' I get your point. The more practical concern is that unless you add ~15 plates above the distillate plate, that top product includes mostly ethanol. The practical consideration is that you can't commercially afford to throw away product from 2 or 3 plates above the whiskey draw. You need to ditch a fraction and re-cycle the rest to the in-feed of the continuous still (which is what I *think* Stumpy does)
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by LWTCS »

stevea wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 2:13 pm
LWTCS wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 1:49 pm ....
You can indeed make a heads cut. In order to do so, you have to have a product take off port at the chosen plate level and pull product off as liquid.
Doing so allows for the low boiling point constituents more opportunity to reflash and continue upward and be vented off after the top dephlegmator that does require some precision fine tuning and a uniformly stable cooling media.
....
I had a brief online chat w/ Stumpy on another forum a while back. Stilldragon bits, and a plate or 3 above the D plate. Yes I'd love to try his product. Great guy too.
My quibbles - As I get farther into theory I realize it's not "low boiling point constituents" but relative volatility under column conditions; these are significantly different, tho' I get your point. The more practical concern is that unless you add ~15 plates above the distillate plate, that top product includes mostly ethanol. The practical consideration is that you can't commercially afford to throw away product from 2 or 3 plates above the whiskey draw. You need to ditch a fraction and re-cycle the rest to the in-feed of the continuous still (which is what I *think* Stumpy does)
At the small commercial scale, recovering a few gallons to recycle back through the system really isn't that big of a deal when your talking about 4 barrels of finished product per shift.
I'm not sure if Adam has an analysis of what vents off as (vapor) heads? But I certainly would be interested to know. I'll ask him.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by Setsumi »

stevea wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 2:13 pm
LWTCS wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 1:49 pm ....
You can indeed make a heads cut. In order to do so, you have to have a product take off port at the chosen plate level and pull product off as liquid.
Doing so allows for the low boiling point constituents more opportunity to reflash and continue upward and be vented off after the top dephlegmator that does require some precision fine tuning and a uniformly stable cooling media.
....
I had a brief online chat w/ Stumpy on another forum a while back. Stilldragon bits, and a plate or 3 above the D plate. Yes I'd love to try his product. Great guy too.
My quibbles - As I get farther into theory I realize it's not "low boiling point constituents" but relative volatility under column conditions; these are significantly different, tho' I get your point. The more practical concern is that unless you add ~15 plates above the distillate plate, that top product includes mostly ethanol. The practical consideration is that you can't commercially afford to throw away product from 2 or 3 plates above the whiskey draw. You need to ditch a fraction and re-cycle the rest to the in-feed of the continuous still (which is what I *think* Stumpy does)
I would like to see this line of thought with Larry's liquid take off and heads vent revert to hobbyists/batch process. Yes, i know a vessel can be a heads trap on batch but is it the most efficient? As hobbyists a continuous still seems to require just too much in fabrication and opperation but the theory around take off, product flavour and waste management (heads in stevea's comment) but also tails as in 3 chamber stills and esters in rhum? retorts just beggs pushing.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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Good thinking Stevea.

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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by stevea »

tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:49 pm At scale running a continuous still you can pour off at any plate you like. and mix your "cuts" as they come off.
BUT At SCALE you can make thousands of barrels and pour and mix your final product to your recipe as well.

For a hobbyiest the closest to this I think we can reasonably achieve is to have a perpetual barrel....
"you can pour off at any plate you like ..."

Disagree. Nearly all practical commercial continuous columns have exactly ONE product take-off point. Examine the Vendomes or Barison designs. Yes, you COULD add a lot of plate diversions, like Still Austin/Forsyths, but carefully examine the vid. You'd want to be able to divert plates to 3 distinct destinations,; product/pot(recycle)/drain. Instead the Still-Austin has just one valve (2 destinations) . What does that say ?

" the closest to this I think we can reasonably achieve is to have a perpetual barrel"

I believe that big OEMs like MGPI Indiana include ALL heads in the barrel, and expect warehouse evaporation to eliminate heads in ~2-4 years. The product loss rates are roughly 6%/4%/4%/4% per year . Small-fry could do his w/ some patience.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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stevea wrote: Thu Oct 28, 2021 10:57 am
tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:49 pm At scale running a continuous still you can pour off at any plate you like. and mix your "cuts" as they come off.
BUT At SCALE you can make thousands of barrels and pour and mix your final product to your recipe as well.

For a hobbyiest the closest to this I think we can reasonably achieve is to have a perpetual barrel....
"you can pour off at any plate you like ..."

Disagree. Nearly all practical commercial continuous columns have exactly ONE product take-off point. Examine the Vendomes or Barison designs. Yes, you COULD add a lot of plate diversions, like Still Austin/Forsyths, but carefully examine the vid. You'd want to be able to divert plates to 3 distinct destinations,; product/pot(recycle)/drain. Instead the Still-Austin has just one valve (2 destinations) . What does that say ?

" the closest to this I think we can reasonably achieve is to have a perpetual barrel"

I believe that big OEMs like MGPI Indiana include ALL heads in the barrel, and expect warehouse evaporation to eliminate heads in ~2-4 years. The product loss rates are roughly 6%/4%/4%/4% per year . Small-fry could do his w/ some patience.
I swear I have seen craft manufacturer videos with continuous stills using multiple take-off points on their stills to take off product. Maybe I am confused..... I will go digging for confirmation.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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tiramisu wrote: Thu Oct 28, 2021 11:06 am
stevea wrote: Thu Oct 28, 2021 10:57 am
tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:49 pm At scale running a continuous still you can pour off at any plate you like. and mix your "cuts" as they come off.
BUT At SCALE you can make thousands of barrels and pour and mix your final product to your recipe as well.

For a hobbyiest the closest to this I think we can reasonably achieve is to have a perpetual barrel....
"you can pour off at any plate you like ..."

Disagree. Nearly all practical commercial continuous columns have exactly ONE product take-off point. Examine the Vendomes or Barison designs. Yes, you COULD add a lot of plate diversions, like Still Austin/Forsyths, but carefully examine the vid. You'd want to be able to divert plates to 3 distinct destinations,; product/pot(recycle)/drain. Instead the Still-Austin has just one valve (2 destinations) . What does that say ?

" the closest to this I think we can reasonably achieve is to have a perpetual barrel"

I believe that big OEMs like MGPI Indiana include ALL heads in the barrel, and expect warehouse evaporation to eliminate heads in ~2-4 years. The product loss rates are roughly 6%/4%/4%/4% per year . Small-fry could do his w/ some patience.
I swear I have seen craft manufacturer videos with continuous stills using multiple take-off points on their stills to take off product. Maybe I am confused..... I will go digging for confirmation.
You are not confused.
Multiple take off points are completely doable / done.
The issue is that once the flavor profile of the flagship whiskey (for example) is established, switching / swapping becomes a waist of time.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by Dancing4dan »

tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 11:01 pm
Yummyrum wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 10:57 pm
tiramisu wrote: Sat Oct 23, 2021 9:49 pm A big enough barrel that you can be adding new make to it as you drink and sneak up on the flavor that you want over the years.
Thats how I’m using mine ATM tiramisu . Its never got mire than half full , I take some out and every so often get around to making some and top it up . Definitely getting better and better .

But not a process for commercial .
Is a 5 gallon barrel practical?
My scale is essentially a 50 gallon fermenter and a beer keg boiler.
There has to be a math formula somewhere to calculate the correct barrel size based upon production and consumption rates! :D

Seriously though, I have been considering a larger barrel and doing what Yummy is talking about. Ongoing aging and pulling off a little to drink. Barrel on a roller stand.

I’m pretty sure my wife would give me “that look” though. :x
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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Dancing4dan wrote: Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:48 pm I’m pretty sure my wife would give me “that look” though. :x
My wife gives me that look every time I get a delivery.
The 2 50 gallon ptfe barrels delivered this week didn't make her any happier. :ebiggrin:
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by Oatmeal »

So the basic takeaway here, is that large distillers make their cuts with barrels? The barrel evaporates the heads, and then they select barrels to blend when making a final product?
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by stevea »

I reviewed Stumpy's vid and it looks like more than few gallons per 4bbl. Several 20l buckets are a 'tell'. It doesn't show recycling heads.


My opinions:
* tossing 10-12% of your EtOH as heads is not cost efficient at scale. You'd like to get the heads volume <2% of product volume.
* The odd placement of the doubler (before rectification) is peculiar. I'd want to taste that to see.
* 160pf (80%ABV) is the US TTB upper bound if you want to use the name "whiskey". At 79%(his 158proof) he's losing a lot of body and grain flavor.
* I am very concerned about the extremely high vapor velocity in 150mm rectification section @ 4bbl/day. This should decrease plate efficiency, but he's getting 79% ABV, so maybe he runs the doubler slower than the beer column rate (longer time).

I'd still like to taste it but ... The current whiskey offerings from Stumpy's are all labelled "Pot Distilled" and the website shows a ?Kothe? multi-column pot. DId they drop the continuous ? Or just use it as a stripper ?
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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So that video is an earlier iteration. Since that time Adam installed a larger HX at the top of the spirit column in order to get more control over the heads discharge. He dials it in so that there is a drip to broken stream. The example material in the video definitely would get recycled back into the beer well.

There is some thermal degradation that does happen because the spirit off of the dick is not at all headsy or astringent. Certainly very aromatic.
He puts it down for four years. I'm not sure if anything off of the continuous has been released yet? But the 3 month old off of that still is just as nice or potentially better than some of the 2 year old that he ran batch with.

As far as waste goes, only .05% goes down the drain and he has (at the time) decreased his operating expenses by 30%. Relative to the entire operational scope,,,,,rendering the actual distillate is cheapest part of the operation if you think about all of the line items associated with running a distillery. It's a 4 plate column with 3/4" in liquid beds and a a 50 gallon thumper that never gets more than half full.
It's just not that much material relative to the 265 gph beer feed rate over an 8 or 10 hour day.

"Odd placement of the doubler"? The system is set up from left to right, Stripper is left facing, low wines to the doubler on the right. Low wines that get deposited into the thumper are then distilled in a short column that sits directly on top of the thumper. Hold your hand over your left eye so that you cant see the stripper and the spirit side of the system look more or less like a batch system.

On the 158 ish proof, yeah he has since started collecting off of the 2nd plate rather than the 4th. Comes off at around 130.

He is going through an expansion phase with a big buildout now. He sold the 12" continuous system and bought a big ole retired copper rig from Belgium and refurbished it. The process flow will replicate the same design as the original 12".

Subsequent iterations of this design have seen some changes that include increased diameter beer feed circuit piping, larger product draw piping diameter, larger dephlegmators, larger low wines and bottoms HX and larger finished product condenser. The original ASPEN modeling called for 500,000 BTU/h. The upgraded HXs have likely reduced BTU usage to below 400,000. Though I still haven't heard if the piping sizes have done anything to increase output? I don't think it does? The system design as I understand it is predicated upon production of proof gallons. Meaning that it is not really about the ability to make it go faster or make it go slower. It is just set up to produce proof gallons weather the operator is collecting at 160 or 130.

With respect to some of the sizing upgrades, the original (prototype) did not run very well at all in manual mode. Meaning that without the PLC governing it's behavior it really needed to be watched to ensure compliant behavior. Since the upgrades mentioned above, the system seems to now run rock solid in manual mode as long as the cooling media to the dephlegmators remain uniformly consistent.
Boundry Oak Distillery in Radcliff, KY. runs this design and seems to be elated thus far.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by Setsumi »

A question to Larry and it is probably off topic but related to Stumpy's video.

Taking the process back to batch, in batch i can strip so i do not need a continious.... well i can do without the continious for now. On the retification he has a dephlegamater on the bottom, will a lentil do? And will it benifit the product as in wiskey and rum? The draw is liquid, but he has a heads draw as well. Earlier guys used to do LM for heads and VM for profuct, this is different but I can see the benefit of having a LM draw with a heads vent. Will it benefit batch process for flavoured products?
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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Setsumi wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 6:26 am A question to Larry and it is probably off topic but related to Stumpy's video.

Taking the process back to batch, in batch i can strip so i do not need a continious.... well i can do without the continious for now. On the retification he has a dephlegamater on the bottom, will a lentil do? And will it benifit the product as in wiskey and rum? The draw is liquid, but he has a heads draw as well. Earlier guys used to do LM for heads and VM for profuct, this is different but I can see the benefit of having a LM draw with a heads vent. Will it benefit batch process for flavoured products?

Hi Setsumi,
So the thing is that on the batch system, the constituents within the kettle will always be everchanging. There may be a window of opportunity early in the run to isolate and capture different profiles at each plate. But I feel that daylight at the window will consistently get more dim as the run progresses. Meaning that the resulting distillate will always run through its customary changes no matter what collection method is used.
Now having said that, I do think having a plate draw lower on the column with 1, 2, 3 or more plates above will provide a really interesting distillate as the liquid beds above continue to cycle and to put the liquid through some thermal degradation and in my view will install some beautiful aromatic qualities into the distillate that would otherwise not be there.

Defleg / separator on the bottom is not really going to have the same affect in batch mode compared to continuous feed. In batch it's better to let the gradient hold down tails.
You'd otherwise have to have some pretty sophisticated automation

Sorry, I'm not sure I answered your question?
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by Setsumi »

LWTCS wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 6:39 am
Setsumi wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 6:26 am A question to Larry and it is probably off topic but related to Stumpy's video.

Taking the process back to batch, in batch i can strip so i do not need a continious.... well i can do without the continious for now. On the retification he has a dephlegamater on the bottom, will a lentil do? And will it benifit the product as in wiskey and rum? The draw is liquid, but he has a heads draw as well. Earlier guys used to do LM for heads and VM for profuct, this is different but I can see the benefit of having a LM draw with a heads vent. Will it benefit batch process for flavoured products?

Hi Setsumi,
So the thing is that on the batch system, the constituents within the kettle will always be everchanging. There may be a window of opportunity early in the run to isolate and capture different profiles at each plate. But I feel that daylight at the window will consistently get more dim as the run progresses. Meaning that the resulting distillate will always run through its customary changes no matter what collection method is used.
Now having said that, I do think having a plate draw lower on the column with 1, 2, 3 or more plates above will provide a really interesting distillate as the liquid beds above continue to cycle and to put the liquid through some thermal degradation and in my view will install some beautiful aromatic qualities into the distillate that would otherwise not be there.

Sorry, I'm not sure I answered your question?
Thanks, indeed you have given me much to think on. I see what you mean with "run through customary changes" for batch as opposed to continious runs. I also appreciate the reference on lower plate draws, though it seems i will for now just stick with proven batch process. Please continue with the discussion, and pushing the theory in practice.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by stevea »

Thanks for the great info Larry. Yes multiple take-offs on a continuous still is very do-able, and has been done, but afaik you won't find it on any off-the-shelf continuous whiskey still. Certainly not Vendome nor Barison (rep'ed by Kinnek in N.America).
As far as waste goes, only .05% goes down the drain
Pretty sure you slipped a decimal pt, or else you mean heads only. Assuming the latter, Stumpy's 4bbl run has ~500LA so 0.05% means he's tossing 250ml Alc per run ???

But typical continuous op is to reflux 100% till stable - so there are foreshots. As Stonecutter suggests, big US whiskey distillers and Scottish potstillers collect head into the barrel. Of course both barrel age for years.
and he has (at the time) decreased his operating expenses by 30%. Relative to the entire operational scope,,,,,rendering the actual distillate is cheapest part of the operation if you think about all of the line items associated with running a distillery.
A continuous still will save ~30-40% of energy vs a pot, and will save labor time if properly instrumented. We designed and tested a model mashing system that was also very automated (low labor cost, modest energy saving). In that model [large scale craft 600-1000 bbl/yr], recurring costs barrel of bourbon or rye white dog (excluding the barrel) is ~$400usd. Still energy costs (heating & chilling; nat-gas & electric) is 17% of that cost. Distillation labor ~10%. A big cost of distillation is the sunk cost of capital; column, doubler, boilers, heat exchangers. As you suggest other costs add rapidly. A friggin' new empty barrel is now >$200usd! Grist ~$120. Angels swipe ~15-16% in 4 years. By the time that $400 of white dog is barreled, warehoused, aged, bottled, topped, labelled, cartonized/palletized, capital paid for, and taxed you'll have >$1700 in it.
"Odd placement of the doubler"?
Yes. See the diagram of a system Vendome below. The 4 rectification plates are in this case atop the beer column (labeled 16,17,18,19). The stuff coming off the column to the low-wines receiver is around barrel strength. The (steam powered, not passive) doubler in the lower right has no plates above, and acts to remove some of the small organic acids and a few other bits. Typical operation is that the doubler is pre-filled with a little water, and after the column operates for ~45min to an hour, the doubler is fired-up. Condensate off the doubler can go directly to barrels.

So normal is beer-column, rectification plates, doubler. Adam Stumpf (iirc the name) has it beer-column, doubler, rectification plates, and that's not typical.
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LWTCS
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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I have no response for the Vendome design. It's their IP.
To try and replicate their configuration would be in my view very bad manners indeed. I'm sure they would agree. At least if I were them I wouldn't be very happy about copy cats.
Adam's design has been vetted through ASPEN modeling firstly, and through practical application. This particular design is only a couple of years old and so it's not suprising that the examples you mention are not at all the same as Stumpy's.
Beyond that I have no opinion of Head Frame, Vendome , Forsyth or the like as I do have a dog in this hunt and do not want to come across as a used car salesman like that chap over there on ADI.

.05% is not an exaggeration though does lack some context. Heads does get vented over to a product condenser that is dedicated specifically for heads. Multiple drops per second to a broken stream is an adequate current description of the heads collection speed. Heads product from batch or continuous distillation with the capability to vent and collect heads would be considered a non keeper by many. Operators of traditional Armagnac stills might have something to say about heads however?
It matters not.

Sensory awareness by the still operator does not get put on the shelf. The thumper juice does get recycled back into the injection circuit. As time passes ( a week maybe?) it is the distiller's responsibility to determine at what point the thumper juice has accumulated enough undesirable constituents to warrant a discard. At that point the operator can easily trigger a pump down on the fly.

How much is keeper on batch? 70%, 60%, 50%?

Beer column effluent enters the Bottoms HX at about 229 degrees. Notwithstanding the fact that ethanol is infinitely miscible with water, there is little to no measurable amount of alcohol present at 229 degrees. And if there is, it is certainly not the variety of alcohol one puts in a finished bottle.
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

Post by fzbwfk9r »

LWTCS: you say you have a dog in the hunt.... I assume you have some affiliation with Stumpy.

Does he market in Canada?
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Re: How do the big producers make their cuts?

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He doesn't have direct distribution in Canada.
However there is online purchasing available.

Not sure what the issues ( if any) are with shipping across the border?
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