Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

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DenisZen
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Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by DenisZen »

I follow all the directions and wait until my yeast is stopped bubbling (2 weeks)and wait a few days for it to settle before I run it. And it seems that my out put is very low. The liqour is good but there isnt very much of it. Out of a 10 gallon run I didnt get but a gallon of good drinkable product. I am using a 5 gallon pot still on a hot plate and run it slow. Should I do a stripping run and then a spirit run or what I'm lost here I don't know what to do and I'm getting really frustrated with it.

I dont have a alcohol meter to test my abv and cant afford one due to my finances.

Does anyone have any suggestions?
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by seamusm53 »

It is difficult to answer your question without certain details like specific gravity before and after fermentation and proof of final product but rest assured that millions of gallons of good tasting spirits have been made by many thousands of distillers without those measurements. If you have gotten a 10% yield of what is good product by taste you should be proud of a good beginning. There are no shortcuts and I'd just advise to keep reading and practicing. Most all of us here look back at the swill we made at the beginning and wonder why we kept trying. You WILL get better though yields may or may not improve depending on your materials and equipment. Just don't give up.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by Salt Must Flow »

What recipe are you doing?

Yes, definitely do a hard, fast stripping run and collect until your total low wines reach 40% ABV. If you are making flavored spirits then put your low wines back into the pot still and do a spirit run slow and steady.

If you are making a neutral spirit then it's a bit different. A proof and tralle hydrometer is a necessity in my opinion. They're cheap and readily available. Without a spirit hydrometer you won't know when to stop stripping and you'll have a harder time diluting to your desired proof.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by Deplorable »

One gallon of drinkin likker from a 10 gallon run of what?
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by LWTCS »

PM your addy to me and I'll send you an alcometer. No strings.

Gallon of keeper from 10 gallon kettle charge seems like a lot to me.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by Salt Must Flow »

^^^ Paying it forward :clap:

I only have one right now. I think I've broke about one per year :crazy:
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by Wyododge »

Couldn’t he also throw his heads and tails back in his pot, dilute a bit and do a second run? Seems as though his heart cuts were passable. He’d know if he’s left anything in the pot. Would be good for him to know how he did on his first time out the gate.

I’m still a newbie puke so that idea and $1.58 will get you a warm coke and dirty look in the drive through.
It seems that discussions about alcohol percentage out of your still are remarkably similar to the MPG of your truck.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by Salt Must Flow »

Wyododge wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 6:12 pm Couldn’t he also throw his heads and tails back in his pot, dilute a bit and do a second run? Seems as though his heart cuts were passable. He’d know if he’s left anything in the pot. Would be good for him to know how he did on his first time out the gate.

I’m still a newbie puke so that idea and $1.58 will get you a warm coke and dirty look in the drive through.
Heads and hearts of what though? It appears he did a single run of a mysterious wash or mash with a pot still. No one knows, not even the original poster what the proof of his product is. Calling any product "passable" with zero information is merely speculation. Generally speaking, no distiller drinks their low wines. That is the situation we have here without any additional information from the original poster.
Last edited by Salt Must Flow on Wed Apr 06, 2022 7:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by Wyododge »

Salt Must Flow wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 7:06 pm
Heads and hearts of what though? It appears he did a single run of a mysterious wash or mash with a pot still. No one knows, not even the original poster what the proof of his product is. Calling any product "passable" with zero information is merely speculation. Generally speaking, no distiller drinks their low wines. That is the situation we have her without any additional information from the original poster.
I’m with ya 100%, I just figured he made cuts during his two runs. He stated his product was ok to him, thus the term ‘passable’. IF he made heads and tails cuts, and still has them, he could put them back in the pot dilute and re-run. If nothing else, it would be a good practice run. I’m assuming the guy diluted down to get a gallon, before drinking it, so he has to have something left in his pot (if he didn’t dump it) and his cuts (if he saved them).

Lots of assumptions I know, but if he didn’t make cuts and dilute before drinking it (the absolute bare minimum standard practice) he won’t be here that long anyway, so moot point I guess.
It seems that discussions about alcohol percentage out of your still are remarkably similar to the MPG of your truck.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by bcook608 »

Salt Must Flow wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 5:54 pm ^^^ Paying it forward :clap:

I only have one right now. I think I've broke about one per year :crazy:
That's not too bad! I had a bad week where I broke 3 in 5 days.... :oops:
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

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bcook608 wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 7:32 pm
Salt Must Flow wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 5:54 pm ^^^ Paying it forward :clap:

I only have one right now. I think I've broke about one per year :crazy:
That's not too bad! I had a bad week where I broke 3 in 5 days.... :oops:
I don't put them in the test cylinder until it's full. Don't drop it in. Ya, I have broken my share.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by 6 Row Joe »

You need a specific gravity hydrometer (not a proof and traille) . Measure before fermenting and after it is finished. It should be at 1.00 or below. Go to the distilling calculators and figure your alcohol content. You can then calculate a estimated yield.
Last edited by 6 Row Joe on Thu Apr 07, 2022 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by NormandieStill »

Either the alcometers in the US are flimsier or you guys go too fast! I've dropped one hydrometer (of any sort) in the 4 years since I started homebrewing, and that was one of the mini-alcometers which actually just bounced.

... and I realise I've probably just cursed myself with this post! :wink:
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by DenisZen »

first off I would like to thank everyone for their replies and their knowledge and especially LWTCS for being so kind and so awesome, man I love you guys ,you guys rock!!!

To answer the question my ingredients are...

For a 10 gallon run I usually prepare 15 gallons of water to the pH of 5

8 lb of cracked corn

10 lb of sugar

amylase

High abv yeast

Yeast nutrient.

I prepare the cracked corn by breaking it down to about five pieces per kernel and soaking it for a day or so in my ph5 water so that it does not soak up the water out of the pot.

I then cook the corn at @190° for about an hour and a half and then I let it start to cool and when it gets to be about 165 155 I throw my amylase in there and let it do its thing.

While I'm waiting for it to cool down I dissolve 10 pounds of sugar in about a gallon and a half of ph5 water. I then add the corn juice and the sugar water to my fermenter and allow it to cool to about 155 160 and I throw my nutrient and my yeast in.

I let it sit for about 2 weeks to make sure that it's totally done fermenting and then I use some bentonite clay to clear it and and I siphon off all of the clear and leave the cloudy at the bottom.

I have a two pot five gallon still with a rather expensive hot plate that I bought from a lab supply.

I put my mash in the pot and bring it all up to about a hundred degrees very slowly and once it's there then I slowly roll into it keeping a strict eyeball on the temperature.

I use about a half dozen mason jars to catch my distillate in so that I can capture it at different intervals to check it for consistency and taste.

Once I'm done distilling I take everything that I have captured that I deemed drinkable and mix it together and cut it down to where it tastes really good and is enjoyable to drink.

The rest of it I put in a jug for the next run.

I'm just wondering why I'm not getting that much return... From what I have read you can expect two and a half gallons out of a 10 gallon mash run... Does that sound right to you guys?
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by AppleWood50 »

Couple things.

You really need a spirit alcometer and a hydrometer.

You need the hydrometer to make sure all sugar has dissolved before pitching the yeast and to measure the SG and FG. If the wash isn't finished fermenting you can't properly clear it. An unclear wash that hasn't finished fermenting could be any abv and will produce more off flavours.

When making the cuts you need as spirit alcometer to check the abv of each jar. Because on the spirit run you could be tasting one jar that is 40% and another could be 80%. Hence you can't really decide what's good and bad to cut when the abv of the jars aren't similar or in the right range for tasting.

Also, it's not really safe to be consuming alcohol of unknown abv. You don't know what you are drinking

About a gallon of good stuff sounds pretty low for a 10g wash of about 12% ? Depends on your taste though. Some of us are definitely more picky than others on the cuts.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by jonnys_spirit »

I didn't take any measurements the last few batches. I mashed grains - added panela, and molasses. Let it ferment and clear for maybe six weeks (?) stripped each run to either 5 or 6 gallons low wines then spirit ran with low wines, feints from a previous run, and topped up with cleared beer/wash... Collected in fractions and made notes on the cut points.. Tested my chosen blend and made cuts for foreshots jug, feinte jug, and hearts jug... Once I had my hearts cut I measured ABV and proofed it down to 120 - That's the only time I measured anything but I did take that ABV measurement and I guess I measured the temp to mash in the malts... I probably could have estimated the proofing down but prefer to measure it for the desired oak and aging.... I've got one more spirit run in this series and i'll follow that approach...

I would still recommend getting a brewers hydrometer and a P&T Hydrometer...

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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by rubberduck71 »

DenisZen wrote: Thu May 12, 2022 11:04 am
8 lb of cracked corn

10 lb of sugar

amylase

High abv yeast

Yeast nutrient.
I'm not understanding using sugar AND amylase. Sugar IMO doesn't make as good a tasting of product as all-grain. That said, I DO indeed make sugarheads off "spent" grains to help keep my paws off the AG while it ages.

High ABV yeast -- do you mean Turbo? If so, ditch that for baker's, DADY, or any other yeast. Turbo will make booze, but $hitty tasting booze. I average ~2lbs grain/gallon of water & aim for 6-10% ABV. Higher than that will stress the yeast & create off-flavors. For us home hobbyists, it's about QUALITY, not quantity. And if you're lazy like me, check out Yellow Label Angel yeast -- NO mashing needed. Just chuck your grains in the bucket, top up with water to get to 95F, & pitch the yeast. Amazing stuff, although it's much pricier than "standard" yeasts. It has room temp enzymes & yeast.

As mentioned above, make 3x your boiler charge (5 gal pot, so 4 gal of liquid?) in fermenters. Strip each, water it down (if needed) below 40%, throw them all in boiler & do slow & steady spirit run. I've yet to taste anything good from a one-and-done run.
DenisZen wrote: Thu May 12, 2022 11:04 am While I'm waiting for it to cool down I dissolve 10 pounds of sugar in about a gallon and a half of ph5 water. I then add the corn juice and the sugar water to my fermenter and allow it to cool to about 155 160 and I throw my nutrient and my yeast in.
Maybe I read this wrong or perhaps you mistyped, but yeast dies above 120F. Pitch it under 100F. Dead yeast won't ferment.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by EricTheRed »

Example to put things into perspective.
135L ferment gives me
4 charges @10% of 23L stripping runs give me
30L low wines at 33% for the spirit run gives me
10L at 62% plus about 3L heads and tails.

You are a bit low, but you didn't mention squeezing the grains. Probably left a litre of product behind
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by SmokyMtn »

Adding sugar vs mashing is usually an either or choice, not both. For a wash, just melt sugar. No need in cooking the corn. You can even get by with cold water and just dump the sugar.

However on a all grain/amylase recipe, cook the corn. Leave out the sugar.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by DenisZen »

LWTCS wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 5:32 pm PM your addy to me and I'll send you an alcometer. No strings.

Gallon of keeper from 10 gallon kettle charge seems like a lot to me.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by DenisZen »

rubberduck71 wrote: Thu May 12, 2022 3:01 pm
DenisZen wrote: Thu May 12, 2022 11:04 am
8 lb of cracked corn

10 lb of sugar

amylase

High abv yeast

Yeast nutrient.
I'm not understanding using sugar AND amylase. Sugar IMO doesn't make as good a tasting of product as all-grain. That said, I DO indeed make sugarheads off "spent" grains to help keep my paws off the AG while it ages.

High ABV yeast -- do you mean Turbo? If so, ditch that for baker's, DADY, or any other yeast. Turbo will make booze, but $hitty tasting booze. I average ~2lbs grain/gallon of water & aim for 6-10% ABV. Higher than that will stress the yeast & create off-flavors. For us home hobbyists, it's about QUALITY, not quantity. And if you're lazy like me, check out Yellow Label Angel yeast -- NO mashing needed. Just chuck your grains in the bucket, top up with water to get to 95F, & pitch the yeast. Amazing stuff, although it's much pricier than "standard" yeasts. It has room temp enzymes & yeast.

As mentioned above, make 3x your boiler charge (5 gal pot, so 4 gal of liquid?) in fermenters. Strip each, water it down (if needed) below 40%, throw them all in boiler & do slow & steady spirit run. I've yet to taste anything good from a one-and-done run.
DenisZen wrote: Thu May 12, 2022 11:04 am While I'm waiting for it to cool down I dissolve 10 pounds of sugar in about a gallon and a half of ph5 water. I then add the corn juice and the sugar water to my fermenter and allow it to cool to about 155 160 and I throw my nutrient and my yeast in.
Maybe I read this wrong or perhaps you mistyped, but yeast dies above 120F. Pitch it under 100F. Dead yeast won't ferment.
Yes Im sorry I pitch yeast at the ideal temp. It was late at night and I misspoke.

I thought it was in these forums that I read " 5 gallons of water 5 lb of cracked corn and 5 lb of sugar" respectfully.

I don'tadd the amylase to the sugar I add it to the cooked corn. I wait until the corn and the amylase are done and then I let it cool down and I mix the two ( sugar water and corn juice) together and then I introduce the yeast and let it do its thing.

And dady yeast is what I use. A friend who started this distilling adventure with me, just gave me a packet of "still spirits" fast fermenting classic 8 turbo yeast that makes "20% abv" that I have been reading up on and I'm going to try.

And yes I have made a press out of an old car jack and a couple boards to squeeze every last precious drop out of the corn.

And I WONT EVER drop my meter into anything, I will slowly lower it into my test vessle and allow it to center itself and then release it. Like putting a baby in bath water.

I basically use the corn water to flavor the distillate as straight sugar wash doesn't taste very good to me either. Like a hybrid...

I will address all of the other posts when I get a chance I'm on my lunch break right now and just thought I would chime in. I will get to the other post though as soon as I can I promise.
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Re: Why is my total output so small in my pot still?

Post by armor99 »

DenisZen wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 11:56 am I follow all the directions and wait until my yeast is stopped bubbling (2 weeks)and wait a few days for it to settle before I run it. And it seems that my out put is very low. The liqour is good but there isnt very much of it. Out of a 10 gallon run I didnt get but a gallon of good drinkable product. I am using a 5 gallon pot still on a hot plate and run it slow. Should I do a stripping run and then a spirit run or what I'm lost here I don't know what to do and I'm getting really frustrated with it.

I dont have a alcohol meter to test my abv and cant afford one due to my finances.

Does anyone have any suggestions?
So first things first... what was your ABV of the wort after fermentation? If it was very low, it will explain why you did not get very much.

I ran 8 gallons of wort at 5.5%. And my first run for low wines netted me 2 gallons @ 20%. After the 2nd distillation, there was maybe 1.25 quarts total left.

One of the things I now understand about distilling is how utterly wasteful a process it is. In my latest run, I started with 12 gallons @6.3%, and after a second distillation, I have roughly 1 gallon of product to age.
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