Size of column

[Froggy]

Hi guys, I have decided I am going to have a go at building my own pot still.

Primarily the still will be used for doing strip runs, but later on I would like to start stilling rums and whiskeys.

I'll be using a 3 ring gas burner to heat the boiler and I would like to run it as hard and fast as possible when doing the stripping runs.
What I would like to know is what size column would be required to run hard and fast.
At the moment I have a meter of 2.5 inch copper tube available to use, but if required I can try and track down some 3 inch.

I'm sure I read on the parent site about how to work out the size of the column required, but I'm buggered if I can find it now.
Was anything like this on there, or am I dreaming?

Thanks

[hornedrhodent]

="Froggy"
Hi guys, I have decided I am going to have a go at building my own pot still.

Primarily the still will be used for doing strip runs, but later on I would like to start stilling rums and whiskeys.

I'll be using a 3 ring gas burner to heat the boiler and I would like to run it as hard and fast as possible when doing the stripping runs.
What I would like to know is what size column would be required to run hard and fast.
At the moment I have a meter of 2.5 inch copper tube available to use, but if required I can try and track down some 3 inch.

I'm sure I read on the parent site about how to work out the size of the column required, but I'm buggered if I can find it now.
Was anything like this on there, or am I dreaming?

Thanks

Are you getting reflux and pot stills mixed up? AFAIK The only reason you need a column on a pot still is to increase the surface area of copper in contact with the vapour and to stop any frothing of your wash from spewing over into your condenser. If you want to run it hard and fast - I'd be more concerned about the design of your condenser.

Make the column as big as you can with what you've got - use copper packing - it will help stop burping over and increase copper/vapour contact. Dont overfill your boiler and make your condenser as big as possible.

If you get coloured stuff coming over, or vapour out of your condenser - slow down a bit.
Hard and fast isn't necessarily the best - ask your woman.

[Froggy]

Nope, pretty sure I'm not getting the pot and reflux stills mixed up.

I believe Uncle Remus on these forums has a 3 inch column on his pot still.

From what I have read many times on here, if you want to run your pot still hard and fast, you need a larger column. The more heat the larger the column required.
Could be however that all the posts I read are incorrect. See what other people say here.

[Fretman124]

I built a potstill. Look for the post "built it myself"I don't have a lot of experience, but here goes.

I believe "tater" (moderator) runs only a potstill and he's been doing this a while. His still has a 1.5 inch column. 18 inches long

My still has a 2" column, 24 inches long, packed about 2/3 full with mesh. My condenser is a leibig type that is 48 inches of 3/4 inch copper with 40 inches of 3 inch PVC jacket. My boiler is a sankey keg, 15.5 gallons and I have a three ring burner

I can run the still as hard as I want and knock down all the vapor. I'm not understanding why you would want to run is as hard as possible, unless its to minimize the time running it. You can do a good stripping run running just a bit harder than a spirit run, and you get a better product in the end.

From all my reading, seems to me that you column can be just about anysize, but you condenser needs to be big enough to take the place of 20 or 30 feet of "worm". If it wasn't so expensive, I'd make mine 1.5 inch jacketed with 3 inch copper.

[Froggy]

Hi mate, thanks for you reply.

As you said, the only reason I want to run it hard is to cut down the time.

At the moment it takes me over 4 hours to run a 20 litre wash through my reflux still and at least an hour of that is waiting for it to get up to temp.

For the boiler I will also be using a 15 gallon keg. I hope to be able to fill this and strip it all in less time than it takes me to run 1 wash through the reflux still.
I'm not sure what I want to achieve is possible, but that's pretty well what I want to do.

I'll do a search for your thread and I'll have a read.

Thanks mate

[Ricky]

ive got a picture of my potstill under my potstill. the column is 3in and the coil condenser just barely does the job. take everyones advice and build a liebig condenser. wish i had. warmup is still going to be an hour to an hour and a half on a stripping run of 60 liters. the higher the % alcohol the quicker it will boil so for double run it wont take quite as long to warm up. i to was searching for the same thing and it is very easy to overpower your condenser. if i were you i would use the 2.5in you already have and use some of it for a short packed column and use the rest for the condenser. a 3/4in pipe through 2ft or better of the 2.5 in should do pretty good. you still will have more burner than you will need though. unless you are dead set on a copper sleeve for your condenser you can use pvc with a smaller copper pipe on the inside and save weight and money. do some reading on the parent site. it gets into the importance of coolant flow rate vs. volume . been a while since i read it but should help you make your decision on the diameter of your condenser and the size of your circulation pump if you use one. i wish you luck.

[knuklehead]

Strip runs are done to decrease the amount of wash, not to have a good product in the end. Keeping that in mind remember that the harder you run it the worse the output will be leaving more work for your reflux in the end. You don't really need any column at all in your potstill to do strip runs. If you put one in it is to increase purity. If that is not your concern then you don't even need it. Just come off the boiler with at least a 1/2" line into a coil in a bucket condenser. If you put in a 3" column but only have a 1/4 or 3/8" line coming off then you still won't be able to run it to hard. Also if you push it hard you'd need a strong clamp down system on the keg or the seal will leak because your creating more vapour then can escape through the tubing. So to sum up, to run the still hard the column won't really have any part in it. The line coming off the column will play a much more important role.

[Tater]

I do use a 18 inch coloum on my still . But holy doesnt heres a pic of a cap for a keg that reduces to 3/8 tubing. Think he wanted it for stripping runs. http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f136/ ... G_0012.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Froggy]

Hi guys, thanks for all your replies.

With the information you guys have supplied me, and that being the size of the column on a pot still not playing a large part in the still operation, I have decided to just make it at a height to be user friendly.

Now about the connection of the column to the lyne arm, at the moment I'm thinking of 2 ways to so this.
The first being the most common I have seen using a tee piece at the top of the column with a reducer to connect to the lyne arm allowing a thermometer to be mounted in the very top.
The second is using a reducer at the very top of the column and then have a 90 degree elbow to the lyne arm. The only down side to this is not being able to have the thermometer at the top.

Do any of you guys recommend one of these options over the other?

Thanks again

[theholymackerel]

What most folks call a potstill does not have a column.

Tater runs a "potstill" with a column. It's just a tiny column (1.5X18 in) so maybe we could call it a "modified or hybred" potstill. He does this cause he likes to do just one run.

I allways do two runs for three reasons. First I use a traditional potstill (no column, just a boiler, layne arm, and a coil in a bucket) so that means my rig operates at what the column still distillers would call "one theoretical plate". I need to do two runs to get to a good abv% for the distillate of the stuff I like to make (rums, whisk(e)ys, and brandies). My second reason for runnin' everythin' twice is because I typically ferment low abv% washes/mashes. The majority of the washes I ferment are 8 or 9 % abv (higher for rum washes), and my whiskey mashes are often as low as 5 or 6% abv.

The third and main reason I double distill is that usin' a traditional potstill, and double distillin' is as easy as fallin' off a rock. If ya start with good ingredients, and and double distill with a traditional potstill, yer just about guarenteed good results.

Before Uncle Remus made his potstill (no column), he was usin' a reflux column to make traditional potstill drinks like rum, brandy, and whiskey. This can be done, but it's harder with a reflux column, and it's easier to miss the perfect "cut". I told him how easy it was to make great whiskeys with a potstill and how much easier the cuts were. I don't think he believed me at first. Hehe. But he was open minded and made a potstill and found out for himself.



I've allways said that the ultimate setup for a home distiller is to have both a reflux column still to make vodka, and a pot still for the traditional potstill drinks. You know... the proper tool for the job and all that.






Well... I hope ya figure out what's best for you, and I wish ya luck.

[Froggy]

Thanks for your reply mate, You have stated something that really has my interest now, and that is making easy cuts from a pot still. Once I start making my own rums and whiskeys I hope to learn a lot more about this subject.

I agree 100% about the ultimate setup being both a pot still and a reflux still. This is exactly what I want to do.

I have found that if I put a stripped wash in my reflux still, the cut points are so obvious its almost too easy. So as soon as I can, I would like to strip all my washes before they go through the reflux, and this is the first reason for the pot still.

I might be mistaken, but I thought Uncle Remus was using a column on his pot still. Infact, here is one of his pictures:



Am I wrong if I call that a column? This is pretty much what I would like to do just so that I can get the condenser up above my collection containers on the table.

[Fretman124]

now thats a purdy still.........

[theholymackerel]

I think that "column" is empty.

If I remember right he's also runnin' a decent sized boiler off of propane. That makes the fat short empty "column" give little to no reflux... basically part of the layne arm.

Uncle Remus... can you hear us? (Sorry, but I can't pass up nada Zappaesque.)

Tune in Unk Remus, and let us know if yer "column" comin' off of yer potstill boiler is packed or empty. Give us the low down on yer experience of distillin' the traditional potstill brews. How do cuts work for ya potstill vrs reflux column?

[possum]

The verticle tube is a column if it is packed with raschig rings, or structured copper mesh, or scrubbers,mainly for the purpose of inducing reflux ( and to be an effective column it needs some condenser at the top, even if it is air cooled). Otherwise, it is a vertical tube, just an oddly shaped cap that helps avoid overboil and puking, and increased copper surface to pull out sulfur compounds.

[Froggy]

I'm sure I have read on these forums a few times that just having mesh in your column isn't enough to cause any noticeable reflux.

I believe it was Uncle Jesse that had tried his pot still with and with out packing. I think he also stated that with the extra copper packing he found the product to be better quality.

I'll try and find the thread.

[Husker]

possum
The verticle tube is a column if it is packed with raschig rings, or structured copper mesh, or scrubbers,mainly for the purpose of inducing reflux ( and to be an effective column it needs some condenser at the top, even if it is air cooled). Otherwise, it is a vertical tube, just an oddly shaped cap that helps avoid overboil and puking, and increased copper surface to pull out sulfur compounds.

Agreed. Even if the "oddly shaped" cap (as you so put it), is packed with structured copper, it is still not a refluxing apperatus (at least very little reflux. Once it heats up, the vapor will simply push through it, around the left turn, and down the condensor. However, when packed, it greatly increases the copper surface area, to help clean up any stinks from the mash.

If you look at many of the larger whiskey stills (especially the scotch stills), they have a VERY large column out the top, which does a 100° bend into the condensor (much like UR's).

H.