2" CCVM Design

Vapor, Liquid or Cooling Management. Flutes, plates, etc.

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nick9one1
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2" CCVM Design

Post by nick9one1 »

I've done quite a lot of reading on here over the last few days and have settled on a 2" CCVM still with a shotgun condenser.

I 'think' I understand at least some of the more important concepts around building this still. But would appreciate some input on ide column lengths, condenser size, shotgun size.

This is what I have so far;

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Sporacle
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Sporacle »

20 x column diameter and I run a 500mm shotgun with 4 by 1/2 inch on a 50 L keg with 4kw, reflux is as per hookline, works well
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Iulistoi »

If you use that condenser just for the column in reflux mode, it is an overkill to build a shotgun. A liebig will do the job greatly and it's easier to build. Shotgun have a huge knock down power and you never need it for condensing high alcohol concentration vapors. Additionally, the usual take off rate for a 2 inch column is between 1 and 2.5 liters per hour.

A liebig is more suitable and easier to build. One meter jacketed length can knock down vapors from 6 kw power in pot still mode.

I would go for 1.2 to 1.5 meters packing length for a good neutral, depending on the space to the ceiling available. The type of packing is also important, some packings having smaller HETP than other, so more theoretical plates for a given length than others.
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Deplorable
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Deplorable »

You're on the right path.
The length of the outer shell on the shotty should be 21 inches and you inner vapor tubes will be 20, unless you want your inner tubes flush with the ends of your ferrules.
Go a little longer on A. Depending on what you choose for packing you may need/want the extra height to get clean 95% at a reasonable speed.
I'd make the lyne arm just long enough so that if you only run a short length of riser as a pot still your shotgun end still clears the side of the boiler when pointed straight down, but that's just me and not a necessity.
On electric there is no need to fuss with a leibig. You'll have a constant vapor speed with a 4× 1/2" tube shotty, and 2" vapor path.
Make all your column sections the same length as your shotty and everything will break down and fit inside your boiler for storage if you plan your boiler openings properly.
RC jacket just needs to be short enough to ensure you get full reflux in the down position, and long enough that you can raise the RC high enough to get your offtake open wide enough to reach a reasonable takeoff speed.
For my 11" single coil RC, the housing is 6" tall. I have plenty of knockdown for the power applied to pull neutral at 1 liter per hour. Any faster, and I pull flavors.
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Stonecutter
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Stonecutter »

+1 Deplorable.
From what I saw of other builds I put an 8” extension on top of my tee so that the total distance from top of column to bottom of horizontal tee opening is 12”. It looks like you have a total of 12” from top of column to top of horizontal tee opening. I hope that makes sense. My understanding is that your coil needs to extend to the bottom of that tee opening in order to stop the vapor from making it to the PC. Then you adjust takeoff rate by raising the coil to let the vapor through. I could be wrong though as I’m new to the ccvm game
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Tummydoc »

12 inches is overkill. I add a 6 inch tube to the top of my stainless 2 inch t and thats fine for CCVM. My column is two 24 inch copper tubes, everything is triclamp and modular. I woudnt have ceiling space for a 12 inch tube over the T. My boiler sits on a harbor freight furniture dolly so its mobile.
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by bunny »

nick9one1 wrote: Sat May 14, 2022 3:20 am I've done quite a lot of reading on here over the last few days and have settled on a 2" CCVM still with a shotgun condenser.

I 'think' I understand at least some of the more important concepts around building this still. But would appreciate some input on ide column lengths, condenser size, shotgun size.

This is what I have so far;

Image

Please talk me through your decision making process to choose this style of packed column product collection over the others. :)
nick9one1
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Re: 2

Post by nick9one1 »

Tummydoc wrote: Sat May 14, 2022 6:25 am 12 inches is overkill. I add a 6 inch tube to the top of my stainless 2 inch t and thats fine for CCVM. My column is two 24 inch copper tubes, everything is triclamp and modular. I woudnt have ceiling space for a 12 inch tube over the T. My boiler sits on a harbor freight furniture dolly so its mobile.
Thanks. I'll redesign with 6 inches above the tee. I think the design I was copying had a much larger column and more powerful boiler.
nick9one1
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by nick9one1 »

Deplorable wrote: Sat May 14, 2022 5:31 am You're on the right path.
The length of the outer shell on the shotty should be 21 inches and you inner vapor tubes will be 20, unless you want your inner tubes flush with the ends of your ferrules.
Go a little longer on A. Depending on what you choose for packing you may need/want the extra height to get clean 95% at a reasonable speed.
I'd make the lyne arm just long enough so that if you only run a short length of riser as a pot still your shotgun end still clears the side of the boiler when pointed straight down, but that's just me and not a necessity.
On electric there is no need to fuss with a leibig. You'll have a constant vapor speed with a 4× 1/2" tube shotty, and 2" vapor path.
Make all your column sections the same length as your shotty and everything will break down and fit inside your boiler for storage if you plan your boiler openings properly.
RC jacket just needs to be short enough to ensure you get full reflux in the down position, and long enough that you can raise the RC high enough to get your offtake open wide enough to reach a reasonable takeoff speed.
For my 11" single coil RC, the housing is 6" tall. I have plenty of knockdown for the power applied to pull neutral at 1 liter per hour. Any faster, and I pull flavors.
Thanks! Lots of good tips there. I will redraw the design to include your recommendations.
nick9one1
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by nick9one1 »

here is V2

Changes I've made are;
the RC housing is shorter - 8" from top the the Tee opening, so an 8" RC will completely cover the opening.
Tri clamps added
Lyne arm longer so shotgun clears the boiler

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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Sporacle »

:D That's looking good, so you could attach a coppper 90 at point C and then add a 45 and a half inch tube at the end of your shotty to get your product where you want it. That would save two ferrules and a tri clamp. Just for me C to D is a couple of layers that could be simplified for economy.
Looking good though :thumbup:
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Iulistoi »

received_550787562564201.jpeg
My "B" section is 40 cm. The reflux condenser is 40 cm too. It is made of 10 m pipe, 6 mm diameter, double coil. I used a 22 mm pipe to coil around the small pipe then I turned back the coils .
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by kimbodious »

Just put ferrules and a triclamp from the tee to the elbow, replaces C. That way you can angle the product condenser etc away from the boiler.
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Deplorable »

kimbodious wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 1:01 pm Just put ferrules and a triclamp from the tee to the elbow, replaces C. That way you can angle the product condenser etc away from the boiler.
You can do it that way, but if you're just running it as a pot still and you want to run the shotty vertical, it wont clear the side of the keg. Having a little horizontal length wont hurt anything and just makes the set up a little more versatile. I added about 3.5 inches to my T so that when everything is assembled I can lower the shotty to vertical and it clears the edge of my milk can. Its handy when I dont want to break it all down. I just lower the shotty, and toss a drop cloth over it and push it in the corner.
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nick9one1
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by nick9one1 »

After further reading I think the length of the shotgun might be overkill.

The boiler is 6kW max but will be switched down to 4 or 2kW during the run, and controlled with a SSVR.

I've seen other builds using 12" shotguns on a 2.5kW boiler.

But I suppose it's better to be too long than too short.
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by kimbodious »

Easy as.
4DB288EA-9544-435A-95D2-99FDB59CB073.jpeg
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Re: 2" CCVM Design

Post by Sailman »

nick9one1 wrote: Mon May 16, 2022 12:17 am After further reading I think the length of the shotgun might be overkill.

The boiler is 6kW max but will be switched down to 4 or 2kW during the run, and controlled with a SSVR.

I've seen other builds using 12" shotguns on a 2.5kW boiler.

But I suppose it's better to be too long than too short.
If you plan on doing any stripping runs then you will appreciate the length of the condenser.
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