Bokakob 2" mini-still column

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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Azframer » Fri Nov 12, 2010 2:56 pm

What Rad is saying is that saw will miter, it will not bevel.?
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby crazyk78 » Fri Nov 12, 2010 7:27 pm

Yes you are right Rad. You can only angle from side to side not top to bottom which is needed.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Azframer » Fri Nov 12, 2010 7:45 pm

I am thinking about building this, any chance I could use a slide compound miter saw for this with a thin kerf blade?
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby rad14701 » Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:26 pm

Azframer wrote:I am thinking about building this, any chance I could use a slide compound miter saw for this with a thin kerf blade?

Yes, a compound miter saw will allow the "beveled" cut you need... Hopefully you'll be able to find a thin enough blade... Band saws also work well if you have a blade that can handle copper...

Thanks, AzFramer, for posting the word that was eluding me... I was having a mental midget moment and I was trying to find it in the miter saw descriptions... It's been a long week...
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Azframer » Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:44 pm

Well Rad it happens to the best of us. I got so many tools just sitting idle that I have 2-3 of, I was thinking of selling some so I can get the parts to make a build. I got 3 Hitachi framing guns and 2 roofing guns same brand. Hell I am 46yrs old and nothing will be happening around here for a while, I'm used to run 4-5 guys out of my tool box. Not sure that will happen again until this economy picks up.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Usge » Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:55 pm

Ya...I get it rad. You are right. Back to the drawing board with that one. They don't make bevel hacksaw miters. I've got a feeling I'm going to be winging this freehand in the end with either the dremel or the hacksaw. If I had capability to bevel cut wood accurately for a guide...I'd just as easily be able to bevel cut the copper in the first place.

Having trouble making sense of the template in another regard. There are 2 strips that show the intersection of the plates and overlap of 1/4". Then there's the quadrant/full cut template. The issue I'm having is they don't seem to agree with each other. The intersection one shows accurate dimensions of the plate at the suggested angle. It says...its' also accurate as to height (ie., place this at the top of the plate ..or where you want the top of the plate to be etc.). But, it doesn't seem to provide proper full angle for the cut....even though it accurately displays dimension/length of the plate. Further, I can't seem to align or combine the 2 in any way that makes sense.

So, do you just use the full (quadrant) template for the cuts..then use the other one to find depth? Or are they supposed to line up in some way?

Not making much sense....and I'd at least like to have some kind of guide before I go hacksawing on it :)
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Azframer » Fri Nov 12, 2010 9:10 pm

If you are using 2" pipe you should be able to find 3 of the 4 quadrants with a framing square and a torpedo level marking top and sides with @ 1". For 30 degrees you would be 9/16" lower at CL of pipe.
Edit= your pipe should be level to find quadrants.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Usge » Sat Nov 13, 2010 8:11 pm

Ok...when in doubt..jump in with both feet and just use more solder :) Anyway, got it done tonight...frankenstein style...but it's done. It wasn't pretty, but everything lined up properly and I think I finished up a proper boka! Free handing a hack saw on this didn't work out well. It cuts good with one blade, but is very hard to control the angle, and even more difficult to watch both sides as it cuts at once. (pitch was off, one side looked good, back side was off, etc). It also leaves the slot far to thin. Using 2 blades is even harder: it doesn't cut well and was just as hard to control. But the dremel tool turned out to be the shitznit just as soon as I got a template taped up good and found the right disc/speed to use.

I used 2 copies of the bottom curve template overlayed on top of each other. Place the top one and tape it in place. Then, cut the 2nd one close to the curve (so it doesn't cover the one under it). Use the dotted quadrant lines to line them up and make your bottom/take off plate curve. Measure the bottom one to be .75" below the other and tape it in. Although the middle template showing the gap was helpful to see..I didn't use it..as it does not show the full apex of the curve you are going to have to cut. So, just use the bottom template (full curve with dotted lines for quadrants) and overlap them...cut as needed.

Once it was taped on, I used the printed quadrant (dotted) line in the middle on both sides to make your end/stop notch. Just go 1/8" past the middle quadrant line for each plate and put a mark there. That's your stop point along the curve so that it will give you the recommended 1/4" plate overlap.

While your template was still taped to the column, I used the alignment of it to mark the therm well port and take off port for drilling. *TIP: Drill these holes "before" you install any plates :oops:

I also annealed the tip on the take off plate that was to be bent down before I put it in. TIP: (repeated from earlier) Don't bend it before you install it. And install it (the bottom plate) FIRST. Then use a long rod to push it down, and in so that it points straight down.

I used a new model dremel at 15K rpm with re-enforced cutting disc...the black ones. It helps to score the line before you are going to cut it, but it's not necessary. It leaves the slot a little ragged, but it cleans up fine with a file and a little solder will fill in any small spaces/uneven areas.

I cut the basic shape of the plates with metal shears..using the flat edge of copper plate I had for the front/leading edge (ie., so it was straight). They fit firmly in the slot...I soldered them in, then filed down the protruding areas with a large flat file until it was flush. Then touched up solder for any holes/gaps, etc.

Like I said...it ain't pretty, but everything lines up proper. I've got rest of what I need to complete the head (valve, etc). Still have to wait on my boiler (backordered). But, in the meantime....I'm off to mock up a 2" potstill head. Cheers!! Usge finally gets a boka!
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Braz » Sun Nov 14, 2010 6:16 am

Looks pretty good to me. Good thinking on anealing the bottom plate before bending the tongue down.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Usge » Tue Nov 16, 2010 9:10 am

btw, here's a revised 2" template that I made from the previous one that simplifies everything and takes into account all the various suggested mods and other attributes mentioned along the way — both curves on "1" sheet already aligned and spaced .75" apart, cutting stop points on both curves for proper .25" overlap, drill points for take-off and therm well tube, separate upper and lower plate templates with an extended, pointed tip for the lower plate. Just make sure to print it at 100% (without any scaling) so it comes out proper size.

BokaTemplate_rev.pdf
2" Revised Boka Template
(19.01 KiB) Downloaded 25582 times
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby hoody » Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:24 am

Usge, I pretty much done exactly as you did. I too was a little confused with the original template's, so good on you for making some clearer one's!
Nice work on the build by the way, looking good.
What size thermo port have you used and how are you planning on "sealing" your probe?? That's the little "issue" i'm trying to sort out at the moment.

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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Usge » Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:31 am

Hoody, I'm using standard 1/4" nominal rigid tube for both the take off and them port....instead of the 1/4" OD coil I used for the reflux condenser. I have a digital therm probe..and my plan is to use cork to seal it with.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Azframer » Wed Nov 17, 2010 8:07 am

Looks nice man!
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Stimson » Fri Nov 26, 2010 2:08 am

i have made a bokakob with the top condessor section removeable from the column section. Have been using it successfully for 12 months now.
Can we use this style of still for stripping runs? Can I leave the column attached with packing in place and just open the valve wide open?
or do i just attach the condesor section direct to my boiler without the column section?
or do I just need to make a pot still attachement?

Only want it for stripping runs at the moment. No pot stilling....
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Braz » Fri Nov 26, 2010 5:08 am

Any of those options would work. But, you are likely to get some reflux if you are knocking down more vapor than the valve can handle even wide open. For that reason I think I'd either remove the packing or maybe substitute a short (maybe 12") pipe in place of your reflux tube.

I went with option three and built a separate pot head with a liebig condenser.

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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby lordmango » Tue Dec 28, 2010 6:36 pm

Hi!

I'm concidering making one of these columns. Only difference is that my condenser is being made out of 3/8'' instead of 1/4.
The copper pipe I'm going to use for the column itself is going to be about 24inches high and 1.6 inch (42mm) wide.

The boiler I'm making is pretty small compared to what you guys are used to I guess, since it's only about 6 gallons.

Now comes the thing I'm not quite sure about: How many watts should the heating-element I'm going to solder in be on? I've heard alot of guys saying I should have at least 1000W, some even say I should have at least 2000W, but I'm not sure about this. Anyone have another opinion?

Greets, LordMango.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby The Baker » Tue Dec 28, 2010 7:02 pm

So THAT's what a Dremel tool is!

I wonder of you can get them in Australia; I could give one to my son as a present.

Who knows what I (!!) could do with it!
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Austin Nichols » Tue Dec 28, 2010 8:12 pm

The Baker wrote:So THAT's what a Dremel tool is!

I wonder of you can get them in Australia; I could give one to my son as a present.

Who knows what I (!!) could do with it!


Your local Bunnings will have them, or most other hardware stores.

Cheers.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Usge » Tue Jan 25, 2011 8:57 am

Just wanted to follow up with couple more observations since my build.....definitely....use smaller 1/4" (OD) tube for temp probe side. I used 1/4 (nominal) cause that's what I had. But, it requires somekind of fitting plug to snug the temp probe, keep it oriented properly and stop it from leaking. The 1/4 OD tube is just about perfect for most temp probes....fits like a sleeve. And it's just close enough to be able to seal it with a few wraps of teflon tape. If you're like me, and used this larger tubing...I used a reducer to go from 1/4" to 1/8" nominal (that's 1/4 OD). And then I filed the fitting stop out..and pushed a 1/4 OD tube down through the middle and soldered it in so just the tip of the therm probe was exposed. That made it easy to seal it up.

Another tip if you plan on using this design in potstill mode: It came to my attention "after" I built this...that if you intend to run one of these in potstill mode, it may require a little extra attention on the take off side.... particularly if you've used 1/4 OD tube for the take off as most commonly indicated for these builds. Basically, because of the additional flow-rate when running in potstill mode...it tends to flood the plate because the small tubing (and valves) can't flow enough to keep up with higher flow-rates and it backs up, floods the plate and overflows back into the pot...giving more reflux than you probably want/intend. The solution to that is to run larger diameter tube, 1/4 (nominal) at a minimum, and additionally to perhaps have a way to remove the valve and attach straight tubing (or tubing with liebig). You could also use even larger (3/8 or 1/2") tube and valves to start with to get more flow, but I would guess that might be at the expense of some of the finer control that the smaller tube/valve gives when running in reflux mode. (I'll let others who run these on their boka's chime in to tell of their experience on whether that makes a difference or not). If your intend is to always run in reflux mode...the original design of 1/4" OD tube for take off/valve is fine. But, if you intend to have the option to do strip runs or run in potstill mode, you might want to adjust these plans for a larger OD take off.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Eth&All » Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:40 pm

Well, well, well! After being away from this group for 5 years+-, I was so happy to see that folks are STILL using my PDF template (or some variation of) to build Bokakob's great little still. I read some posts where a few builders were a bit confused by how to use the templates, so I'll check in periodically to see if there are any questions or any way I can help.
I originally drew that in ArcView (GIS software - not CAD) and it served my purposes. I didn't get Alex's approval, but sure he didn't mind as long as folks were building his design. Just for the record: Alex did not do the drawings. If anyone would like to get a copy of the Arcview 3.2 project (.apr) that the PDF was generated from...I can probably accomodate them. I should have put another page in the PDF that explained some things...
Take care and I'm so happy to see someone get some use from the template.

I believe that my coil winding instructions are still around here someplace in this forum as well (I know they're on the main homedistiller.org page). There's more notes for that too.

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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby duracell » Wed Feb 02, 2011 12:45 am

Anyone else have opinions about substituting a 3/8" take off for the original 1/4" take off that most use?
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Austin Nichols » Wed Feb 02, 2011 1:34 am

xoltri wrote:Anyone else have opinions about substituting a 3/8" take off for the original 1/4" take off that most use?


When I built my first boka I did, but only so I could run it flat out as a pot still for stripping runs, I felt that 1/4 might restrict the flow and cause unwanted reflux in stripping/pot still mode.

As long as you got a good quality needle valve it will be fine with a 3/8 take off.

HTH 8)
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby rad14701 » Wed Feb 02, 2011 10:19 am

xoltri wrote:Anyone else have opinions about substituting a 3/8" take off for the original 1/4" take off that most use?

With my LM column I need to remove the 1/4" needle valve and replace it with a straight through connector for pot still stripping mode... If I don't I end up with enough reflux to pull ~80% for almost the entire run and lose most of the flavor...
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby duracell » Wed Feb 02, 2011 1:01 pm

Thanks, I decided to go 3/8" for the takeoff and I bought this needle valve:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0285676795
(Parker 3/8" Stainless Steel Needle Valve 4Z-V6LN-SS)

I'll need some stainless npt to compression adapters but I think it should work, and it was only $27 shipped compared to over $130 local. This one should work, right?
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Usge » Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:32 pm

Eth&All wrote:Well, well, well! After being away from this group for 5 years+-, I was so happy to see that folks are STILL using my PDF template (or some variation of) to build Bokakob's great little still. I read some posts where a few builders were a bit confused by how to use the templates, so I'll check in periodically to see if there are any questions or any way I can help.
I originally drew that in ArcView (GIS software - not CAD) and it served my purposes. I didn't get Alex's approval, but sure he didn't mind as long as folks were building his design. Just for the record: Alex did not do the drawings. If anyone would like to get a copy of the Arcview 3.2 project (.apr) that the PDF was generated from...I can probably accomodate them. I should have put another page in the PDF that explained some things...
Take care and I'm so happy to see someone get some use from the template.

I believe that my coil winding instructions are still around here someplace in this forum as well (I know they're on the main homedistiller.org page). There's more notes for that too.

Eth&All
(was surprised to see my login info was still good after all this time!)


It was a great help to have your original template in building my first boka. I was having trouble getting it taped up on my tube properly, measuring out the gap between, overlap, etc. So, I just made a one piece version so it would be easier to wrap/tape it in one shot. It helped me visual what was needed to do. A great help. Thank you!! :)
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Usge » Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:38 pm

xoltri wrote:Thanks, I decided to go 3/8" for the takeoff and I bought this needle valve:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0285676795
(Parker 3/8" Stainless Steel Needle Valve 4Z-V6LN-SS)

I'll need some stainless npt to compression adapters but I think it should work, and it was only $27 shipped compared to over $130 local. This one should work, right?


If it's threaded, you can get copper threaded ends to solder on your 3/8" copper tubing and screw both ends into the valve..rather than using compression fittings/adapters. The threads probably a little more reliable if you are going to be taking it on and off.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby duracell » Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:44 pm

Usge wrote:If it's threaded, you can get copper threaded ends to solder on your 3/8" copper tubing and screw both ends into the valve..rather than using compression fittings/adapters. The threads probably a little more reliable if you are going to be taking it on and off.


Thanks, good tip, should save me some money.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby Pooyan » Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:58 pm

xoltri wrote:Thanks, I decided to go 3/8" for the takeoff and I bought this needle valve:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0285676795
(Parker 3/8" Stainless Steel Needle Valve 4Z-V6LN-SS)


Hmmm, i think you have ordered a 4F-V6LN-SS Parker valve if i take a close look at the photo, meaning a 1/4" female NPT instead of the 3/8" you wanted, the 3/8" valve partnumbers are starting with a 6.
Please doublecheck with the Ebay seller....

see Parker's spec sheet http://www.parker.com/literature/Instrumentation%20Products%20Division/Catalogs/Catalog_4110-NV_Needle%20Valves_2010.pdf
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby duracell » Wed Feb 02, 2011 8:11 pm

Pooyan wrote:
Hmmm, i think you have ordered a 4F-V6LN-SS Parker valve if i take a close look at the photo, meaning a 1/4" female NPT instead of the 3/8" you wanted, the 3/8" valve partnumbers are starting with a 6.
Please doublecheck with the Ebay seller....

see Parker's spec sheet http://www.parker.com/literature/Instrumentation%20Products%20Division/Catalogs/Catalog_4110-NV_Needle%20Valves_2010.pdf


Hey thanks for the catch, you've potentially saved me a couple weeks of shipping back and forth. I pointed out the error to the seller and he has another one that is in-fact 3/8 so hopefully he agrees to correct his error and switch it out.
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Re: Bokakob 2" mini-still column

Postby duracell » Wed Feb 02, 2011 9:33 pm

The seller was quick to refund my money so I bought this one instead. It has the proper compression connectors on it which is nice.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0306745866
Whitey Swagelok 3/8" SS Needle Valve SS-1KS6
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