CCVM vs bokakob still

[DianaGin]

Hi there,
I have read a lot about different stills and their features, benefits and uses.
Currently I use a little reflux that built. Ugly as hell, but it works.
My needs is to do strip runs and then to be able to do runs with either a botanical basket or botanicals in the pot.
From what I have read so far, I really like the bokakob and it looks easy enough to build myself. But the CCVM also looks like it could tick the boxes.
Looking forward to learn from you all. Much appreciated
Diana

[Tummydoc]

For a strip you'll need to run in pot mode. CCVM is easily converted to a pot still. Boka will run slower.

[DianaGin]

That is what I also thought. Thank you Dr.

[NineInchNails]

If you just add a gate valve you can make a VM still. After equilibrium the darn thing would darn near run itself. Instead of fiddling with the condenser height, you just turn a knob on the valve.

As long as you keep the parts modular, by using Tri-Clamp connections for instance, you can easily modify the still to do anything you want in the future.

[Tummydoc]

Turn a knob, or raise the coil an inch, really no extra effort.

[Setsumi]

CCVM, easy to build and easy to run. and no valve to buy.

[seabass]

Ignoring the build complexity and assuming the boka head is modular and can be removed for stripping, how will the product quality and run speed differ?

[Expat]

Ignoring the build complexity and assuming the boka head is modular and can be removed for stripping, how will the product quality and run speed differ?

People have said that CCVM is faster but I've seen no evidence to actually support that.

A properly spec'ed Boka will be as fast as a CCVM. As with all these types of columns the speed is dependant on the reflux ratio (power inputs being equal) which is determined by the take off rate.

[Saltbush Bill]

If someone wants to explain how one is faster than the other Im all ears too.

[NineInchNails]

Yeah I don't see how a CCMV could possibly be faster unless the Boka had a very small take-off port and/or a slanted plate that cannot direct enough the reflux to the take-off port.

[Expat]

Yeah I don't see how a CCMV could possibly be faster unless the Boka had a very small take-off port and/or a slanted plate that cannot direct enough the reflux to the take-off port.

I suspect it's exactly this. A 1/4" takeoff valve on a 2 or 3" bok head can't do full take off; might be a fair comparison against a CCVM with a 3/4" ball valve port.

[Chauncey]

Yea i was ubder the impression most people have a relatively small takeoff on their boks which makes them notoriously slow but i have little experience with them.

[Saltbush Bill]

. But the CCVM also looks like it could tick the boxes.

To answer your question I think the CCVM is probably the better option.
Packed and insulated it should make a good clean spirit base for gin.......detuned " remove the packing " you have a pot still to make gin.
Alternative.......use the CCVM for neutral......and build a tiny pot still dedicated to gin making.
I think Bokas got a name foe being slow because many were built in two inch......and maybe not tall enough......they had to be run slowly to get azeo or close.
A well built 3 incher with good packing and fully insulated is a very different beast.

[shadylane]

My needs is to do strip runs and then to be able to do runs with either a botanical basket or botanicals in the pot.
From what I have read so far, I really like the bokakob and it looks easy enough to build myself.

Just my drunken opinion
A Bokakob would be much better than a CCVM for stripping runs.
And redistilling botanicals in the pot.
It can be adjusted to act like a potstill without removing the packing.
All that's needed is to adjust the take off valve to wide open.

A CCVM isn't capable of being run at as low of reflux ratio.
Even if you remove the packing, there will still be drops of reflux falling back down the column, instead of out of the still.
It would be kinda like driving with one foot on the gas and the other on the brake.

[kimbodious]

Go with a modular design system and build what you need for the job. My pot still is a subset of my CCVM - see links to my still configuration in my .signature. The same tee elbow and product condenser are used in both configurations.

Boka is an LM, CCVM is a VM, it is tricky to make a comparison.

[Tummydoc]

You don't have to remove the packing in a CCVM to run as a pot shady, you just pull the reflux coil and put a triclamp blank on the end. I can do that in a run to harvest tails for a later feints run. And in pot mode i can run 5500 watts. I have a concentric LM head that i can add to my CCVM to compress and pull heads more efficiently, but once into hearts I switch to VM because to me it is faster. I also like that can run a plated column under my CCVM. Much more versatile. But eventually everyone loves what they built regardless of VM,LM, or CM, and figures out how to make it work for them.

[shadylane]

Your right
On a CCVM.
Removing the reflux coil and putting a cap over the hole.
Would make a CCVM into a proper potstill

[shadylane]

As long as you keep the parts modular, by using Tri-Clamp connections for instance, you can easily modify the still to do anything you want in the future.

I'd bet everyone here will agree with this advice

[NZChris]

My needs is to do strip runs and then to be able to do runs with either a botanical basket or botanicals in the pot.

You might have to compromise on quality if that's what you want to do.

My gin runs are always at least the third pass through my stills:

Multiple fast strips and a spirit run keeping a very narrow heart cut for OEG style gins. (There are many posts on this forum that say even that isn't neutral enough for gin, but I say it can be if you don't mismatch the wash with the gin). viewtopic.php?f=14&t=48594

Feints from that run go through my Bokakob to use for blending gin concentrates and louches into submission, making essences, for Carter Head style gins, etc..

The net contains some poor advice on inline botanical baskets and markets some inadequate units, so don't be hasty getting your wallet out.

[DianaGin]

Thank you for all the input, really good.
It is really difficult to sift through all the nonsense that is sold for good info. And I know that this forum will guide me correctly. (and not listen to the George's of the air )
Chris, I really want to make good Gin. So I am prepared to walk it to get there.

[DianaGin]

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=48594

Feints from that run go through my Bokakob to use for blending gin concentrates and louches into submission, making essences, for Carter Head style gins, etc..

Thank you for the link.

I do have a fair bit of copper tubing left, must perhaps just knuckle down and build both stills?

[Saltbush Bill]

And I know that this forum will guide me correctly. (and not listen to the George's of the air )

Got that right

[NZChris]

I do have a fair bit of copper tubing left, must perhaps just knuckle down and build both stills?

I made quite a lot of good quality gin using only a pot still to make the base spirit before another distiller got sick of telling me I needed a Bokakob, dragged me down to the scrappy to buy the copper and built it for me.

My gin still is a mini, made using a saucepan and steamer, scrap copper, flour and water paste for seals, and is my most used still. If I want to make gallons of gin, I can do that using my main pot, but it'll never happen.