Pot Still, alternative to copper tube.

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Pot Still, alternative to copper tube.

Postby The Godfather » Sat Mar 05, 2005 5:25 pm

I believe I have read that copper tubing might add "character" to the final product, however if i used rubber or plastic tubing would that affect the product badly, if so how bad?
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Postby Grayson_Stewart » Sat Mar 05, 2005 6:05 pm

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Postby Guest » Sat Mar 05, 2005 6:06 pm

i never used plastic but i hear certain types break down and end up in your product
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Postby pangea » Sat Mar 05, 2005 6:06 pm

I tried using Tygon around the top for a seal. The taste was awful! I don't know if it was the Tygon or just a bad mash.

Just curious, why wouldn't you use copper?
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Postby Guest » Sat Mar 05, 2005 7:11 pm

Grayson_Stewart wrote:Let me be the first to introduce you to homedistiller.org Practically everything you ever wanted to know.




i have been to that site many many times, yet i dont believe i found the answer to my question.
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Postby The Godfather » Sat Mar 05, 2005 7:12 pm

I have alot of unused fish tank tubing lying around so i thought i could make use of it. But i guess i will just stick to copper.
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Postby Grayson_Stewart » Sun Mar 06, 2005 7:46 am

Anonymous wrote:
Grayson_Stewart wrote:Let me be the first to introduce you to homedistiller.org Practically everything you ever wanted to know.




i have been to that site many many times, yet i dont believe i found the answer to my question.


This is from the site:

Plastic
Plastic is basically fine at the low alcohol end (eg the wash, and even the diluted product), but if possible, try to avoid using it where it is likely to encounter strong alcohol. For alternatives, consider using copper tubing from the condensor to the collection jar, and using glass collection & storage jars.
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never

Postby Uncle Jesse » Sun Mar 06, 2005 9:26 am

never use plastic. never use pyrex. use stainless steel and copper.

copper removes some nasty stuff (sulfates) from the distillate on contact which improves the taste.
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Postby Yttrium » Sun Mar 06, 2005 1:08 pm

never use pyrex


What?!? Pyrex is a wonderful type of glass. Given the choice between stainless steel and pyrex, I would say that pyrex is better in all aspects except being harder to work with(how's your glass blowing?), breakable, and expensive.
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Postby Grayson_Stewart » Sun Mar 06, 2005 1:21 pm

Same here...I thought pyrex was just glass that wasn't temperature sensitive.
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Postby MyDBear » Sun Mar 06, 2005 1:48 pm

That would be fantastic ta have a full size still made from pyrex.

cept when it broke
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Postby Pieterpost » Mon Mar 07, 2005 12:41 am

I have a complete still made from pyrex (boro-silicate) but the volume of the roundbottom flask is a problem ........

Bigger sizes are just too expesive to buy (expecially for a volume of 30-50 liter). Currently I have a 2 liter flask ........... I would even settle for a 5 or 10 liter flask for smaller liquer endeavors.......
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Postby LeftLaneCruiser » Mon Mar 07, 2005 2:41 am

Pieterpost wrote:I have a complete still made from pyrex (boro-silicate) but the volume of the roundbottom flask is a problem ........

Bigger sizes are just too expesive to buy (expecially for a volume of 30-50 liter). Currently I have a 2 liter flask ........... I would even settle for a 5 or 10 liter flask for smaller liquer endeavors.......


Pietr,

Isn't it possible for you to buy an ordinary carboy for winemaking? They come around in sizes from 5 up to 50 ltrs.

Only problem i can think of is the connection between carboy and column. And maybe the heating will be problematic too..

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Postby Guest » Mon Mar 07, 2005 5:10 am

LeftLaneCruiser wrote:
Pietr,

Isn't it possible for you to buy an ordinary carboy for winemaking? They come around in sizes from 5 up to 50 ltrs.

Only problem i can think of is the connection between carboy and column. And maybe the heating will be problematic too..

KJH



I was crazy enought to try heating a carboy with flame before....don't try it.
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pyrex

Postby The Chemist » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:08 am

I'm all for Pyrex--depending on the desired results. I have a 25 liter setup, with an eight-foot column--serious pyrex!! It's great for cleaning up neutral spirits that we regularly use. It's kind of a pain in the ass (sticks up through the ceiling, into the second floor), but gives great results. If neutral spirits is what you want. If I wanted anything with flavor, I would certainly include some copper somewhere.
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no

Postby Uncle Jesse » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:14 am

do not use pyrex. we had a thread on this on the old message boards but i can't find it. it is not glass and is not recommended for the purposes of beverage distillation.

copper and stainless steel only. it seems everyone wants to reinvent the wheel for some reason, but the fact is that stainless and copper are the only safe alternatives. not only that, but you must TIG weld them and feed in argon if you really want to make a food-grade container. if you don't TIG weld with argon in the container being welded, your welds will not be safe against contamination. anyone familiar with welding and flux will understand.

anyone remember the pyrex thread and how pyrex is made/what it contains?
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Postby Yttrium » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:39 am

Here's a site dealing with pyrex

http://www.bibby-sterilin.co.uk/internet/bibbysite.nsf/AllDocumentsByDocIndex2/EWYN5EWB5WTALN5HMJ6G

Pyrex is just a borosilicate glass that has a very low expansion cooeficient. So it doesn't shatter when quickly heat or cooled(within limits). One thing about pyrex is that most labware is made from it, and I would be hesitant to use any labware that wasn't brand new.
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Postby The Chemist » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:42 am

Oh, come on, Unk. Pyrex IS glass-a low-expansion, tempered borosilicate glass. I agree 100% that it should not be used for making whisky, rum etc., but that's a different matter. If using pyrex, you shouldn't use it over a flame, or any localized heat source. In my 25 liter rig, we use a boiling water bath.
Anyway, about TIG welding: I take your point Uncle Jesse, but has anyone tried "pickling" regular-welded seams? We do this on all our SS tanks
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ok

Postby Uncle Jesse » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:46 am

if you want to split hairs you can call it a type of glass. but that obfuscates the point - it is not glass as we normally think of glass. from the rest of your message i take it we agree. we've had people here trying to use pyrex and all manner of other materials before and in the interest of safety it's important that those of us with experience guide people in the right/safe direction.

what is "pickling" regular welded seams? not familiar with that term.
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Postby The Chemist » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:57 am

Right on, Uncle Jesse. Hopefully, I also speak for Yttrim in saying that we didn't mean to cyber-flog you. It's just that we chemists LOVE our pyrex!! The safety point is well taken--see Guest's post above. NEVER heat a carboy!
"Pickling" welded stainless is a process that restores the stainless properties to the chromium-depleted zone around the weld. We use a product from Avesta Welding called (not surprisingly) Pickling Paste. It's really nasty, containing flouric acid, and not for the faint-hearted (or the even somewhat careless). Contact with flouric acid in any amount requires an immediate trip to the hospital.
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Re: pyrex

Postby Firebaall » Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:04 am

The Chemist wrote:I'm all for Pyrex--depending on the desired results. I have a 25 liter setup, with an eight-foot column--serious pyrex!! It's great for cleaning up neutral spirits that we regularly use. It's kind of a pain in the ass (sticks up through the ceiling, into the second floor), but gives great results. If neutral spirits is what you want. If I wanted anything with flavor, I would certainly include some copper somewhere.


Pics?
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Re: no

Postby seedsprout » Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:01 am

Uncle Jesse wrote:do not use pyrex. we had a thread on this on the old message boards but i can't find it. it is not glass and is not recommended for the purposes of beverage distillation.

copper and stainless steel only. it seems everyone wants to reinvent the wheel for some reason, but the fact is that stainless and copper are the only safe alternatives. .....?

Uncle Jesse,
What about regualar glass isn't that safe to use? At this point I sure hope so otherwise I am in trouble!
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Postby The Chemist » Tue Mar 08, 2005 9:20 am

Sorry Firebaall, the boss says no pics on the web.
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Re: no

Postby Fourway » Tue Mar 08, 2005 2:02 pm

Uncle Jesse wrote:anyone remember the pyrex thread and how pyrex is made/what it contains?


I remember this clearly and it was utter malarky.

It was a guy who said that he was a professional scientist and that harmful amounts of arsenic leach out of borosilicate labware.

When he was asked what kind of "scientist" he was he said that actually it was his friend who was a scientist who warned him about borosilicate glass.
When taken to task for further sources to back up his absurd claims he got hostile and called me and THM big doodyheads.

You shouldn't repeat every scary rumor you think you might have heard somewhere :) this is how urban legends get started.

If in fact Borosilicate glass was not food safe the makers of silex and cory vacuum coffee pots and chemex drip pots would have been ruined long before Mr.Coffee came along and put them out of business.
I believe Bodum still makes borosilicate coffeepots.

Big excellent glass condensers are still one of the safe, elegant choices for small libations stills... they're just prohibitively expensive and oh so easy to break. It hardly counts as reinventing the wheel to use labware.

The late John Stone (of Nixon-Stone) published a wonderful set of plans for building a scrubber packed glass reflux column where you can watch your vapor equilbrium directly (talk about eliminating guesswork).

Anyway... don't believe the hype.
Glass roolz.

As a matter of fact I think that the "scientist" in question might have been the original appearance of usarmy21 when he was trolling on the old board.
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Postby The Chemist » Tue Mar 08, 2005 2:17 pm

Doodyheads??? You two, along with Uncle Jesse and Grayson (Roll Tide BTW) have more sense and experience than probably the rest of us combined! Shame on fake scientists. Pyrex is absolutely safe.
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Postby Fourway » Tue Mar 08, 2005 2:20 pm

The Chemist wrote:Doodyheads??? You two, along with Uncle Jesse and Grayson (Roll Tide BTW) have more sense and experience than probably the rest of us combined! Shame on fake scientists. Pyrex is absolutely safe.



sorry "called us doodyheads" is my shorthand for "resorted to childish name calling"
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Postby Tater » Tue Mar 08, 2005 8:47 pm

doody heads lol :D
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Postby Jaxom » Fri Mar 11, 2005 11:32 am

I've been tossing around the idea of building a still from lab glass myself. One I do "smallish" batchs on before firing up my keg still. It may be wee bit expensive to do, but what the heck, would look nice in my home office! :)

This site has flasks that are up to 22L. http://www.qglass.com/ I've also noticed they have two different types of reflux columns. One called Snyder the other is Vigreaux. Which is better? And what are those numbers after the lengths (24/40 or 29/42)?

Sidebar, I use to be able to view pictures on this website, now Internet explorer is recieving an error. Any ideas?

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...

Postby Uncle Jesse » Fri Mar 11, 2005 11:54 am

good work fourway! glad someone remebered that thread and can shed some light.

as for being a doodyhead, you can call me doodyhead if you wish.
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yep

Postby Uncle Jesse » Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:01 pm

well, Cooter shouldn't have swiped that ole limo, but can you blame him? he never gets to see cars like that.
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