Learnin' the hard way

[longhaul]

I'm new to not only this forum, but also home distilling. I, probably like many newbies, took the advice of the guy at the brew shop. Ran first 2 runs with 17 pounds sugar and turbo yeast in a 21L wash at about 60 degrees F. I guess about the only thing I didn't do wrong was I didn't ferment it in a trash bag. I have since done an awful lot of reading on this site(thanks to all the contributors) and have acquired some necessary ( I hope) tools of the trade. I have a SG hydrometer, an alcohol meter, a 100 watt submersible aqaurium heater, and a digital thermometer with a water resistant probe. Just put together my first batch of birdwatchers, scaled to 20L. I'm hoping to get about 3.5L that doesn't smell and taste of yeast like those turbo runs. I did read a post where asomeone was getting a red tint in his distillate. I diluted my tomato paste in hot water added the lemon juice and poured that into a cavity in the sugar in my ferment bucket, theory is to let the sugar grind the remaining lumps of paste during stirring. Seems to have worked.
I am a pretty thick skinned old ex-Drill Instructor, so feel free to tell me I'm a dumbass, but please explain why you think so.

[Stillatryin]

My advice, Sir, is keep on reading. Sounds like you've learned a good bit already. The new distillers lounge is packed with good info. There's also some very good info on cuts, running the still, and safety info. I'm not much of a chemist and I stick with the tried and true stuff for now. There are many, many wise and helpful folks here, but before asking questions, read the info on the parent site. There's alot more to this hobby than meets the eye.

[ipee7ABV]

good news is your still should be clean. welcome

[janee]

i have used tomato paste dozens of times and never seen any red, or taste of tomato in my product, when thining the paste add water slowly and stir til thin, i just dumped it my first time, and there were still lumps when it finished. if you heat your water almost to boiling, take off heat.slowly add sugar. you dont have to stand there and stir it while heating up.desolves almost instantly. I think it is the easest tried and true, and has never failed me. easy clean up too,there is not much left to get rid of.

[Ayay]

Greetings longhaul, you're learnin good and fast despite the brewshop. Here it's the stillin first, the brew a close second, cuts third, and ageing is a bonus.
Glad you found out about the turbos...there is a better way. Stills don't care about the colour of the wash. As long as it's dry and cloudy-clear, it's up to the stillin and the cuts.

[longhaul]

48 hour update. This wash was 4.5 kg sugar, SG was 1.075 added about 3 cups more trying to get to 1.09. I got to 1.084 and decided to stop there. 56 g red star bakers yeast. It was sizzling away when I got up for work next morning, 8 hours later, but tested SG without stirring showed no change. Now, at 48 hours, stirred first then tested SG, down to 1.042. Bucket is toasty warm, the aquarium heater is working fine, holding about 81 degrees F.

[Richard7]

Read this in a REAL FAST, LOUD VOICE!
old ex-Drill Instructor, What makes you think your worthy of even trying what others are accomplishing here? There are people who get it done and then there's you! If you think for one moment, that you can do this you must really have faith, cause you haven't shown me s#1t. Why don't you go back to the end of the line, try to find your balls, and bring your sorry butt back up here to try again! And if you can't find your balls try looking under my boot cause I am probably walking all over them!


Now longhaul, I got that off my chest! (I am entitled as a VET) LOL I also started with a turbo because I was told that was the way to go. I have learned, and it sounds like you have too that that is not so.
I have also used tomato paste with very good results. It never comes over as a taste or color in my product.
Thank you for the training you have given to the troops that are protecting our rights! And just laugh at the first part of my post, and welcome to HD.

[Halfbaked]

Long haul sounds like you got your head screwed on strait. What do you like to drink? Lots of great receipts on here. Some are great and good for beginners.

[texashine]

This is an excellent title for a topic:"learning the hard way". I went through the learning process like all newbees. I had the desire to create something JD and the other distilleries could not. Early experiments created undrinkable jet fuel. Must be missing something I needed. Shortly discovered all types of instruments that I should have had, gotta have. I don't mean to lick the red off your candy, but would like to pose a few questions not just to you, but to the rest who follow this trade/hobby. Question: why bother with all the devices that measure the potential of the mash and the volume of alcohol. What are you going to do about it? The fermentation process has already started. You have combined all the proper ingredients. The mash is either still generating or it has stopped. Simple, huh. It's ready when it's done fermenting, and there are far too many variables to list that influence it's progress. You go by the taste of the mash. If there is any sweetness to it, it ain't ready. If it is not generating bubbles, even small ones, it ain't ready. Maybe it's because I concentrate only on corn based shine that I now make light of the laboratory approach we all started with. You're not making wine that can be influenced by a cloudy day at a certain stage.

You are trying to make a great tasting liquor that the big boys cannot duplicate. Trust me guys, you can create a better tasting liquor than Jack, or Turkey, or any of the rest produce. And, most importantly, your product will be an honest one. You won't be adding anything at the end that covers up the natural taste. You won't be adding anything during the dilution process to make it create the correct bubbles that simulate perfection. The big boys do, but they are allowed to do so, under the guise of "proprietary flavoring ingredients" allowed by the FDA. The truth is, they would love to be able to make the product that you are capable of making. They just cannot afford the time and what they consider wasted material if they don't have to. If their product is drinkable, it is acceptable.

My final advice is to run your still, run it again, and run it again. Learn it's characteristics before anything else. Then learn your mash ingredients. Then learn how to cut it. Selecting what part to save and what parts to recycle is the most difficult part of the thing. It's not the most important thing because every step effects all the others, but cutting cannot be mastered by a bunch of instruments. Only experience and will power will teach you this.

I have blind tested against Black Jack, Chevas Blue, and many others in many contests and have never come in less than first place. And, if I can do it, so can you. Follow the advice of the mentors here. Their common advice is to slow down, this ain't rocket science, don't overthink it, don't be tempted by some claim for sooped up yeasts or funky stuff to feed the yeast. And, it's not a beauty contest for equipment, although it's a hell of a lot of fun for the perfectionist and the artist to build pretty and shiny things.

Then go back and learn all that you missed about mash ingredients, and what tastes you want to carry over.
The learning cycle takes time. In time, you will be ashamed of the stuff you created earlier in your career that you thought at the time was really good stuff. This is a great hobby, (or part time business) if so inclined.

[Schmicter]

I might just ad to learn about the temperature corrections for your hydrometer when measuring SG. If you are measuring it hot off the stove it is considerably higher than you are reading.

[Ayay]

texashine, many words and all true.

[longhaul]

Maybe at this point I have learned enough to respond to my own original post. Texas Shine is absolutely right. I got grain, sugar , yeast let's go. I have experimented with several different combinations. So far, I have 1 in a decanter that I am saving for St Patrick's Day (began with grape nuts), but makes you want to say "Erin ga braugh". I have a bourbon(thanks to NC Hooch) that I only hope I can figure out what I did right and do it again. I have a multi use concentric still thanks to Rad that does a wonderful job. For incoming newbies; Read,Read,Read; it's all here. Many thanks to all the knowledgable people who help us neofites so much.

[Keogge]

Hello Everyone!....

I have to say that this has been a great read, albeit short. I have been reading and reading on may different sites and this hits the nail on the head; point blank and to the point...
Thank-you Texashine and Longhaul for boosting the spirit, so to speak...

Maybe at this point I have learned enough to respond to my own original post. Texas Shine is absolutely right. I got grain, sugar , yeast let's go. I have experimented with several different combinations. So far, I have 1 in a decanter that I am saving for St Patrick's Day (began with grape nuts), but makes you want to say "Erin ga braugh". I have a bourbon(thanks to NC Hooch) that I only hope I can figure out what I did right and do it again. I have a multi use concentric still thanks to Rad that does a wonderful job. For incoming newbies; Read,Read,Read; it's all here. Many thanks to all the knowledgable people who help us neofites so much.

[longhaul]

Sorry, I don't get back to this post often enough. So far I have learned that all that is needed is the wisdom and common sense of hill folks, the ability to be your own biggest critic, thick skinned enough to take the criticism, smart enough to analyze that criticism and make adjustments, brave enough to experiment, and finally possess the patience of an oyster. Then one day you will have produced a bottle of your desired spirit that you are willing to sign your name to.

[Richard7]

possess the patience of an oyster.

That is a new one on me. I like it.

[longhaul]

Wish I could claim it as my own. I borrowed it from a John Wayne movie. Chisum. Pat Garrett told Billie Bonnie he had the patience of an oyster.