Jam

Production methods from starch to sugars.

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Brett
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Jam

Post by Brett » Wed Jul 27, 2005 4:55 am

ok so id been thinking about recipes all night, lookin at whats fruits are cheap n when (big joke in england its never cheap). anyway, im sat down this mornin eating my toast with bramble jelly jam :D and i started to read the packagin as u do.

sugar
fruit
gelling agent

hmmm ok read on

contains 40g of fruit per 100g
contains 66g sugar per 100g

no mention of preservatives

thats like 181 g of fruit n 299g of sugar per jar
so by rights 3 jars per gallon to yield 11% potential.

Would this work i read on this site about the pectin in fruits causing higher methanol and i presume the gelling agent will be pectin :( but would some pectolase fix this?

KatoFong
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Post by KatoFong » Wed Jul 27, 2005 10:22 am

There's a Web site with a recipe for jelly wine. http://scorpius.spaceports.com/~goodwine/jellywine.htm

I can't vouch for the flavor, nor for the alcohol content, but from the sounds of it, jelly will ferment. I'd be willing to bet jam would, too. Doubt the fruit bits floating in it would hinder that too much.

Guest

Post by Guest » Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:58 pm

yep, no reason why it shouldn't work ! The high sugar content works as a preservative so none is added !

KatoFong
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Post by KatoFong » Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:12 pm

This goes to a phenomenon I've noticed with myself. Not long after I built my first still, I noticed that almost everywhere I looked, I saw things--coffee pots, glass jars, tea sets, woks, etc.--and kept thinking to myself "I bet you could make a still out of that." I hear the same thing happens with pot heads and bongs. So Dennis Leary says, anyway.

Apparently it also works with fermenting.

Brett
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Post by Brett » Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:29 pm

its all true Kato, i had a brief gap from brewin recently, but everytime iv been into it i find myself lookin at everythin in a new way, even looking to trees n plants thinking hmmm wonder if there poisoness :lol:

Yttrium
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Post by Yttrium » Wed Jul 27, 2005 5:10 pm

In the canning of fruit jellies, I believe that pectin is often added to ensure that things go properly. I'm no expert on canning so its possible that the pectin gets broken down some how, but I believe that the fermentation of pectin leads to the production of methanol.
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level Joe
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Post by level Joe » Wed Jul 27, 2005 5:28 pm

I make strawberry and black rasberry jam and a packet of liquid pectin is what I use to make it jell but cant speak to methanol production.

Ball Liquid Jell for jam & jellies ingredients: water, pectin, lactic acid, citric acid, potassium citrate, polyglycerol ester and sodium benzoate
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v0rtexx
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Post by v0rtexx » Wed Jul 27, 2005 8:06 pm

I believe pectic enzyme is used to break up the pectin in the jelly. This may neutralize the amount of methenol you would have created. Not absolutely positive however...
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rectifier
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Post by rectifier » Wed Jul 27, 2005 10:52 pm

no, I think pectin itself is actually added to encourage gelling. There are pectin-free jams and jellies though.

Virginia Gentleman
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Post by Virginia Gentleman » Thu Jul 28, 2005 3:07 am

KatoFong wrote:This goes to a phenomenon I've noticed with myself. Not long after I built my first still, I noticed that almost everywhere I looked, I saw things--coffee pots, glass jars, tea sets, woks, etc.--and kept thinking to myself "I bet you could make a still out of that." I hear the same thing happens with pot heads and bongs. So Dennis Leary says, anyway.

Apparently it also works with fermenting.
I walk around all day long thinking about ingredients, still parts, collection containers and the like as I look at ordinary object that used to have no particular significance. Funny how a hobby can change your perception so much. For years I've done the same when driving over a creek or river, I always crane my neck to see if there's a fishing spot I need to come back to. I do it so often, my wife usually says "there's no fish down there, keep your eyes on the road" to give me a hard time.
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Brett
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Post by Brett » Thu Jul 28, 2005 4:17 am

yep ur all right there are 2 gelling agents iv heard of been used but the only one iv seen used in jam and i know my nan used to use is pectin, but i have a tub of pectolase from my homebrew shop which i used to throw into all my homemade fruit wines to remove the pectin anyway. Not sure how the flavour will be but iv noticed a lot more pure jams appearing at cheaper prices, these jams only have sugar fruit n pectin.

as i said by rights id need 3 jars per gallon for 11% wine at £1 (good stuff) or under a jar.

now if i want to look at fruit a punnet of strawberrys would cost me £1 (a little less if i pick them myself) and they weigh 450 g (around 1lb) and 1kg (2.2lbs) of sugar is £1.. That means 3 punnets per gallon and 1 bag of sugar.

so looking at it the price isnt all that different until u start producin larger amounts :lol:

Fourway
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Post by Fourway » Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:47 am

my (incomplete) understanding is that pectolase only encourages the pectin to break down into meoh
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The Chemist
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Post by The Chemist » Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:03 am

From Gallander, Chemistry of Grapes and Other Fruits (Chemistry of Winemaking):

"...pectins in musts may contribute to the methyl alcohol content of wines. This undesirable wine constituent is probably derived from hydrolysis of naturally occuring pectins."

and

"The hydrolytic action by these enzymes..." [pectolases]

So it seems you're right, Fourway. You can leave the pectins alone, they'll probably make your wine cloudy, or you can hit them with pectolase, and throw out a bit more methanol when you distill. If you're just making wine, you'll have to decide whether you prefer cloudy wine (nothing wrong with it really) or elevated methanol content. (I know which I'd pick!!)
Purposeful motion, for one so insane...

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