BIAB (Brew In a Bag) Mashing

[frunobulax]

Hi, I see this is an older post but I want to use this method for nchooch's bourbon.
I'm an all grain brewer so that part is not a problem. My question is...Using Beersmith choosing BiAb and adjusting
recipe for 8lbs flaked corn, 3 LBS 6 row, 6 gallons of water, It shows an OG of 1.059 at 97% efficiency. Do you think the extra points of gravity you get is due to Boiling the flaked corn or do I need to run those numbers by hand?
Thanks

[Usge]

I don't really know what to say about beer apps/making/procedures as it applies to corn. They use flaked maize as an "adjunct" to a primarly malt base. It's entirely different scenario to use the corn as a primary ingredient and the malt as the minor. Corn doesn't "dough" in...and this stuff won't sparge either.

But, I can tell you that yes...boiling it does make a difference and adds to the gravity/potential. As does the additonal pre-malt amount, and/or the use of enzymes. Give it a try.

[frunobulax]

I gave the BiAb a try this week end and it worked out pretty well. I used 9lbs flaked corn and 3.5 lbs. 6 row. in 6 gals.of water, mashed out at 170 degrees and ran it through a plate chiller. I ended up with exactly 5 gallons at a gravity of 1.070. I didn't boil corn or pre malt (that's why I bumped up the recipe a little).
I made a mistake by trying to use a 5 gallon paint strainer and I had a little trouble getting the grains to soak, so I'm getting a bag to fit my 15 gallon keggle this week. I also used the sparge technique and got 1.5 gallons of 1.027 which I added to a UJSSM I have goin'.
...Beersmith did predict gravity correctly, I forgot to set boil time to 0
Thanks for write up!

[heartcut]

I use a 20 gal Cajun Cooker with the shrimp basket for BIAB and it works well. The basket lets me elevate the bag and all about 6" to drain/sparge most everything out the spigot without straining or worrying about dropping the bag into the hot wort. Corn still needs squeezing or a rinse, but most other grains are super easy. Like Usge said, sure cleans up better.

[buzzbeater]

I gave the BiAb a try this week end and it worked out pretty well. I used 9lbs flaked corn and 3.5 lbs. 6 row. in 6 gals.of water, mashed out at 170 degrees and ran it through a plate chiller. I ended up with exactly 5 gallons at a gravity of 1.070. I didn't boil corn or pre malt (that's why I bumped up the recipe a little).
I made a mistake by trying to use a 5 gallon paint strainer and I had a little trouble getting the grains to soak, so I'm getting a bag to fit my 15 gallon keggle this week. I also used the sparge technique and got 1.5 gallons of 1.027 which I added to a UJSSM I have goin'.
...Beersmith did predict gravity correctly, I forgot to set boil time to 0
Thanks for write up!

I'm an AG beer brewer and this is exactly what my thought process has been. But what what was your sparge technique, batch, fly? I still can't get my head wrapped around squeezing the bag since that's a big no no in the beer world. I've made some nasty tannin bombs of a beer by squeezing the bag before I learned better. I would image that it would impart some taste difference but maybe not as big a deal with distillation. Of course the amount of grain, 3.5lbs, is relatively small.

[frunobulax]

BiAb is no sparge. 2 qts. per lb and let it go at that. Since that reply I made several batches to strip and got a bag that fit my 15.5 Gal mash tun, It worked great.
After that first one, I also didn't do a mash out or use my plate chiller. (didn't want to go through the hassle of cleaning it). I went right into the fermenters hot and let it cool to 90 degrees f. overnight.
As far as tannins go, I think because you're stillin' the beer it doesn't affect the flavor.
That's not really a sparge per se , when your done squeezing you take a couple gallons of sparge water and rinse the grains and save that in a separate container and add it to your next batch.
It's only a few gravity points, but they adds up after a few batches.
Ya do lots of stuff ya wouldn't do as a brewer and still make a great product !

[heartcut]

I really love the NcHootch style piggyback sugarhead from spent beer grains. Amazing how much flavor comes through.

[rgreen2002]

I know this is an older post...but it's been revived once before. Has anyone done BiAB with cracked corn? Most of the corn here is flaked maize and I see the same on several other BiAB posts. I got plenty of cracked corn and I was planning a bourbon - corn, 2 row and rye. I have ordered enzymes and was planning on using them for my first AG.

[skow69]

I haven't tried it because I don't think it will work. Corn is so hard to gelatinize that I don't think you could get it hydrated in a bag. It needs to be stirred up and exposed to plenty of water. I suspect the stuff in the middle won't gel well. Maybe if you boiled the hell out of it and gave it lots of time.

[midlife-u-turn]

I know this is an older post...but it's been revived once before. Has anyone done BiAB with cracked corn? Most of the corn here is flaked maize and I see the same on several other BiAB posts. I got plenty of cracked corn and I was planning a bourbon - corn, 2 row and rye. I have ordered enzymes and was planning on using them for my first AG.

I've done two batches of all corn in a bag with liquid enzymes. I ran the cracked corn through my barley grinder twice and let it sit in the cooler over night after adding both enzymes. I stirred it with a dry wall mud mixer on a drill, but probably only stirred it for a few minutes a half dozen times. Both batches had an original gravity of 1.053 and finished at 1.00 and .99.
Brought the water to just starting a boil and added the corn, which brought it to about 185. (a little over 2 lbs/gallon) Added the high temp, stirring occasionally and let it sit for about 3.5 hrs. At about 148 I adjusted ph slightly added the second enzyme. Stirred occasionally and let it sit over night. Brought temp down, transferred and pitched yeast.

[goblin]

i have done several, corn/barley no enzymes. i had a pulley system so i could lift the corn off of bottom while i put more fire to it. i cooked the crap out of it. let it cool down, then mashed in the malted barley. stir set stir set. most of my OGs were 1.055, but my bag was a little to fine of a mesh. i fermented off of grain. was a pain to separate the liquid. if i do all grain again i will try enzymes alone. and with malted barley.
get your squeeze on. well worth the work.

[midlife-u-turn]

[quote="goblin"]. i had a pulley system so i could lift the corn off of bottom while i put more fire to it. i fermented off of grain. was a pain to separate the liquid. quote]

I have somewhat of a pulley system as well but I use mine to lift the bag out of the rectangular cooler. I empty the cooler after I sparge and then let the bag hang above the cooler for and hour or two while I'm using my wort chiller and transferring. By the time it is done dripping most of the liquid is out of the grains, with very little squeezing necessary. While it is dripping it cools as well and I can just transfer it right in to the fermenter.

[skow69]

I gel with HT alpha a. and mash with gluco a. at 3#/gal for 1.070 - 1.085, (no bag). Then use paint strainer bags to sparge and squeeze down to 1.050 -1.065, and ferment off the grain. I think I get more wort and more product that way, with my equipment, and leave less sugar in the spent grain.

[rgreen2002]

midlife - I saw some of your old posts. did you ever try to ferment on the grain...in the bag? I don't see why this cold not be done is a similar fashion to what you had mentioned before: http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 2#p7365592 - ferment on grain then pull the bag out and let gravity slowly drain the water out.

I'm planning my first AG and I 'm just trying to plan it out for best possible outcome so that when I get AN outcome that is drinkable I can at least be happy with my first...plan better for the second.

[skow69]

If you're like most of us, you will end up trying every conceivable option to find out which one works best for you. It's part of the fun. The destination is great, but the journey can be fun too. Don't be afraid to fail. It's a good way to learn.

[midlife-u-turn]

midlife - I saw some of your old posts. did you ever try to ferment on the grain...in the bag? .

I never did try it, but I don't know why it wouldn't work just fine. I've been getting pretty good results and good flavor by fermenting off the grain. I just made a batch of oat whiskey and used a pretty heavy grain bill, as I thought my conversion rate would be pretty poor, and it was. My batch pretty much maxed out my bag, I think if I do that again I may ferment on the grain and then dump the works into the bag to hang and drain and see how that works out. Part of my conversion problems may be that my over compensation got to a point where I couldn't stir things sufficiently causing my conversion to actually be less as a result. Something else to figure out and compare I guess. Like Skow said, give it a try both ways and see what works best for you. Not sure what recipe you're giving a go but my first all grain ferment was Jimbo's single malt and it turned out great. I used what I learned there and adapted it to many different all grain runs. I'm sure your first will be tasty

[piperdave]

Just did my first BIAB AG with 12.5 kg 2 row malt barley and now have 50L of wash bubbling away happily now.

3 things.

Raw beer gets sticky when spilled (at least that means sugar is being produced).

12.5 kg of hot, wet barley is a lot heavier and a little more trouble to handle than it seems on paper. Now I know why the beer guys have a pulley system to do the heavy lifting for them.

A 50L cooler seems like lots of room for a mash tun until you put 35L 70 C water and 12.5 kg of barley into it.

Lots of notes taken to improve method for next batch.

Edit: Wort, it's called wort not wash or raw beer. Semantics, gotta love 'em.

[Graw]

Old post but I like it. Doing my first run at it. Couple questions. At first I read that after you boil for 10-15 minutes you slowly bring it down to 140-150 (took you about 3 hrs). I did this using a blanket. Then I read it again and I think it says to keep it at 140-150 for 3 hrs and then after it’s below 140 chill quickly?
My question is: does the corn need that long (3 hrs) to slowly bring temp to 150? Or Is the 3 hours for the malts the important thing? Or both?

[Graw]

Ok so it sat 3 hrs after boil and once at 150 threw in grains. Kept at 140-150 for 2.5 hrs. Cooled and pitched. Got a reading of 1.063 which sounds the same as original recipe. 7 hrs total time. So ya maybe I let things sit longer than I shoulda but seems like turned out ok. 7 gallons of water got 6 gallons into ferment. More patience coulda got more but was getting late.

[frunobulax]

Ok so it sat 3 hrs after boil and once at 150 threw in grains. Kept at 140-150 for 2.5 hrs. Cooled and pitched. Got a reading of 1.063 which sounds the same as original recipe. 7 hrs total time. So ya maybe I let things sit longer than I shoulda but seems like turned out ok. 7 gallons of water got 6 gallons into ferment. More patience coulda got more but was getting late.

Good Job! Ya only need to keep the corn hot for about a half an hour for it gelatinize. After that you can get the temp to 155 as fast as you
want, or can to add grain. Then, you only need to hold it between 140-150 for 2 hours for complete starch conversion.

[Graw]

Ok so it sat 3 hrs after boil and once at 150 threw in grains. Kept at 140-150 for 2.5 hrs. Cooled and pitched. Got a reading of 1.063 which sounds the same as original recipe. 7 hrs total time. So ya maybe I let things sit longer than I shoulda but seems like turned out ok. 7 gallons of water got 6 gallons into ferment. More patience coulda got more but was getting late.

Good Job! Ya only need to keep the corn hot for about a half an hour for it gelatinize. After that you can get the temp to 155 as fast as you
want, or can to add grain. Then, you only need to hold it between 140-150 for 2 hours for complete starch conversion.

Excellent that’s what I was looking for

[Graw]

Sorry another question. I have a 14 gallon brew pot. I put the bottom straining screen in just like the OP. Problem is the screen comes up to the 3 gallon mark. So I used 7 gallons of water and after adding the corn I was worried about the quantity of water above the screen vs the amount of grains so I ended up taking the screen out to give more water access to the grains.
What do you guys do?

[Redjack]

I was wondering what micron size bag are you guys using? I’m having a heck of a time squeezing the liquid out when I’m done
Thanks

[adamf]

I was wondering what micron size bag are you guys using? I’m having a heck of a time squeezing the liquid out when I’m done
Thanks

Hey there, BIAB gave me this for micron sizing a new bag:

"If you recirculate 400 micron, if not 200 micron."

Does that jib with what you've found?

Thanks,
adamf