VM Project

VM CM LM Flutes Plate

Moderator: Site Moderator

VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:26 pm

Here are some pics of the last VM design rig I built ..cant take the credit for the design (thanks Harry for sharing your ideas) I did do some slight mods from the original design . I had intentions on making a pic tutorial on this build but have not got around to doing that yet .Dont have any yet of everything assembled. But I thought I would go ahead and post them here . . there are several of them . not all that big of files but could pose a problem for the dial up users .. if it slows the site let me know I will remove them of a mod can remove them.
NM
edit here is a template I added to Harry's original design should be to scale if printed with windows picture and fax viewer


Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image
Attachments
templates.zip
(112.39 KiB) Downloaded 1275 times
Last edited by new_moonshiner on Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:21 pm, edited 7 times in total.
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby Husker » Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:34 pm

Ooooohhhh :esurprised: , NICE eye candy for us stillers.

Hell, if someone complains about too big for dialup, pix like this might push them into upgrading to broadband
Hillbilly Rebel: Unless you are one of the people on this site who are legalling distilling, keep a low profile, don't tell, don't sell.
User avatar
Husker
Admin
 
Posts: 5007
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2006 1:04 pm

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:41 pm

lol thanks for the kind words husker .. i just didn't want to do anything slow up things .. I will soon hopefully get to take couple of everything assembled in action .. :D
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby Hawke » Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:49 pm

Very nice work.
I see you added the slant plates for foreshot removal.
It is the very things that we think we know, that keep us from learning what we should know.
Valved Reflux, 3"x54" Bok 'mini', 2 liebig based pots and the 'Blockhead' 60K btu propane heat
User avatar
Hawke
Master Distiller
 
Posts: 2471
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 1:39 am

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:55 pm

yes sir Mr. Hawke, I was trying to think who it was who suggested that ..I thought It was you but i wasn't 100 percent and I didnt want to offend anyone .. Im glad I took your advice .. it works like a dream ... thanks again for that .
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby Hawke » Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:05 pm

It wasn't my idea, but I remember it being discussed.
I might modify my Boka, and turn it into a simillar rig. Even though I'm concentrating on potstilling.
It is the very things that we think we know, that keep us from learning what we should know.
Valved Reflux, 3"x54" Bok 'mini', 2 liebig based pots and the 'Blockhead' 60K btu propane heat
User avatar
Hawke
Master Distiller
 
Posts: 2471
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 1:39 am

Re: VM Project

Postby HookLine » Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:55 pm

Oooh, that's real nice. Good to see a man take pride in his work.
Be safe.
Be discreet.
And have fun.
User avatar
HookLine
Master Distiller
 
Posts: 5637
Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 8:38 am
Location: OzLand

Re: VM Project

Postby plonker » Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:48 am

Beautiful stuff.. wish my work was that good..

Its like... copper porn... :mrgreen:
plonker
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 400
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 5:17 am
Location: West Oz

Re: VM Project

Postby rad14701 » Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:50 pm

Darn nice work there...
User avatar
rad14701
Master Distiller
 
Posts: 20871
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:46 pm
Location: New York, USA

Re: VM Project

Postby Godstilla » Thu Aug 13, 2009 7:47 am

That's some damn fine work NM! I hope the guy reworking my rig is half as talented as you are. :mrgreen: lol
User avatar
Godstilla
Swill Maker
 
Posts: 251
Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 3:56 pm
Location: FROM MY COLD DEAD HANDS

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:21 am

thanks for all the compliments guys .. its much appreciated especially coming from you guys ... :D I will pass that along to the guy doing that work for ya Godstilla ....lol :wink:
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby manu de hanoi » Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:23 am

impressive
User avatar
manu de hanoi
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 750
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2007 9:06 am

Re: VM Project

Postby gtig » Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:38 pm

I swear to god I am not trolling... but what does VM stand for? I googled it first and found nothing... the only thing I can come up with is "Valve Modification"... or "vapor mast"... neither seem good enough to explain what this is.

That being asked... it looks dead sexy... what is the black stuff hiding all the pretty copper?

LOVE the case it goes in... really cool... in fact I see one of these in my future.

thanks.

Greg/GTIG
User avatar
gtig
Novice
 
Posts: 38
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2009 2:24 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: VM Project

Postby HookLine » Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:09 pm

VM = vapour management
LM = liquid management
CM = cooling management
PM = power management

Did you try using the site specific Google search? Link at the top of the page. Also see this thread.

viewtopic.php?f=35&t=10331
Be safe.
Be discreet.
And have fun.
User avatar
HookLine
Master Distiller
 
Posts: 5637
Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 8:38 am
Location: OzLand

Foreshot removal

Postby ImaDKrook » Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:56 pm

Postby Hawke » Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:49 am
Very nice work.
I see you added the slant plates for foreshot removal.



Help me understand. In relation to the plates and valves. :?:

Krook
User avatar
ImaDKrook
Novice
 
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2009 5:44 am

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Mon Sep 07, 2009 2:35 pm

With the gate valve in the closed position the slanted plates work just as a LM rig would with everything being taken off from the smaller (brass Valve) ..Im just using Harry' cross flow condenser idea (slight variation )..for the condenser..

The procedure in operating the rig is to use the LM (liquid management ) operation to remove the foreshots and heads which is collected from the smaller brass valve .. once they are removed , then you can close the valve and switch to the Vapor management side using the SS Gate valve

To remove to hearts which should not have any contamination from the fores and heads . the rig is still sending liquid down the packing during this time ( it overflows on the bottom plate because the valve is closed) and you open the gate to remove a percentage of the vapor which is condensed in the second (liebig) condenser ..


edit Oh yeah I almost forgot the black stuff hiding the copper is insulation under several rolls of electrical tape. not only does it insulate it protects from dents and bruises as well.


here is the adapter I use to connect to keg with also .
Attachments
connector.jpg
connector.jpg (17.35 KiB) Viewed 22568 times
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Double checking

Postby ImaDKrook » Mon Sep 07, 2009 5:40 pm

[quote="new_moonshiner"]With the gate valve in the closed position the slanted plates work just as a LM rig would with everything being taken off from the smaller (brass Valve) This I understand.

The procedure in operating the rig is to use the LM (liquid management ) operation to remove the foreshots and heads which is collected from the smaller brass valve .. once they are removed , then you can close the valve and switch to the Vapor management side using the SS Gate valve Here is my point of confusion. There is no slant plate here. :?: You are taking off Vapor? Then Condensing with Liebig.

To remove to hearts which should not have any contamination from the fores and heads . the rig is still sending liquid down the packing during this time ( it overflows on the bottom plate because the valve is closed) Understand this also and you open the gate to remove a percentage of the vapor which is condensed in the second (liebig) condenser .. Here is the Product/heart cut as a vapor condensed in the Liebig Then onto a jug. I was thinking you were taking off a liquid and was as confused as could be.

Sorry to beat it to death but I wanted to be sure I understood completely.
User avatar
ImaDKrook
Novice
 
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2009 5:44 am

Re: Double checking

Postby new_moonshiner » Mon Sep 07, 2009 5:51 pm

ImaDKrook wrote:
new_moonshiner wrote:With the gate valve in the closed position the slanted plates work just as a LM rig would with everything being taken off from the smaller (brass Valve) This I understand.

The procedure in operating the rig is to use the LM (liquid management ) operation to remove the foreshots and heads which is collected from the smaller brass valve .. once they are removed , then you can close the valve and switch to the Vapor management side using the SS Gate valve Here is my point of confusion. There is no slant plate here. :?: You are taking off Vapor? Then Condensing with Liebig.

To remove to hearts which should not have any contamination from the fores and heads . the rig is still sending liquid down the packing during this time ( it overflows on the bottom plate because the valve is closed) Understand this also and you open the gate to remove a percentage of the vapor which is condensed in the second (liebig) condenser .. Here is the Product/heart cut as a vapor condensed in the Liebig Then onto a jug. I was thinking you were taking off a liquid and was as confused as could be.

Sorry to beat it to death but I wanted to be sure I understood completely.





The procedure in operating the rig is to use the LM (liquid management ) operation to remove the foreshots and heads which is collected from the smaller brass valve .. once they are removed , then you can close the valve and switch to the Vapor management side using the SS Gate valve Here is my point of confusion. There is no slant plate here. :?: You are taking off Vapor? Then Condensing with Liebig.
Answer"
yes closing the small valve )brass one) and opening the gate way SS large one .. and then using the second condenser (liebig) to condense the vapor.



To remove to hearts which should not have any contamination from the fores and heads . the rig is still sending liquid down the packing during this time ( it overflows on the bottom plate because the valve is closed) Understand this also and you open the gate to remove a percentage of the vapor which is condensed in the second (liebig) condenser .. Here is the Product/heart cut as a vapor condensed in the Liebig Then onto a jug. I was thinking you were taking off a liquid and was as confused as could be.
Answer:
I do take off and remove the liquid but its done with the small brass valve this is the one with the slant pate . look closely at the pic you should see the plates outline .. when i finished taking off what i want with the small valve I close it off completely .. not used anymore during the run .. then everything from here on out goes through the liebg

I should have mentioned that I have two slanted plates reason being I have liquid coming down from both sides of the condenser with the TEE design ..
Last edited by new_moonshiner on Mon Sep 07, 2009 5:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby ImaDKrook » Mon Sep 07, 2009 5:55 pm

I see one slant plate for thermometer well. The well is underneath the slant plate. There is also a second slant plate for the takeoff. This would be a liquid. All cuts as a liquid. This is a different design than what you are doing? If so which is best?

I am finally understanding you were taking off as a vapor. Initially I was convinced you were taking of as a liquid. I could clearly see there are two plates.... Read your edit above and don't feel so dumb now... ok still just a little.

Sorry to nag but I want my equipment to be correct. :oops:

Krook

Photo borrowed from http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=5829
Attachments
fullhead.jpg
User avatar
ImaDKrook
Novice
 
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2009 5:44 am

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Mon Sep 07, 2009 6:17 pm

the condenser at the top condenses the alcohol vapor, any condensed vapors (liquid alcohol) that drops from the coil (top condenser) hits on the first plate forcing it onto the second plate .. any liquid that misses the first plate will hit onto the second plate .. this is where I was talking about a long drop higher the drop the more its going to splash .. everything ends up on the bottom plate . you want a little space between the plates .. closer they are the more restriction for the vapor to make its way to the cold condenser coil. you are creating ..

Then either you take off small drops at a time ( more reading required ) or leave the valve closed and once it fills up the the notch in the plate it drips onto the packing ...( full reflux ) everything goes onto the packing . nothing being taken off .

now which design ? I cant answer that. its what you like. most of us think we have the best design that we could have for the most part .. but in the end we get the same result . the pic that you just posted will be simpler to build than the rig I posted by far .. have a look at those links to Bokakobs designs and maybe get some better ideas of what would suit you and your skill level...
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby ibfestus » Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:12 am

WOW!!! That is beautiful. I wish I had the patience and skill to duplicate your project... But hey, I ain't dead yet!! :P
ibfestus
Site Donor
Site Donor
 
Posts: 94
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:48 pm

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:25 pm

patience was key on that project for sure ..
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby guillermo » Wed Sep 09, 2009 4:13 am

Wow, what a nice job. Two questions: what solder and/or brazing rod, flux did you use for this build? Also, just out of curiosity, why did you opt for the slant plates instead of the dam in Harry's design?
Your system of placing the round plates with the 21 holes slightly inside the tube makes a lot of sense because when you solder on the end caps, there's no chance of melting the solder on the inside.
Great work!
guillermo
Novice
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:42 pm

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:09 am

All of the solder joints were made with sil-fos 15 percent silver refrigeration solder as we call it .. WITH the exception of the two caps that went on the ends ..those were made with soft lead free solder .

My thinking was it would be so much easier to remove the soft solder if I had problems that it would be the hard solder .. also using the soft solder for the caps you are not running the risk of having the plates loosen and leak...


One of the thoughts on the plates instead of the dam, was I like the idea of being able to drop everything out of the well if need be , the valve is in the lowest possible point in the well.. For me the plates were easier to solder than the dam method would have been .. but we all have different thoughts when it comes to this stuff.


I would like to thank Harry again for sharing his idea on this design , and some other suggestions as well with the liebig . I for one respect people that have a genuine interest in developing new ideas and better ways of doing things when it comes to this hobby/art. ( and sharing them for free )



Opposed to some looking to make bucks $$ or passing things off like its Government top secret information,
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby guillermo » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:47 am

Did you use the silfos without any flux? Also for the spaces on the 2" discs around the 21 tubes, what size silfos 15 did you find best, .125 or .062? I just completed brazing 3" discs for a tube and shell condenser using a flux coated brazing rod, Safety-Silv 45 which is also very expensive. Seeing your results with silfos, I think I'll try it on future projects because your results look so nice and because of price.
Thanks for the information!
Regards,
Guillermo
guillermo
Novice
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:42 pm

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Wed Sep 09, 2009 2:10 pm

no flux at all with the silfos. I have used the sticks you are talking about that have the flux on the sticks orange and pink colors I think .. But in this case I found the plain 15 percent rods worked fine .. the 45% solder I have used as well , not a good application for this project .. only flux that i used was on the soft solder connection...

lso something to keep in mind when soldering all those tubes together to the plates is, try to solder the plate as one .. not a small sharp flame but something like a turbo torch , once you get the solder flowing it will flow to the joints .. keep the flame moving around all the time and all over the plate, then when you get ready to solder the plate in place apply heat from the outside , with the solder stick on the opposite side ..
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Re: VM Project

Postby guillermo » Fri Sep 11, 2009 4:04 am

Thanks for the advice. I'll get some silfos. I had solder problems on the crossflow I built a few months ago and ended up brazing on the endcaps which were butted to the 2" disks. I put the dam in mine and made the rig modular so I can remove the section with the 1 inch gate valve that goes to the liebig. I mainly use it on a short column (about 1 foot high) for stripping and final runs for rum and whiskey. It works great and I too would like to thank Harry again for sharing his design.
guillermo
Novice
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:42 pm

Re: VM Project

Postby olddog » Fri Sep 11, 2009 10:51 pm

I love copper porn, fantastic job.
OLD DOG LEARNING NEW TRICKS ......
User avatar
olddog
Master Distiller
 
Posts: 3619
Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2009 6:16 pm
Location: WEST OZ

Re: VM Project

Postby blanikdog » Sat Sep 12, 2009 12:04 am

What a fantastic job and post. I feel quite humbled.

blanik
Simple potstiller. Slow, single run.
(50 litre, propane heated pot still. Coil in bucket condenser - No thermometer, No carbon)
The Reading Lounge AND the Rules We Live By should be compulsory reading

Cumudgeon and loving it.
User avatar
blanikdog
Angel's Share
Angel's Share
 
Posts: 4545
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 11:55 pm
Location: Bullamakanka, Oztrailya

Re: VM Project

Postby new_moonshiner » Sat Sep 12, 2009 5:17 am

thank you for the kind comments guys, I look at it as a project as something that most here could build without much of a problem IF they were willing to sacrifice the time and had the patience . I was pleased with the end result, But if I did another it would be a little better as would another one after that .. its just the way I do things .. being whatever task I have at hand ..

I guess Im never 100 percent satisfied with much of anything I do , But it keeps me keeping on to do better ...
Good Day .. :D

NM
new_moonshiner
Trainee
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:15 am

Next

Return to Column Builds



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest