First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Many like to post about a first successful ferment (or first all grain mash), or first still built/bought or first good run of the still. Tell us about all of these great times here.
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dunderstruck
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First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by dunderstruck »

First sacrificial run last night, distillate came out at around 80 degrees celsius - is this normal? I’ve done a lot of searching and reading and can only find stuff that refers to the vapour or boiler temperature, not the temperature of the actual liquid output.

I used 18 ish litres of TPW that I didn’t put much effort into as it was sacrificial, I didn’t note the OG but the FG was 1.030 :roll: It had been fermenting for a week and a half and I was impatient so ran it anyway, just expected less yield. 2200 watt element on 50 litre pot still, power controller hasn’t arrived yet so just ran it full bore all the way. Heated up quicker than I expected, started collecting within 20 minutes. Water was running through the liebig at around 1 litre per minute. I’m in the tropics running bore water from a tank so ambient temperature of the water is around 30 degrees C. I noticed how hot the distillate was coming out so increased the water rate, until I got to around 4 litres a minute, managed to get the temperature of the distillate down to around 50 degrees C. Shut it off after two hours when I thought I got down to approx 20%. I had to wait until it cooled down today to confirm ABV as I couldn’t find a correction for the alcometer that goes higher than 50 degrees C! When I checked today, after the 200ml fores, I got around 1.5 litres starting at just 40% and dropping to 10% :problem:

Considering everything I did wrong, I’m amazed anything came out at all :lol:
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jonnys_spirit
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by jonnys_spirit »

Do you have a pic of your setup?

More water, more length on the liebig, cooler water = more cooling.

Stripping runs are generally done hard and fast but the controller will help when you want to collect foreshots low and slow as well as with the spirit run and if you need to address any pukes.

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Demy
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by Demy »

As mentioned, stripping is fast (therefore more heating) but that temperature in my opinion is not good. I have to turn down the power (less heating power) or review the condenser.
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Windy City
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by Windy City »

I looked at your rig on your other post.
The liebig seems small and your incoming water is warm.
I would replace the existing liebig with a longer one or even better a shotgun condenser. The existing condenser is also stainless steel which does not transfer heat as well. This is normally not a problem but with the short length and the warm inlet water it is not able to knock down the heat without running huge amounts of water. You could try putting very loose copper mesh in the liebig to help transfer heat. Make sure that it is not tight and you can blow through it with NO restriction.
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kimbodious
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by kimbodious »

Gday, from FNQ. I hear what you are saying about using recirculated water for cooling that is already warm because of where you live. Increased water flow is your answer to warm distillate. Once you get a power controller you’ll get away with using less cooling if you are sending up less vapour. Warm distillate on its own is not a bad thing unless a) it is so warm you are also losing vapour or b) you are trying to measure ABV during a run.

If that was my still, I’d replace the condenser with a much longer 3/4” over 1/2” copper liebig. You’d end up with a beaut pot still then!
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dunderstruck
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by dunderstruck »

Windy City wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:23 am I looked at your rig on your other post.
The liebig seems small and your incoming water is warm.
I would replace the existing liebig with a longer one or even better a shotgun condenser. The existing condenser is also stainless steel which does not transfer heat as well. This is normally not a problem but with the short length and the warm inlet water it is not able to knock down the heat without running huge amounts of water. You could try putting very loose copper mesh in the liebig to help transfer heat. Make sure that it is not tight and you can blow through it with NO restriction.
Good Luck
Legend! I packed the end of the condenser with just over a foot of copper mesh, this has dropped the output temp to about 45 celsius when running full 2200W. I also got the power controller the other day so I’ve been playing with that and when running at 50% or so I get 2-3 drips a second and the distillate comes out at about 30 celsius :ebiggrin:

Would you recommend using the packing for stripping and spirit runs? Or could I remove the packing to run it faster for stripping?
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Windy City
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by Windy City »

I am glad it worked for you.
When I ran a liebig I would only remove the mesh periodically to clean it, otherwise it was always in the condenser regardless of stripping or spirit run.
I would like to make sure that you put the copper mesh in there very loosely.
If you were to plug your outlet bad things will happen.

Good Luck Stay Safe
The liver is evil and must be punished
Cranky"s spoon feeding for new and novice distillers
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 15&t=52975
dunderstruck
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by dunderstruck »

kimbodious wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 1:00 pm Gday, from FNQ. I hear what you are saying about using recirculated water for cooling that is already warm because of where you live. Increased water flow is your answer to warm distillate. Once you get a power controller you’ll get away with using less cooling if you are sending up less vapour. Warm distillate on its own is not a bad thing unless a) it is so warm you are also losing vapour or b) you are trying to measure ABV during a run.

If that was my still, I’d replace the condenser with a much longer 3/4” over 1/2” copper liebig. You’d end up with a beaut pot still then!
How good’s FNQ, I lived in the Daintree for a few months, it’s a magic spot!

I might try increasing the water rate further. I’ve been trying to be conservative cos I hate waste but the farm I’m on has a pretty decent size bore so I might as well use it. It’s also got a few big leaks in the irrigation that make what I’m “wasting” seem insignificant.

Definitely reckon I’ll be making my own copper condenser at some point too! Just trying to figure out the basics on this setup before I start yet another project...
dunderstruck
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by dunderstruck »

Windy City wrote: Tue Oct 06, 2020 4:45 am I am glad it worked for you.
When I ran a liebig I would only remove the mesh periodically to clean it, otherwise it was always in the condenser regardless of stripping or spirit run.
I would like to make sure that you put the copper mesh in there very loosely.
If you were to plug your outlet bad things will happen.

Good Luck Stay Safe
Awesome I’ll leave it in then.

It’s loose as! Made sure I could still breath through it before I put it all together. When I was rinsing at the end of the run I left the packing in and tried to back flush it, but the spray attachment on the hose sent it up the condenser, round the elbow and flying out the other end :lol:
zapata
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by zapata »

That sounds perfectly loose to me, good test!
dunderstruck
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Re: First sacrificial run - hot distillate?

Post by dunderstruck »

Just a little follow up, in case anyone stumbles upon this in the future via a search - I have since been advised that packing a condenser is extremely dangerous. See here for more info: viewtopic.php?f=87&t=81798

While initially I believed this to be the solution to the problem, I think after trying it for a few runs and then trying it without, packing the condenser gives very little gain, especially considering the risk.

Instead, as others suggested, I would recommend getting a controller and turning the power down, increasing water flow and/or getting a more efficient condenser.
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