First AG on the grain fermentation
Moderator: Site Moderator
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
First AG on the grain fermentation
23 lbs flaked corn
6 lbs of flaked wheat
3.5 lbs 2 row
3 lbs flaked rice
14 gallons of good ole h2o
A good long step mash yelled 1.075
Yeah I was surprised too.
It's been bubbling away for two days and its dropped 25 points... whow Nelly
6 lbs of flaked wheat
3.5 lbs 2 row
3 lbs flaked rice
14 gallons of good ole h2o
A good long step mash yelled 1.075
Yeah I was surprised too.
It's been bubbling away for two days and its dropped 25 points... whow Nelly
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
Friday and its still bubbling away at 1.020 on the proof & trail.
Im searching for nuggets for on the grain stripping runs.
Im searching for nuggets for on the grain stripping runs.
- frunobulax
- Site Donor
- Posts: 634
- Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:23 pm
- Location: Sunny N.J.
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
That must be a gloppy mess! Lol Are you going to try to strain it?
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
No , Im planning on running it on the grain in my jacked boiler. I have an agitator .
Ive been reading up on it but it seems like most of the threads break down arguments with one side saying its a mistake, yeast will cause off flavors, better have enough copper... the other side saying it's how the lion's share of whiskey is made in the US.
Im going to try it and see for myself. Ill have enough to charge my boiler twice so Im planning on two stripping runs. the first will be not as aggressive and Im planning on collecting and discarding foreshots on both of the strips. I'm thinking of making cuts during the strip so I can evaluate what's coming off as low wines but combining them all after prior to a spirit run.
As this is my first total on grain experience, it really is more of as learning experience. I checked it this morning and its still alive and down to 1.010. it is slowing down but still kicking with a PH of 3.99 the temp was 79F, the yeast starter was a mixture of red star champagne and levine e1118 so I plugged in a second heating band as its on the low side for those yeasties.
Ive been reading up on it but it seems like most of the threads break down arguments with one side saying its a mistake, yeast will cause off flavors, better have enough copper... the other side saying it's how the lion's share of whiskey is made in the US.
Im going to try it and see for myself. Ill have enough to charge my boiler twice so Im planning on two stripping runs. the first will be not as aggressive and Im planning on collecting and discarding foreshots on both of the strips. I'm thinking of making cuts during the strip so I can evaluate what's coming off as low wines but combining them all after prior to a spirit run.
As this is my first total on grain experience, it really is more of as learning experience. I checked it this morning and its still alive and down to 1.010. it is slowing down but still kicking with a PH of 3.99 the temp was 79F, the yeast starter was a mixture of red star champagne and levine e1118 so I plugged in a second heating band as its on the low side for those yeasties.
- frunobulax
- Site Donor
- Posts: 634
- Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:23 pm
- Location: Sunny N.J.
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
Nice. That sounds like a good plan, and a jacketed boiler is definitely the way to go.
Champagne yeast may take you under 1.010,and I'm not sure about the flavor profile , I think Bakers yeast or a beer yeast is just as well.
You may get an odor from the yeast right off the still, but I find it dissipates after airing it out overnight.
I'm interested in how your run goes. Good luck!
Champagne yeast may take you under 1.010,and I'm not sure about the flavor profile , I think Bakers yeast or a beer yeast is just as well.
You may get an odor from the yeast right off the still, but I find it dissipates after airing it out overnight.
I'm interested in how your run goes. Good luck!
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
Well its done or Im calling it done. the last 3 days it was still off gassing not as vigorously of course but definitely alive. The odd thing was the last 4 dailly gravity readings were 1.010 . Today it's 1.000 .
I wonder since all the grain was in there (corn, wheat, barley and rice. was it still converting starches. The IG was 1.075 but I didn't calculate what my IG should be as I was using flaked corn and wheat and I don't know how it stands up to cracked grains.
Saturday Ill split it into two and strip.
Here's a question, Im going to run this on the grain also so I have a 2" drain on the conical, should I resuspend the trub so that it is more evenly distributed between the stripping runs?
I wonder since all the grain was in there (corn, wheat, barley and rice. was it still converting starches. The IG was 1.075 but I didn't calculate what my IG should be as I was using flaked corn and wheat and I don't know how it stands up to cracked grains.
Saturday Ill split it into two and strip.
Here's a question, Im going to run this on the grain also so I have a 2" drain on the conical, should I resuspend the trub so that it is more evenly distributed between the stripping runs?
- TimothyChurch
- Novice
- Posts: 56
- Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:24 pm
- Location: Texas!
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
With the on grain fermentation, the suspended solids can throw off the reading quite a bit. Once they fall out of suspension, your reading will drop.
If you have a conical, you can go ahead and pull off the trub. Then mix everything back up and drain it over. The main reason that large distilleries just transfer everything over is it would be much too difficult to try and separate. They also have copper baffles they have to replace on a regular basis due to the amount of yeast & sulfur! Since I don't have a drain, I typically siphon off the liquid and use a bucket to scoop out the grains until I get to the compacted yeast at the bottom. That way I can run everything on the grain but minimize the amount of yeast in the still.
If you have a conical, you can go ahead and pull off the trub. Then mix everything back up and drain it over. The main reason that large distilleries just transfer everything over is it would be much too difficult to try and separate. They also have copper baffles they have to replace on a regular basis due to the amount of yeast & sulfur! Since I don't have a drain, I typically siphon off the liquid and use a bucket to scoop out the grains until I get to the compacted yeast at the bottom. That way I can run everything on the grain but minimize the amount of yeast in the still.
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
Interesting, I didn't know the yeast would fall out of solution first so it would be on the bottom
- frunobulax
- Site Donor
- Posts: 634
- Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:23 pm
- Location: Sunny N.J.
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
That's why they use conicals for beer, so the yeast can be drawn off the bottom, and leave clean beer.Triplequad wrote: ↑Thu Jan 07, 2021 10:21 am Interesting, I didn't know the yeast would fall out of solution first so it would be on the bottom
With that grain bill, I don't think the yeast will separate. If it does, drain it off. If it doesn't, Re suspending everything might be a good idea,
so one batch isn't all yeast.
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
whats left post first strip... I may be outta the bucket club
- TimothyChurch
- Novice
- Posts: 56
- Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:24 pm
- Location: Texas!
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
Once you have run with a jacketed still & agitator it truly is hard to ever go back!
Now, all we have to do is find an easy way to transfer the mash-in charge over to the still without having buckets. A fancy flexible impeller pump might be in my future!
How did things taste off the still?
Now, all we have to do is find an easy way to transfer the mash-in charge over to the still without having buckets. A fancy flexible impeller pump might be in my future!
How did things taste off the still?
-
- Master of Distillation
- Posts: 4659
- Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2006 4:48 am
- Location: Northern Victoria, Australia
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
Set up your fermenting on a high stand with a working platform and transfer by gravity?TimothyChurch wrote: ↑Fri Jan 08, 2021 9:04 pm Once you have run with a jacketed still & agitator it truly is hard to ever go back!
Now, all we have to do is find an easy way to transfer the mash-in charge over to the still without having buckets. A fancy flexible impeller pump might be in my future!
How did things taste off the still?
I saw a winery once with all their fermentation vats raised high...
Geoff
The Baker
- TimothyChurch
- Novice
- Posts: 56
- Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:24 pm
- Location: Texas!
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
The issue becomes getting the fermenter up there. 10 gallons of water plus 20 lbs of grain isn't the lightest thing to lift up higher than my still!The Baker wrote: ↑Fri Jan 08, 2021 9:07 pmSet up your fermenting on a high stand with a working platform and transfer by gravity?TimothyChurch wrote: ↑Fri Jan 08, 2021 9:04 pm Once you have run with a jacketed still & agitator it truly is hard to ever go back!
Now, all we have to do is find an easy way to transfer the mash-in charge over to the still without having buckets. A fancy flexible impeller pump might be in my future!
How did things taste off the still?
I saw a winery once with all their fermentation vats raised high...
Geoff
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
well I Think youre you're right. no problems at all. my second strip you can see how full the boiler is and no problems at all and wow..... CORN big time . Its the Slap your momma of corny goodness. Ill probably do a spirit run this weekend if it continues to impress, I'm going to repeat this several times for my first barrel ageingTimothyChurch wrote: ↑Fri Jan 08, 2021 9:04 pm Once you have run with a jacketed still & agitator it truly is hard to ever go back!
How did things taste off the still?
-
- Master of Distillation
- Posts: 4659
- Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2006 4:48 am
- Location: Northern Victoria, Australia
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
Tim said, 'The issue becomes getting the fermenter up there. 10 gallons of water plus 20 lbs of grain isn't the lightest thing to lift up higher than my still!'
Just kicking this around anyway...
I was thinking of the fermenter being permanently mounted high. With good steps and a good working platform beside it.
Maybe add the water from a hose?
And the grain; four x 5kg in a bucket??
Geoff
Just kicking this around anyway...
I was thinking of the fermenter being permanently mounted high. With good steps and a good working platform beside it.
Maybe add the water from a hose?
And the grain; four x 5kg in a bucket??
Geoff
The Baker
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
I use my bike lift for that. But here's something similar:
https://www.harborfreight.com/500-lbs-c ... 61405.html
I saw a small lifting cart on an online auction recently, but I stupidly forgot about it until after the deadline ended. It would have been perfect for lifting barrels
https://www.harborfreight.com/500-lbs-c ... 61405.html
I saw a small lifting cart on an online auction recently, but I stupidly forgot about it until after the deadline ended. It would have been perfect for lifting barrels
- TimothyChurch
- Novice
- Posts: 56
- Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:24 pm
- Location: Texas!
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
That could actually really come in handy! I'm in the planning stages of an actual distillery and was trying to figure out an efficient way to life barrels for storage. That could work great to minimize lifting.Corsaire wrote: ↑Sat Jan 09, 2021 10:09 am I use my bike lift for that. But here's something similar:
https://www.harborfreight.com/500-lbs-c ... 61405.html
I saw a small lifting cart on an online auction recently, but I stupidly forgot about it until after the deadline ended. It would have been perfect for lifting barrels
For the fermenter, how would you transfer with grain in? I guess just put a 2" sanitary valve so it doesn't clog.
But I digress since I'm hijacking the thread.
@Triplequad Was there a photo from that second run? I didn't see it attached.
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
Just this one of the runTimothyChurch wrote: ↑Sat Jan 09, 2021 9:20 pm
@Triplequad Was there a photo from that second run? I didn't see it attached.
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: First AG on the grain fermentation
But I did start another. Mash
-
- Novice
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:44 pm
- Location: Florida