Day of Firsts

Many like to post about a first successful ferment (or first all grain mash), or first still built/bought or first good run of the still. Tell us about all of these great times here.
Pics are VERY welcome, we drool over pretty copper 8)

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Stonecutter
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Day of Firsts

Post by Stonecutter »

First time making a sour mash. First time using oats. My goal is to determine what, if any, flavor profile will be created by putting apple brandy backset in a whiskey mash. I used “Quaker” quick oats. Thank you still_stirrin for the information that you have provided here in the HD regarding oats! :wave: I use a “Brewers Edge Mash and Boil” no bag.
6 gallons of water
2.5 lbs oats in at 225 F strike temp; stir stir stir stir...keep stirring.
Temp hits 150F added 1/4 tsp alpha amylase and about an 1/8 tsp of citric acid.
Once temp hit 155; Added the rest of cereal grains in order.
3.5 lbs malted Barley
3.5 lbs flaked Corn
2.5 lbs malted rye
After about an hour check for conversion
Sparge to 6 gallons
OG 1.056
Cool to 85F with copper wort chiller.
Fermenter contains just shy of 2 gallons of backset.
Add mash to bring contents up to 6 gallons.
Pitch yeast (US-05)
Hopefully there are enough oats in there to give some decent mouthfeel and “creaminess”. I have my doubts about the backset but we’ll see.
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subbrew
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by subbrew »

Did you check ph? 2 gallons of backset on a 6 gal ferment is 33%. Seems that might really crash the ph.

Also I assume you 225 F is an error since you would need pressure to get water to that temp.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Bushman »

Sounds good, I agree with subbrew my strike temp is around 160 F and for backseat I shoot for no more than 25%. Let us know how it goes!
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by still_stirrin »

For backset, I use 1 quart per 5 gallons (approximately 5%) of mash in my 5-grain bourbon. It’s just enough to lower the pH slightly (overkill is not always better), to get the mash pH down to where the gluco-amylase enzymes work best.

Also, keep in mind that the yeast will produce acids during fermentation, so the pH will naturally fall by itself.
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Re: Day of Firsts

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Typo. Strike temperature was 125F to get a protein rest going for the oats. I just checked the fermenter and it has slowed a little. My ph meter took a shit on me so I went off of past batches regarding my ph levels. Tap water comes out at 7.2 and for the amount of citric acid I put in I usually see a PH level of around 6.2 and then I adjust to 5.4-5.6 before pitching the yeast. I’ll keep an eye on the useless airlock. The NDRL suggests using calcium carbonate but I don’t have any of that on hand and I normally don’t do stripping runs. I’ll probably end up tossing a pinch of baking soda in there tomorrow if it slows any further.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Stonecutter »

SS what ph do you aim for before adding the backset?
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by still_stirrin »

Stonecutter wrote: Mon May 17, 2021 4:18 pm SS what ph do you aim for before adding the backset?
The mash will get me down to 5.0 to 5.2 pH. With the backset, It’ll come down to 4.6 to 4.8 depending on how sour the backset is. I use the backset that I “can” from a previous strip of the Special K bourbon. And it is typically around 3.0 to 3.5 pH.

I gelatinize the corn in the oven and then add it to the mash tun. Then, I adjust the temperature with cool water to bring it down to the strike temperature for all the other grains. Next, I dough-in the other grains and finally adjust the temperature to where I want to mash (148*-150*F), and then I mix in the backset. Finally, when it’s been stirred good, I’ll add my gluco enzymes.

This process has been basic and stable for me for several batches. It is predictable now.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Stonecutter »

The fermentation activity stopped at 1.002-1.004. I tried to pitch some 1118 into it to get it to finish dry but it didn’t take. I also added about 0.25 tsp of baking soda when I noticed activity slowing on day 3. Will that unconverted sugar create any problems when I run it? It’s got a good smell with a faint apple aroma to it. I’m actually pretty happy with how well the fermentation went despite my best attempt at sabotage :roll: I did some looking around the forums about running an “unfinished” ferment but didn’t have much luck. Any feedback is much appreciated.
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Re: Day of Firsts

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Stonecutter wrote: Mon May 24, 2021 7:22 pm The fermentation activity stopped at 1.002-1.004. I tried to pitch some 1118 into it to get it to finish dry but it didn’t take. I also added about 0.25 tsp of baking soda when I noticed activity slowing on day 3. Will that unconverted sugar create any problems when I run it? It’s got a good smell with a faint apple aroma to it. I’m actually pretty happy with how well the fermentation went despite my best attempt at sabotage :roll: I did some looking around the forums about running an “unfinished” ferment but didn’t have much luck. Any feedback is much appreciated.
You're there. You said what it smells like, but how does it taste?
If it's sour, run it. It's likely not going any lower. I'd run my striping run with a very slow heat up to avoid a puke.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Stonecutter »

Taste was like a mildly sour kind of regular distillers beer. The apple was definitely more of an aromatic rather than a taste. After clearing, I ended up just shy of 5 gallons Ran it last night, and let it breath for about 16 hours. The taste right now is devoid of any apple flavor. The overall taste of the spirit is a honey sort of bread flavor. The one thing my wife and I both agree on is that the OATS really added mouthfeel and a smoothness to the spirit. VERY excited to see what it grows up to be. The thing that was disappointing is that I only collected about 1 liter of 60%. I usually get double that. I’m not sure what happened?? Maybe it’s due to a low volume or unconverted sugars or both. In the end I’m calling this experiment for making a sour mash with oats a success.
Freedom had been hunted round the globe; reason was considered as rebellion; and the slavery of fear had made men afraid to think. But such is the irresistible nature of truth, that all it asks, and all it wants, is the liberty of appearing.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Deplorable »

Thats why I make 25 gallon ferments. I always get 5 to 6 quarts after cuts. My cabinets are filling up quick with jugs.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Stonecutter »

This exact subject was brought up in Jimbo’s post about keeping the ABV down. Someone mentioned that a lot of people are chasing higher OG readings because of their small setups meant for beer. I’m definitely beating my head against the wall trying to build supply. A larger pot and fermenter are on the list for this year for sure.
Freedom had been hunted round the globe; reason was considered as rebellion; and the slavery of fear had made men afraid to think. But such is the irresistible nature of truth, that all it asks, and all it wants, is the liberty of appearing.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Deplorable »

Stonecutter wrote: Sat May 29, 2021 12:30 pm This exact subject was brought up in Jimbo’s post about keeping the ABV down. Someone mentioned that a lot of people are chasing higher OG readings because of their small setups meant for beer. I’m definitely beating my head against the wall trying to build supply. A larger pot and fermenter are on the list for this year for sure.
What size is your still boiler again?
If you're making whiskey, just use SCDs Easy Large Batch Mashing process. Easy Peasy. I can start a 25 gallon corn based mash at 7am, and pitch yeast before I go to bed, or let the temps fall on their own and pitch in the morning.
Single Malts are stupid easy in large batches. Like, under 5 hours from starting to mill the malts, to pitching yeast.
Ferment on grain, and squeeze the spent grains after its done. Let the beer clear for a week or so and run it. Hell run it milky if you're on gas, but I still like to let it clear out all the way before I run it.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Stonecutter »

:shock: Get out of my head man! I was just re-reading that thread. My current boiler is a mere 8 gallons but...I do have a 26 gallon milk can on order for later this year. I was thinking about dropping major cash and getting a SPIKE set up but I’m liking the frugality of SCD’s method more and more. I mean why not use your boiler?? :think: It just makes sense.
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Re: Day of Firsts

Post by Deplorable »

HAHAHA!! Here's something to think about with a 26 gallon boiler and his method;
You can't practically elevate a 26 gallon boiler above the level of the fermenter/mash vessel to drain boiling water onto the grains (or maybe you can). What does an empty 26 gallon can weigh before you put in 210 pound of water? Maybe 300# isn't out of the realm of possibility on a workbench.
You'll either be pumping through a hose, or filling buckets and dumping it in. This is what I did for my first few batches of single malt and a 13 gallon milk can. Then I got smarter and put a tile under my turkey burner on top of my work bench and drained into the barrel. Then I went electric internal element. (best single improvement in my process)
A 26 gallon milk boiler would be nice to strip a mash in one run...
Would you then run the 5 to 6 gallons of low wines in your 8 gallon still, or are you thinking of a plated column and just running once through 3 or 4 plates?
If I went to a 26 gallon still, Id move to a plated column and keep my CCVM rig and 13 gallon milk can for neutrals and feints runs.
Hmmm a retirement gift to myself in a couple of years :think:
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Re: Day of Firsts

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I’ve purchased and now am trying to gear up for a 4” plated column. Electric heating element. The rig comes with 4 perforated plates. It’s the milehi 26 gallon copper plated column set up. I turn wrenches and weld for a living and a diy type guy but the setup from milehi is beautiful and well worth the cash in my mind. You guys who make your own stills have nothing but respect from me, VERY IMPRESSED with some of the craftsmanship here. I’m just taking a short cut. My plan is to do whiskey and brandy runs one and done as well as neutrals for gins and such to then put into the 8 gallon. I also have a 3 gallon boiler for further refinement and experimentation. The riser for the 8 gallon pot still is interchangeable with the 3 gallon boiler. My order won’t be ready till later this year and in the meantime I figure I can get some bigger mashing and fermenting equipment to do stripping runs in my current boilers. I’m not opposed to using pumps and it’s worth the wait to try and make the boiler work as a mashing vessel and save some dough.
Freedom had been hunted round the globe; reason was considered as rebellion; and the slavery of fear had made men afraid to think. But such is the irresistible nature of truth, that all it asks, and all it wants, is the liberty of appearing.
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Re: Day of Firsts

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Stonecutter wrote: Sat May 29, 2021 11:31 amThe thing that was disappointing is that I only collected about 1 liter of 60%. I usually get double that. I’m not sure what happened?? Maybe it’s due to a low volume or unconverted sugars or both. In the end I’m calling this experiment for making a sour mash with oats a success.
Just came to the realization that 1.5 gallons of my mash was backset devoid of any substantial amount of alcohol this backset also watered down any OG reading I had taken before adding my mash liquid to the fermenter and backset, clearly a mental error on my part not to check my OG after adding backset. All this along with the natural losses incurred by flocculation and it’s no wonder I had a low yield. :crazy:
Freedom had been hunted round the globe; reason was considered as rebellion; and the slavery of fear had made men afraid to think. But such is the irresistible nature of truth, that all it asks, and all it wants, is the liberty of appearing.
-Thomas Paine
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