Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

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Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Thu Aug 24, 2017 11:44 am

Finally today I have received my mile-hi boiler, it is beautiful I must say, except 1 thing the milk can lid gasket is silicone and it is against the rules here so I respect that and want to change, the lid gets fixed with a clamp that goes around the lid, the thickness of this silicone gasket is 4mm if I do not put the gasket and clamp it down, it starts to wiggle, so it looks like there has to be a 4 mm thick gasket to seal the lid to the boiler, so after researching and trying to find a solution all I get is the everlasting gasket, but what I really want is to find a ptfe gasket that sits here, how everyone is solving this problem ?
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby still_stirrin » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:29 pm

Get a sheet of teflon (http://www.eplastics.com/Plastic/ptfe_s ... -060X12X12) and a really sharp knife. Scribe the outer diameter and inner diameter and cut it out real slowly. It can be done....
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby shadylane » Thu Aug 24, 2017 1:15 pm

Another option would be to wrap the silicone gasket with PTFE tape
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby Truckinbutch » Thu Aug 24, 2017 2:43 pm

Two good suggestions already .
I made an everlasting gasket for my boiler last December . It hasn't been removed since then and has performed beautifully .
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby RedwoodHillBilly » Thu Aug 24, 2017 3:06 pm

You could use expanded foam PTFE. I've used this on a couple of different sized vessels. They come in different widths. Here are a couple of amazon links.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00P7STHI6
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00K19XI6S
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby jedneck » Thu Aug 24, 2017 3:47 pm

Pretty sure a 8" triclamp gaskets fits. They can be bought in pfte
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby RedwoodHillBilly » Thu Aug 24, 2017 3:59 pm

jedneck wrote:Pretty sure a 8" triclamp gaskets fits. They can be bought in pfte


The problem with tri-clamp gaskets, is that the profile is inverted from what you want. i.e. a center ridge vs. a center depression.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby zapata » Thu Aug 24, 2017 6:12 pm

Ridges can easiy be shaved making a flat gasket like done for keg connections. Of course having a groove would be better.

Im in the process of figuring out a seal for a large boiler and intend to go expanded ptfe. I' ve read some comments though that while compressable, it isnt elastic, meaning it isnt great for the repeated seal/unseal cycles a boiler lid would see as it eventually deforms and does not reseal. Its still the best I can come up with though and intend to try it soonish.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby Opdog » Thu Aug 24, 2017 6:35 pm

SS is on to something.
You can get a 12" x 12" Sheet of virgin PTFE for about $20. Once you cut out the gasket and install it, the heat from the boiler will soften the PTFE a little. If you keep tightening the lid as you heat it up, you will create the channel in the gasket.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby RedwoodHillBilly » Thu Aug 24, 2017 6:46 pm

One good test is worth a thousand expert opinions. To each their own, I have used the solution that I suggested on 4 different boilers. Argue amongst yourselves. I'm out of this thread.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby zapata » Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:13 am

Redwood, not sure if some offending posts have been deleted, but I don't see any arguing now. I for one mentioned I was planning on trying a product very similar to what you linked, in fact I had found them in my searching and am encouraged to specifically see them recomended. I have heard people say there could be problems with repeated use with eptfe, good to hear you don't feel that is a problem. I thank you for sharing your experience.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Fri Aug 25, 2017 7:37 am

Guys,

Thank you very much for all the help, I decided to use a ptfe sheet as recommended did all the calculations, at the end after tring to find out the right thickness I cut out pieces with wood before trying it with a ptfe sheet so the thicness of the gasket should be 6mm and I took it to a friend of mine who has a router he entered the dimensions and cut it out, it worked great it did not jiggle now, it sits perfectly, again thank you very much for all the help, now I think it will take the shape of the lip of the boiler gradually.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby zapata » Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:13 pm

Well done artooks
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:25 pm

I will give exact dimensions so that it will be helpful for people who will want to convert to PTFE for boiler lid gaskets.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby shadylane » Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:52 pm

Fine job :thumbup:
And there's enough scrap to make some smaller PTFE gaskets
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Tue Aug 29, 2017 9:58 pm

Hi Everyone, I have been reading the forum about gasket material and safety, the only materials allowed are dough and PTFE, the only thing I am wondering is as you could see above I purchased a 6mm ptfe sheet and cut out a gasket does all the ptfe same ? Are they suitable for gasket making and hot ethanol vapour ? I mean is there different types of ptfe ? For example I have purchased ptfe gaskets for my triclamps are the sheet teflon the same just asking this question to be on the safe side, I see that some people burn the teflon to see if it is really teflon does this hold true ?
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby zapata » Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:26 pm

ptfe is a specific thing. If you trust your supplier, and they say it's 100% ptfe, that's what it is. So far as I know, ptfe only comes in 2 physical forms "normal" and expanded, both chemically being the same thing. Normal ptfe is sold as plumber's tape, triclamp gaskets, or sheet stock etc. Expanded ptfe is more rarely seen, but I have high hopes for it. You can get different grades of ptfe, but from what I can gather this is more of a certifiable purity type difference. Like you might want to use something in a pharmaceutical plant, but the fda won't let you unless it is certifiably pure. I'm comfortable with consumer grade ptfe being pure enough for our purposes.

I think there are some very similar formulations to ptfe that are *probably of similar use to us, but they rarely seem to come up, and I can think of no cases where they would be needed over the far more available ptfe. I've only run across mention of them in industry and academic literature, and in the very rare forum post. That being said, you should know if you get something other than ptfe, that it is in fact not ptfe, it's not something that is easy to mix up.

I don't know anything about burning ptfe as a test, I simply do business with suppliers I trust.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Wed Aug 30, 2017 3:53 am

Thank you very much for all the info zapata where do you get your PTFE can you mention some trustworthy suppliers please
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby zapata » Wed Aug 30, 2017 5:08 am

Well I've never had the need for ptfe stock, but I'd probably start looking at us plastics. For standard gaskets wherever you get your stilling or brewing supplies is good. Still dragon, brewhaus, brewhardware, glacier tanks etc are some popular ones. Even industry suppliers like grainger or mcmaster carr types. No name amazon or ebay vendors are probably fine too, it all probably comes from the same factory anyway.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby SaltyStaves » Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:18 pm

I think you will have trouble if you allow that gasket to cool when its away from the lid.
Example, you finish your run, you take the lid off your boiler, you separate the gasket from the lid and come back to it later.... The gasket will no longer mate with the lid properly.

Its a bigger problem with larger PTFE gaskets. I can leave my 2" ones laying about and they don't seem to change, but the 4" ones will deform readily. I store mine between two ferrules so that they retain their shape as they cool. Clamping is even better (if you can be bothered), but the weight of the ferrules is generally sufficient. You'll have to come up with something a little more bespoke.

You can heat the gaskets in the oven if you have to get them back into shape. But you don't want to have to do that forever.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:32 am

Hi SaltyStaves,

I have been using it for the last 3 runs, and it is perfectly sealed the reason is my lid and boiler is also being clamped I purchased it from Mile Hi and there is no room for any play whatsoever I am quite happy with the results.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby SaltyStaves » Fri Sep 08, 2017 12:03 pm

I was talking more about separating the gasket from the lid. That is when it can deform unrestricted.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Sat Sep 09, 2017 12:49 am

Hi SaltyStaves, the gasket that I produced is made up after very careful calculations, so there is almost no space in between and on top of that I am using Mile Hi boiler, and the lid is attached via a tri clamp which goes around the lid so it attaches perfectly, and after using it two times the lip of the boiler made a very small form on the gasket where it touches so all in all I am happy with the results.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby SaltyStaves » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:00 am

SaltyStaves wrote:Example, you finish your run, you take the lid off your boiler, you separate the gasket from the lid and come back to it later....


I'm not critiquing your custom made gasket. I'm trying to give you a warning as to how you should maintain it when it is not in use.
If it never leaves the lid, then you will be fine.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby Bushman » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:58 am

Mile hi has been in the business for sometime, I am surprised the gasket sold is not a PTFE gasket.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:02 am

I understand SaltyStaves, I am just sharing my experience, I did not say that you are critiquing, thanks for the pointing out that.
Yes Bushman unfortunately all MileHi Boiler and 2" ferrule gaskets are made of silicon, probably it is a cost issue.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby still_stirrin » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:31 am

Bushman wrote:Mile hi has been in the business for sometime, I am surprised the gasket sold is not a PTFE gasket.

artooks wrote:Yes Bushman, unfortunately all MileHi Boiler and 2" ferrule gaskets are made of silicon, probably it is a cost issue.

Well, perhaps it is an "availability" issue due to manufacturing and the tooling necessary to produce them.

Yet, the cost difference between silicone and PTFE, even in manufacturing, is minimal. Silicone is soft and compressible so it makes a "better" seal for compressed vapors. But the PTFE is more stable, especially in elevated temperature environments. Teflon makes a great bearing surface and is less likely attacked by the environment encountered in the distillery. But silicone is easy to fabricate with injection molds and can be impregnated with structural fibers to make it more durable.

Perhaps, in the eyes of the distributors of stills and equipment, silicone is an "acceptable" material to use. It is our site which frowns upon its use in the vapor path, not the salesmen. We have the jurisdiction to promote a safe hobby while manufacturers only have a commitment to make a profit. If their sales dip because of silicone gaskets, then perhaps they'll change their product line accordingly. But as of now, they can sell a "kit" complete with silicone gaskets AND sell separate (buy them if you like) Teflon gaskets. Not one sale...but two!

I am not a manufacturer nor distributor of distillation equipment, so any attempt at answering the aforementioned question is purely speculation. Perhaps a confrontation with Mile-Hi sales directly would produce a valid answer.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby artooks » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:48 am

Well I asked them about this, they told me that if I wanted to buy PTFE they have it but it costs more, so clearly it is a cost issue, selling the kit with silicone is much cheaper I guess.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby Bushman » Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:47 am

They are one of the company's we recommend as reputable. If this is their practice then I for one when mentioning them will warn potential customers of this fault to their distilling product.
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Re: Need a Boiler Lid PTFE Gasket but cannot find

Postby still_stirrin » Sat Sep 09, 2017 11:05 am

artooks wrote:Well I asked them about this, they told me that if I wanted to buy PTFE they have it but it costs more, so clearly it is a cost issue, selling the kit with silicone is much cheaper I guess.

Actually, it is NOT that much cheaper to them...but they can make a sale which would be MORE profitable...selling a gasket separately! Is "safety" their concern??? Certainly not. But profits are...hence the opportunity to sell you "options".
still_stirrin wrote:Perhaps, in the eyes of the distributors of stills and equipment, silicone is an "acceptable" material to use. It is our site which frowns upon its use in the vapor path, not the salesmen. We have the jurisdiction to promote a safe hobby while manufacturers only have a commitment to make a profit. If their sales dip because of silicone gaskets, then perhaps they'll change their product line accordingly. But as of now, they can sell a "kit" complete with silicone gaskets AND sell separate (buy them if you like) Teflon gaskets. Not one sale...but two!
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